MPG redux

[windtrader]

Not sure about you rich guys, but I am choking at the rise in fuel prices. This is insane and just hope it is a freakout spike and prices will return to earth as the travel season gets going.


Literally, a couple of days ago, I snapped a photo off my TV showing gas price along the Big Sur route 1. Not surprising since gas is rare in certain sections.


Then today, I passed the corner gas station and saw this price this morning.


WTF! Seriously, this is just a regular suburban corner station here in NorCal.

[Nova Eona]

This is price gouging, not supply/demand or inflation - Big Oil profits are through the roof and they're spending a lot of that money on misinformation to deflect the blame.  Best way to bring the prices back down is to draw enough attention to that fact.

[richard5933]

This is price gouging, not supply/demand or inflation - Big Oil profits are through the roof and they're spending a lot of that money on misinformation to deflect the blame.  Best way to bring the prices back down is to draw enough attention to that fact.

Unfortunately right now, oil is a commodity traded on the open market and subject to supply issues (and even fear of supply issues). Got any suggestions on how to make it better?

Without a doubt some will get very rich off this catastrophe. Not sure how to fix it.

[buswarrior]

Last time we had war in Europe, everyone didn't own 3 cars... and the fuel we did use was much more local/regional in nature, when it wasn't being rationed.

Stop the war, watch the prices come down.

Happy coaching!
Buswarrior

[luvrbus]

This is price gouging, not supply/demand or inflation - Big Oil profits are through the roof and they're spending a lot of that money on misinformation to deflect the blame.  Best way to bring the prices back down is to draw enough attention to that fact.

Oil refiners like Exxon,Chevron and others buy their oil on the open market they are not selling oil but a finished product how are they the blame, our energy dept of the FED  screwed this up fuel in Needles CA was $6.59 a gal buy 200 gals of that   

[Nova Eona]

If you sell wood furniture and the price of wood goes up, do you expect your profits to go up dramatically?  Many of the big oil companies are showing profits better than any year for most of the last decade, despite the severe reduction in demand due to how many people are not commuting or travelling, yet somehow they're still raking in twelve figures worth of profits - not revenue, just actual profits.  That's insane.

[Bus Lurker]

Every time prices at the pump go up, the finger is pointed at excess profits by the evil oil companies.  Profit margins at the gasoline pumps are tight due to competition among the oil companies.

The Tax Foundation has calculated that the government profits more from gasoline at the pump than the oil companies by a long shot.  The government does not do the work of finding, pumping, refining and distributing the oil which magically appears as refined gasoline at your local gas station.  All the government does is levy the taxes.  The question needs to be asked if the government will declare a moratorium on taxes at the pump to ease the pain at pump the public is now experiencing?  Not holding my breath.

Don is showing the prices here in California which have the highest amount of taxes added on at the pump than any other state in the nation.  The reason CA has the highest prices is simply because CA has the most taxes added at the pump.   

[richard5933]

...Don is showing the prices here in California which have the highest amount of taxes added on at the pump than any other state in the nation.  The reason CA has the highest prices is simply because CA has the most taxes added at the pump.

They do have higher taxes, but not that much higher. Certainly not enough to explain the price differential. Unleaded is selling here for $3.99/gal and our taxes are only about $0.40/gal less the last time I looked. What explains the rest of the difference? Who's making all the extra from that $6.59/gal being charged in Needles? And how did the Feds screw this up if fuel here is still hovering at about $4/gal? If this was the fault of the Feds prices would  be that high everywhere.

[Bus Lurker]

Richard, As Clifford pointed out, refiners need to buy crude oil on the open market.  Around Christmas the price of crude oil was about 75 bucks per barrel.  Today the price was more than $125 per barrel which is a 66% increase since Christmas. 

Oil companies do not control the price of crude oil.  The oil market which consists of many companies and countries around the world are involve in pricing oil in the market. 

California does indeed have the highest pump taxes of any state.  Pump taxes in Wisconsin are about half of California's pump taxes are.  The point of my post is that is since refiners are paying $125 per barrel for crude oil, they may not have the ability to lower pump prices.  The government could declare a tax holiday to relieve the suffering that the middle- and lower-class folks are enduring at the pump.   Will they?

[chessie4905]

Gas here this am was $4.19. 5pm it was $4.49. Two days ago I paid $3.91. Week ago, $3.69

[richard5933]

Richard, As Clifford pointed out, refiners need to buy crude oil on the open market.  Around Christmas the price of crude oil was about 75 bucks per barrel.  Today the price was more than $125 per barrel which is a 66% increase since Christmas. 

Oil companies do not control the price of crude oil.  The oil market which consists of many companies and countries around the world are involve in pricing oil in the market. 

California does indeed have the highest pump taxes of any state.  Pump taxes in Wisconsin are about half of California's pump taxes are.  The point of my post is that is since refiners are paying $125 per barrel for crude oil, they may not have the ability to lower pump prices.  The government could declare a tax holiday to relieve the suffering that the middle- and lower-class folks are enduring at the pump.   Will they?

In the most recent data I can find (from early 2022) Wisconsin's gasoline taxes total $0.329 and California's $0.566/gal. You are correct that California's taxes are much higher, but it's only a $0.237/gal difference which doesn't even begin to explain the huge difference in price between the two states. 

I do agree with you about the companies buying oil on the open market. But, aren't they also the ones selling it? Might be two different arms of the oil industry, but to most people it's all the same. If BP is pumping crude and selling it on the open market to themselves at twice the price, aren't they still making more money? If not, where does the extra money go which the crude is bringing on the market?

Will there be tax holidays? That's going to have to be on a state-by-state basis since the bulk of the taxes in most states is not the Federal tax but the state tax.

[windtrader]

News flash!


In the few hours since posting this morning, a glance at the sign after running a few errands and guess what - yep - price hike!


$6.59 this morning and now $6.69 for diesel.


This is beyond insanity and any form of price gouging. More like greasy, slippery, crude gluttons on steroids!


Fed 24.4 cents, CA 38.9 CA diesel tax, sales tax 13%


At $6/gallon, fuel tax is 63.3 + 78 for sales tax, $1.41  If the sales tax is piled on the fuel taxes then tax total is $1.49 per GALLON!

[richard5933]

...Fed 24.4 cents, CA 38.9 CA diesel tax, sales tax 13%


At $6/gallon, fuel tax is 63.3 + 78 for sales tax, $1.41  If the sales tax is piled on the fuel taxes then tax total is $1.49 per GALLON!

Never even occurred to me that some states charge sales tax on top of their fuel tax - isn't that plain double dipping?

We pay our state and federal fuel taxes, and that's it. No additional sales tax.

All that said, you might need to check your math. Here's an article from which seems to show a total around $0.8655/gal including all state and federal taxes. Still very high, no doubt, and still much higher than other states. Still doesn't explain a difference of over $2/gal in price. Maybe it's the cost of operating a fuel station in CA?

https://californiaglobe.com/articles/californias-highest-in-the-nation-gas-and-diesel-taxes/

[Dave5Cs]

@ Windtrader,  Hey Don here in Kansas the gas is $3.26 and went up today to $3.38 OMG
California 101,
Richard wins the guessing.
Being my wife ran four stations in California years ago. She says first a station doesn't  make their money off of gas they make it off the food and candy etc, sodas and beer especially  and cigarettes big part in the market part.

The owners make a small profit and the states and local government make money big time off of taxes and hidden fees such as Road taxes, bridge taxes where there are tolls, and in California every time there is an election there are tons of do you want this or that and the people vote NO and so the state put  it on Fuel taxes and then they don't spend it on the road etc. and the roads and infrastructural goes to hell in a hand basket. Then the next they vote it starts all over again and they blame it on the oil companies which it is not.

As far as Needle, CA it is always very high because they know some don't want to drive 2 blocks and get it for 3.00 less seriously in Arizona

[luvrbus]

Look at it this way everyone wanted the $15.00 min livable wage which we got without firing a shot now $15.00 will buy you 2.5 gals of gasoline,Dave Needles jumped to $6.99 for diesel in 3 hours. it is $4.77 and $4.99 at the 1st stations in AZ  cheaper as you head for Bullhead City