Bu$$ing thoughts for Newbies

[Buffalo SpaceShip]

Here's something not often discussed here that Newbies should consider: spend some time with your bus before you go dumping a bunch of $ and time into her. You may find it's not your lifestyle or not your bus... or both.

The market is filled with busses whose owners had grand dream$ and vision$ of traveling the country in their conversion$... only to let 'em sit and rust out. On my present bus, the P.O. dumped fifty-five large into her, only to travel 7k miles in 7 years! I bought her for a fraction of that in March... and will have ticked over the same 7k by the time I get home from this trip.

Every mile you drive in your bus gets less expensive per mile. Of course that sounds obvious. But it holds true for the shell and for the conversion. So, doing the math, and considering his losses of money only and not including fuel, my bus' P.O. spent nearly four bucks per mile to own the bus. But, perhaps even more sad, he told me his family only spent about 20 nights in her.  $1,600 per night?? He could have stayed in a lakeside villa on Lake Como for less, and not had all of his spare time burned up converting a bus he sold for pennies on the dollar. Sigh!

And these girls just like to be driven. That's what they were engineered to do. But some folks are just looking for a comfortable camper with large bays. A "park model" with big truck guts... and the prices to match. Which is fine... but they (or the sad bus' next owner) will pay the price someday for such inactivity.

So go ahead and put the dollar sign in place of any "s" item$ for your bu$... part$, tire$, inverter$, tran$mission, Detroit Die$el, Jake$... catch my drift? It's an expensive hobby, to be sure... but much more expensive if you don't go anywhere with 'em.

No matter what condition your coach is in... from shell to steel tent, all the way up to finished conversion... drive it, stay in it, see the country. Go to a rally, go to a campground, or just park in your relatives' driveways. Use your bus, enjoy your bus, love and care for your bus. Because it's really a BU$... and life is short.

Just a thought!
Brian B.

[Happycampersrus]

Well said Brian.

That needs to be the first 2 questions. How many miles a year will I go??? How often will the bus be used??? The answers to these questions should help a "newbie" decide rather quickly if our hobby is for them.

Dale

[belfert]

Plenty of people do the same thing with regular RVs too.  Even if just a travel trailer, it isn't too difficult to spend upward of $60k for trailer and tow vehicle and still only use the RV rarely.  Granted, with a travel trailer the tow vehicle might be a daily driver, but the previous daily driver may have been a vehicle with lower fuel costs.

Brian Elfert

[FloridaCliff]

Brian,

Great Advice for ALL!

I always ask someone who I have met that thinks that a Bus Conversion may be for them is:

First-Do you already camp/RV with your family, if not, get a good used Class C and try it out, too much time and effort into a BC

to find out its "Not for the Family".  You can resell that used C for very little loss, if you change your mind.  Not so with your

conversion.

Go into it with "eyes wide open", it WILL cost more and "take longer" than you think.  Allow for changes in your plans and the thickness of

your wallet.

The coach is sort of like a BUS-SHARE  (One Family Time Share) The only way you can justify the initial outlay is if you USE it.

Cliff

[eglluvr]

Brian,

Great Advice for ALL!

I always ask someone who I have met that thinks that a Bus Conversion may be for them is:

First-Do you already camp/RV with your family, if not, get a good used Class C and try it out, too much time and effort into a BC

to find out its "Not for the Family".  You can resell that used C for very little loss, if you change your mind.  Not so with your

conversion.

Go into it with "eyes wide open", it WILL cost more and "take longer" than you think.  Allow for changes in your plans and the thickness of

your wallet.

The coach is sort of like a BUS-SHARE  (One Family Time Share) The only way you can justify the initial outlay is if you USE it.

Cliff

Cliff, are you sure it's the thickness of your wallet.or the thickness of your head...LOL


Really I think you and Brian hit it on the Head, Evaluate and do your research, If the camping or mobile lifestyle does not suit you then save your money, time etc. etc. etc.. The key to RV Ownership is recreate!  kinda gives use it or lose it a whole new meaning.

We have a timeline for our conversion, but it is flexible, kinda like the budget  should be a fun thing not a stress thing.

(I was just wondering if I will be this convicted after I actually purchase the coach    )



Jim

[NJT5047]

Here's something not often discussed here that Newbies should consider: spend some time with your bus before you go dumping a bunch of $ and time into her. You may find it's not your lifestyle or not your bus... or both.
ust a thought!
Brian B.

Another sobering thought...spend some time with your family if "camping" together is a new concept.    Could end up like the first hour of the movie "RV"...
I agree that bus buyers should have a clear idea of what they are going to use it for.
Way too much trouble if one must force themselves to learn to drive it...and maintain it..and repair it....and convert it...ad infinitum..  Owning a bus is a lifestyle.
Or, you could just be unbalanced (like me) and have a bus fetish.  Mental condition you know!  I love my BUS! 
BIG toys are cool!
Best, JR

[FloridaCliff]

Jim wrote: Cliff, are you sure it's the thickness of your wallet.or the thickness of your head...LOL

Good point!

JR wrote: BIG toys are cool

You are soooooooo right!

JR, I read in another thread that my bus is 1.5" longer than yours, Shorty

Cliff

[NJT5047]

JR wrote: BIG toys are cool
You are soooooooo right!

JR, I read in another thread that my bus is 1.5" longer than yours, Shorty
Cliff

Cliff, it's also 2 foot taller! 
See you in Arcadia....or somewhere in between! 

BTW, I've got a little different perspective than Brian on the cost of using the bus...the more I drive it, the less money I seem to have left??   I go "camping" a right good bit...but it don't seem to get cheaper??  What am I doing wrong?  I suppose fuel prices are about the lowest point now...need to fill it up.  Anyone know of any low interest second mortgages  
Lessee...new fuel filters, oil and filter change, new block heater, fuel fill...only $760 this week!  It's getting better.
Oh yeah, looking for another laptop to load the DeLorme into!  Another $600 (there are deals on laptops!).
The DeLorme thingy is a cool toy too!  Been playing with that for a couple days...amazing stuff!

JR  


 

[akbusguy2000]

On the other hand:

The cost per mile denominator is valid if the only rewarding objective is usage of the end product for travel.  For that reason, the analogy of high-end motor homes is indeed a valid point.  Yet we all know that travel today has a host of mode-specific restrictions and competitive alternatives which can and will oftentimes invalidate the advantages of travel by bus or motorhome.  Yet we do it anyway, so there must be, and are, other reasons.

Even so, who is to say that every bus owner/converter envisions the same objective?  This is, after all, a hobby - a project - of ownership, of craftsmanship, of learning, and of accomplishment, each of which has its very own set of rewards.  For these reasons I believe it is also valid to throw a few other equally or more costly project-related hobbies into the circle of analogy:

Private airplanes; sailboats; antique cars, trucks and tractors - to name a few.  Most of these deal with the collection and restoration of antiquities.  Others, like the bus conversion hobby are hobbies of "Uniquities."

I measure the rewards of my own conversion by neither the miles I have driven it, nor by the money poured into it, but rather by the enjoyment I have had in the doing of it all.

tg   

[eglluvr]

On the other hand:

The cost per mile denominator is valid if the only rewarding objective is usage of the end product for travel.  For that reason, the analogy of high-end motor homes is indeed a valid point.  Yet we all know that travel today has a host of mode-specific restrictions and competitive alternatives which can and will oftentimes invalidate the advantages of travel by bus or motorhome.  Yet we do it anyway, so there must be, and are, other reasons.

Even so, who is to say that every bus owner/converter envisions the same objective?  This is, after all, a hobby - a project - of ownership, of craftsmanship, of learning, and of accomplishment, each of which has its very own set of rewards.  For these reasons I believe it is also valid to throw a few other equally or more costly project-related hobbies into the circle of analogy:

Private airplanes; sailboats; antique cars, trucks and tractors - to name a few.  Most of these deal with the collection and restoration of antiquities.  Others, like the bus conversion hobby are hobbies of "Uniquities."

I measure the rewards of my own conversion by neither the miles I have driven it, nor by the money poured into it, but rather by the enjoyment I have had in the doing of it all.

tg   

and the church sez...

Amen!!

[Buffalo SpaceShip]

Very well said, tg.  My post wasn't directed necessarily to those that choose to convert for the pride of DIY, but more for those searching for an alternative to the Sticks and Staples MHs. Personally, I got into conversion busses as a safer mode of RV'ing, but you're right... there's a host of other reasons, and I certainly don't want to discourage those. I just see too many folks underestimate the time and $ it takes to convert a bus "their way", and wanted to give some cautionary advice.

My last two coaches have showed very well in pride of ownership, and I can only imagine the kind of time their converters poured into them (not to mention cash), but when the rubber met the road, I was paying them pennies on the dollar for their cash outlay and they obviously received nothing for their untold hundreds of man-hours expended. Both were frustrated that their work was viewed as the comodity that it ultimately is. Situations change, family dynamics evolve. Time to travel can sometimes be finite. Both of these owner/ converters did not get what they wanted out of their conversion dreams, and I see many busnuts in the same bag.

At the moment, we're travelling in ours, accepting the compromises of what we bought vs. what we could build, making repairs and maintenence along the way. We chose not to convert a coach right now, but I can certainly see why a lot of folks do. And I see a ton of amazing work and pride right here on MAK, and have the utilmate respect for those that do these things. But I fear that you folks are in the minority. Many wannabes get into the hobby to go places in a converted coach... and it's sad to me that many never do. And their beautiful coaches, or even the half-done ones... I see 'em on eBay and elsewhere every day.

And, you're right, it's not $ per mile or even $ per night spent out in a bus. Sometimes I think it was worth the thousands of $ we've paid to be out bussin' at this time of our lives... for that one memory or that single photograph that we can look back on years from now and remember the joys we shared on the road.

That's all I was trying to say...
bb

[bus fool]

  If you are building it for the money get another hobby. As for using it look around and see how many guys have boats , big boats with big gas tanks used very little they are doing it cause they love it . This is the reason any newbie who wants to spend his time on a coach should consider when he makes a choice to purchase a coach. You most likely if you are anything like me have spent your time and monry on less pleasurable things than finishing a project like a coach. It doesn't always have to be about money.

[RJ]

Maybe what Brian's saying is that the busnut thing boils down to this:

"$miles per mile"

[Buffalo SpaceShip]

It doesn't always have to be about money.

Well, I certainly didn't say that... if that's what your post was inferring. Too often it certainly does come down to money, though. Or "forced sale", "family illness" or whatever. In these cases, if some guy derived pleasure out of the persuit of building the busnut version of the boat the never set sail, I won't fault him for that. Maybe his family enjoyed watching him do it, who knows? And sure, there's scores of other hobbies that burn infinite amounts of cash and time. Great! Somehow that negates my point(s)?! Gads.

Anyways, who am I to pontificate... really? I presently have a bus stuck 800 miles from home with a leaky seal... or something. If it was at home with me pouring money into her rather than bleeding cash here... well, I wouldn't have near as far to walk. 

So forget everything I said. Mothball 'em. Weld the wheels to the drums. Let the grass grow high. Let the shore cords corrode onto the receptacles. Don't drive 'em anywhere until they're perfect.  Heck, take out the two-strokes and sell 'em to a museum. Bus parts are getting scarcer every day, anyways. 

[steamguy56]

thought from newbie...I had the 100K motor home really injoyed all the time spent in it. But after 10 years it was falling in around us, not from neglect it had a barn to stay in we used it alot.  I got to the point that I didn't want to drive it over 100 miles from home. It just wouldn"t do what we felt was our needs for a coach. So we purchased a 1979 MCI went to work on it, having alot of fun. But it to has seen better years, realised it will take alot longer to bring it back than I have to spend. I will not give up on her just needed something newer, one we could drive to the shows, even if we have to sleep on blow up matresses. So enter the picture 1997 Prevost one still in tour bus industry. Can leave the bus alone(hopefully) just move inside. Yes I know there"s alot more to it than that. But I can go and carry some "stuff" just to get back out there will make it all worth the expense. Thanks for all the help I get from the board
          Danny