Bus Repower Complete Long Post

[Melbo]

I finally got my repowered MC8 back.  Took a little longer than I thought it would but as with any change out of this type there are gremlins that surface and have to be slayed.  Most of the gremlins were problems that exsisted in the bus before we started on the repower but I was unaware of them. I had an 8V71 and spicer four speed. When I bought the bus it was partially converted and the previous owner delivered it to me. When I got it I took it to Stewart and Stevenson here in Albuquerque and had the oil changed and told them to do anything else that should be normal maintenance. It had oil leaks every where and I was told the radiators were shot.  I had both radiators rebuilt and some of the oil leaks stopped but the bus still ran hot – so hot it would shut down and oil leaked every where and got all over the toad. My fuel mileage was around five mpg. The summer and fall of '07 we put 10 thousand miles on the bus and had a ball being at home where ever we were. The performance of the 8V71 was fine with me the spicer had it's pros and cons but the heat and oil issues were not tolerable with my personality. I looked at new shells and thought about moving everything into a new shell however reskinning, raising the roof  and getting a new paint job would tax my patience and I did not want to be with out a usable coach for that long. So I started looking into repowering the bus I have. I thought about doing it myself but I'm not sure I would have the skill or patience and would have to rent a warehouse to work in so I could do the job in the winter because I want to use the bus in the summer. I talked to more than six companies ( seven is more than six and so is eight ) where people told me they could do my repower or had done them. When you are going to part with that much cash you have to have a certain level of confidence in the people you are going to do business with. After multiple conversations with Gary and Dan at B&B Coachworks in Las Vegas ( His ad says that he specializes in  working on eagles however he felt some sympathy for me having an MCI ) we agreed on an engine (L10 Cummins) and transmission (ZF auto 4 speed) and a price. I added an air throttle, tach, integral steering and exhaust brake as long as they were playing I thought they might like some more toys to play with. They had the bus about 8 weeks four of which were gathering parts and doing the steering.  Having never driven a bus with an automatic transmission I was not sure what to expect. My major concern was driving over the mountains from Las Vegas through Flagstaff and then Albuquerque. We met in Kingman AZ so they could road test the bus before letting me take it. They asked me to drive the bus without the toad for the first couple of miles so I could get a feel for how the bus handled and performed by itself. I drove about ten miles to a truck plaza where we hooked up the toad. The first impression was that the engine was much smoother and a whole lot quieter ( let me make that UNBELIVEABLY quieter ) than the 8V71. I'm not sure how the transmission is supposed to work but if you pushed the R on the panel it shifted and the bus went backward and if you pushed the D the bus went forward push the N and put on the parking brake. I will have to learn how to downshift for the long downhill steeper grades. When we hooked up the toad  and hit the highway I was even more impressed. The whole coach was much quieter and drove much easier than it did before. The uphill runs were a little confusing to me because I used to downshift manually and was not sure if I could or how to do it ( I'm sure a phone call would answer the question but I am making a list )and the engine was so smooth and quiet I wasn't sure what it was doing (the tach has not been calibrated so I did not connect it ).  The downhill runs were easy the exhaust brake held the speed or slowed the bus down. There are no super steep or exceptionally long grades between Las Vegas and Albuquerque. Fuel mileage is an unknown quantity as of yet. I was bucking a head wind on the way home and I was late and ran a little faster than I usually do but even so I got better fuel mileage than I did with the 8V.  My toad was not bathed in oil when I got home and inside the coach in the back by the bedroom was not super hot like before. All things considered I am very happy with how the set up came out. I will post some pictures with this and more later. I am really looking forward to cleaning up all the loose ends that are on my side of the repower. Just my opinion but Gary and Dan did not only do all the stuff they said they would but some extra things that were really helpful.

Melbo

[Dreamscape]

Thanks for sharing your experience Melbo.

Sure glad things turned out good, now you will only have to worry about stopping her! With all that power you now have.

You will enjoy your coach for many years to come I am sure. Just get out and forget about what it used to do and concentrate on the NOW!

Happy Trails,

Paul

[luvrbus]

Melbo, so glad you had a good experience with Gary people do not give this guy the credit he deserves  sometimes, he has been a friend of mine for a long time and we have our ups and downs but always work it out.The guy can do anything when it comes to a bus MCI,Dina,Eagles Van Hool you name it he can work on it. I saw him put a 3408 Cat in a bus one time that people said it could not be done and his wife Sandy is the best at installing mirror siding on a Eagle of anybody around.Gary's prices for repowers are cheaper than Southern Oregon Diesel and they look just as good        

good luck

[skipn]

Melbo,

    From what I can see and read it sounds/looks like they did a very
nice job.


  Hope you have many thousand trouble free miles.


Skip

[mikelutestanski]

Melbo
    Congrats   and   good luck with the new   equipment.  Hope it  provides many years and trips .
       Thanks for all the info   and the posts ..     
        Happy bussin       mike 

[tekebird]

thats great..... but for others reading..... Not knowing what the HP and torque curves are for the New transplant....I tend to beleive that the old 8v71 was in fact that....OLD...and worn out. 

With a spicer and a good engine you should have been far exceeding ther 5mpg point.  I have gotten almost 9 in my 8 with an auto.

Have no idea what the transplant cost not including the New Mill.......

But for what I could buy a NEW 8v71 for now days I would have just did a engine swap in an afternoon.

Outside of some HP and some MPG gains....money saved and in the bank earning interest buys ALOT of fuel

[Melbo]

Actually the money was about the same if I did a rebuild and a tranny change.

I don't mind driving the spicer. Or should I say I didn't  mind driving the spicer but my girlfriend or my son would have a learning curve and with the auto avoided that.

Teke I was not going to do a change out in an afternoon.

You may be able to do that and I have never heard of an 8V71 that did not leak so the oil would still be an issue and I had overheating problems -- they may have been solved by the rebuild but if not then what??

Having spent the money for a rebuild and overheating do I then do the repower???

I nipped it in the bud and did the repower and tranny change in one operation and if I wasn't convinced that it was a good deal I wouldn't have done it.

I spent too many thousands of dollars and still had problems now I think they are gone.

Here are some more pictures.

Melbo

[tekebird]

i'm not saying it was a bad choice in your situation.....

As far as the 8-71 goes, I know several that hardly drip anything, read no oil on the back of bus or toad

Exluding your multiple problems......an engine swap of same model engine is alot cheaper. with ythe military now selling of their 8-71 inventories which can readily be had for 5k, Perhaps a few extra dollars and or time to sway bus stuff onto the engine.....pulling an 8-71 out of a MC-8 and sliding a new one in is a days job, two at most.

Now not knowing how your spicer was condition wise, and if your wife/son had any manual tranny experience to begin with.....or aptitude for that sort of thing ( some people are poor learners), I sold a flxliner some years ago and taught the guy to drive/shift in a couple hours......he then departed and drove 3000+ miles trouble free.

If you care to please share what you spent on the engine conversion.....as it is beneficial for newbies to know these things.

[makemineatwostroke]

 Tekebird who would tell 1800 strangers on a BB what they spent on a engine change, get real man that is his business not ours on what it cost




If you care to please share what you spent on the engine conversion.....
[/quote] from Tekebird

[tekebird]

I have no problem telling someone what something costs.

now if I really had a bug up my butt to know I would call out and say....hey you know the repower you did...what would it cost to do the same again.

[Lin]

When I was trying to figure out what to do about my structural problems a few months ago, I was considering all options.  At first, we were unsure of whether the repairs could be done without removing the engine.  Since I do not do that stuff myself, I figured that if I was removing the engine to do the welding, I should consider changing out the Spicer for an auto.  One shop I spoke to suggested changing the whole drive train to the L10 and ZF transmission with an integral retarder.  His estimate was around 15K.  I don't know where it would have gone from there, but he said that he had done it with his own bus, so I assume that he had a reasonable handle on the project.  Anyway, since a was able to get the welding done without pulling the engine, I didn't do any of the other stuff.  Still, it is something I would keep my eye on.  If one is planning on keeping and using the coach for many years and can afford it, the switch could be well worth it, especially in a case like this where you are trying to solve many problems in one shot.  I would guess that the upgrade in the whole driving experience would make it a pleasure to just start it up.  By the way, my 8v71 appears to be wet all over but no oil gets spread onto the toad.  I think having the full width rear flap does the trick there.

[DrivingMissLazy]

When I was trying to figure out what to do about my structural problems a few months ago, I was considering all options.  At first, we were unsure of whether the repairs could be done without removing the engine.  Since I do not do that stuff myself, I figured that if I was removing the engine to do the welding, I should consider changing out the Spicer for an auto.  One shop I spoke to suggested changing the whole drive train to the L10 and ZF transmission with an integral retarder.  His estimate was around 15K.  I don't know where it would have gone from there, but he said that he had done it with his own bus, so I assume that he had a reasonable handle on the project.  Anyway, since a was able to get the welding done without pulling the engine, I didn't do any of the other stuff.  Still, it is something I would keep my eye on.  If one is planning on keeping and using the coach for many years and can afford it, the switch could be well worth it, especially in a case like this where you are trying to solve many problems in one shot.  I would guess that the upgrade in the whole driving experience would make it a pleasure to just start it up.  By the way, my 8v71 appears to be wet all over but no oil gets spread onto the toad.  I think having the full width rear flap does the trick there.

[/b]

From many many posts a full width rear flap is strongly recommended against. Supposedly it creates heating problems. The flap is supposed to be directly behind the wheels.

Richard

[Melbo]

I negotiated the cost of the repower with Gary and Dan based on my particular situation. If you are interested I would be happy to supply you with the names of the other companies that I talked to also and you can negotiate a price and configuration. Some of the companies wanted to put in a 50 and 500 others had other ideas of what was best. I did this because it seemed to make the most sense to me.
I could also teach others how to operate the spicer but once again due to my personality I would prefer to keep the relationships and get a new tranny.  I guess that is why we convert buses so we can do it our way.

Melbo

[Sammy]

Mel, congrats on the return of your new hotrod.
Enjoy your new coach. 

[kyle4501]

I think you made an excellent choice in your upgrade. The availability of good & knowledgeable 8V71 mechanics ain't increasing. At least with your new engine, a decent mechanic should be easier to find if one is needed.

Not to mention the improved quality you are now enjoying!

If I have to deal with engine & trans issues, I'll follow your choice.

Enjoy the ride!