Black tank vent

[artvonne]

Brandon, you are preaching to the choir here

  Its interesting, ive never dumped the stuff anywhere but in a tank. Just because others have been misinformed and suggest dumping it, doesnt make it right. I'll just continue to do as I always have and dump it in a tank.

  I really cant ever imagine someone dumping it on the ground where they are parked in a campground, and especially near someone. Even if its sanitary, it still stinks.

  So really then, one single tank for all waste water is sufficient, no?

[JohnEd]

Anybody ever seen a outside shower/shower head plumbed into the wet bay?  How about a shower head next to the front door?  Beech campers like this setup and require that "everybody" rinse of before coming inside if you have been sunning or swimming....KIDS, PAY ATTENTION.  Ever seen that? 

Just say'n.  You could be in a heap o trouble in AZ camped by the Colorado River.  But, hey!  Whatever! When in Rome.  Like so many laws I am sure they are directed at the minority that will screw up a steel ball in a rubber room.  If anyone dumped their gray water tank anywhere near me after that tank had set for a week or so that person would be in "trouble".  The more specific a law is the more complex and detailed that law must be written.  DUMP NO WASTE WATER seems to work but, in its simplicity, it misses the mark in its true intent of infringing the least.  Allowing me and mine to to drain my Irish Spring onto the dirt and stop idiots from dumping would probably end up as a entire telephone book worth of print.  This is also at the root of why attorneys are well suited to politics.....it's in the fine print, stupid, and a plumber isn't any good at that kind of subtleties and subterfuge.

Bearing firearms is a Constitutional issue and look at the trouble we have keeping that door open.  So who is going to fight to protect the rights of a camper to use the sense God gave him and not ruin his fellow campers day?  Let's write a law.... get it?  The people that are the most avid proponents of such legislation are usually the ones most vehemently opposed to collecting taxes to support the parks and public recreation facilities where dumping might occur.  Why does it make sense to mutter "there outta be a law" and then almost without letting that next swig of beer hit your stomach, be in full lament about "Gummint interference"?  Explain that to me, please.  What happened to being that Rugged Individualist, Pioneer and "inventive free thinking soul"?  I know what the rules are but I want to do it my way and get praise for doing so....that guy.

Still confused,

John

[luvrbus]

John it is not just the shower water gray water can be from dishes, washing machine etc I see nothing wrong with Chaz and his shower water but how many adults have you seen standing outside in the nude taking a shower with those outside shower in some places are not allowed also Galveston Beach come to mind the park ranger told my daughter not to use hers on the beach she could use water to rinse the kids but no soap.
I haven't saw any new RV's with that outside shower in a few years now have you



good luck

[Lin]

Letting gray water run on the ground is not the same as dumping a tank of it.  I do not know what is meant by saying the practice has been gaining favor lately; it has always been done.  There are some places where it is not permitted and there are others where it is.  We use the bus a a guest house at home.  I generally use the gray water bypass for that.  It's just connected to a hose and goes into a ditch about 30 feet away.  Water does not accumulate, and I would suspect that the desert sun can handle whatever nastys are deposited.  Similarly, in the right situation, running a hose into some nearby bushes could work.  But we are talking about just letting the water run.  Dumping 50-100 gallons of festering waste at a shot is a different story.

[luvrbus]

Lin, that is funny what is the difference dumping a little at one time or the tank full same mixture in both were it drains out a 5/8 hose or a 2 inch valve

good luck   

[Lin]

Clifford, "fresh" dish water is not likely to be particularly offensive, but if it sits in a closed tank for a while it can get quite putrid.  Aside from the tank dump being noxious, the large volume also means it will flow over a large area instead of just seeping into the ground as it could with a trickle.  In various places we have lived, we used the washing machine water to irrigate some oleander and a stand of oaks.  There never was even a hint of a problem.  Of course, in each of those cases too the water was plumbed away from the house.

[JohnEd]

John it is not just the shower water gray water can be from dishes, washing machine etc I see nothing wrong with Chaz and his shower water but how many adults have you seen standing outside in the nude taking a shower with those outside shower in some places are not allowed also Galveston Beach come to mind the park ranger told my daughter not to use hers on the beach she could use water to rinse the kids but no soap.
I haven't saw any new RV's with that outside shower in a few years now have you
good luck

Clifford,

I am in complete agreement with you on this.  If you see any contradictions that must be due to my not being clear. 

I remember seeing them...showers at the door.....when, how long ago or where is lost to me.  I can assure you that if I had a Pre or the likes it would have that capability at the wet bay at least and in close proximity to the entrance as well if possible.  I don't always camp where there is a Ranger to guide my every move though I am strongly in favor of their presence and rule enforcement for the masses.  And I am massive.

If there is no reg against it I will rinse my thong clad feet at the entrance with a shower.  I may also do what I have done for years and just put a shallow pan outside for everyone to rinse their clogs/thongs/feet..  There is almost no chance whatsoever that I will treat the foot rinse waste water in that pan as hazardous waste or otherwise get all that anal about it.

Still luv ya ta pieces, Cliffy.

John

[luvrbus]

JohnEd, we are talking about people and gray water my friend give them a 5/8 hose next week it will a 3 inch and a tank full  lol and I don't want to know if your foot water is  H/W or not you be the judge on that one I'll pass thanks.
FWIW my boat has gray water holding tanks and I am not allowed to dump gray water in the water till I get away from the bays at least in Ca where the boat is


good luck

[JohnEd]

From Ace:

Well John, simply put, my vent going down works,

Good that you pointed out that you idea is "simply" put.  You might want to consult Webster before you start modeling "brands".  To your point, though, I saw nothing overly sophisticated in anything you said.

has worked

I have conceded  that point on your word alone.  I have never doubted your sincerity nor have I ever advocated that others do so.

and has given us no smell under any condition.

I know you are wrong about that but I think you are "simply" misstating your point that YOU have never had a problem nor have YOU, or others, ever been offended by tank gas being dumped under your bus.


With that said, do you think if it didn't I would continue to come on here and publicly promote it?

No, I don't Ace.  I think you are just being "simple" and plainly stating your experience.  But you appear to be "promoting that design" and you have precious, dare I say NONE, support for the theory that would support your design and that you don't proffer.  Your promotion seems to me to infer that you are holding the rest of us up to ridicule for accepting a design that is regulation and well established and "simply put"....simple.


I guess it's just the same as when I used a round aluminum fuel tank to build my black tank. Ya'all  said that couldn't be done too,

Ace, Amigo, you started your reply with "John"(me, singular).  One of the problems with colloquialisms such as "y'all" is that they are both plural and singular and to tell the difference you have to have the speaker in sight.  A fixed gaze or finger point means singular while a sweeping gesture or sweeping glance means plural.  Buddy, I never made any comment about your "round aluminum waste water tanks" one way or the other.  I know that Al. is more highly reactive to chems than steel, all depending, and make s an inferior waste tank for that reason alone.  Tank thickness and alloy would have a huge bearing.  All of the round fuel tanks I have seen have been, well, "round" and round doesn't utilize the bay space very efficiently unless your bays are, well, round.  I sure as heck aren't saying your bays aren't round now Ace.  They are yours, of course, and to a greater or lesser degree they reflect you penchant as a trail blazer....I'm just say'n.  It wasn't me that got your skivvies all bunched by opining on that sensitive subject.  Propane, at 200psi needs to be round or really really thick walled stuff.  I think.

or the fact that I hung it from the main floor frame structure, which couldn't be done, or have it mounted sideways rather than front to back, which couldn't be done, all for obvious and deadly reasons but I did and everything works just fine.

Ace, just because something hasn't happened yet is not proof that it won't or that your actions haven't exacerbated a potential hazard.  The man that fell from the 50th  floor of a skyscraper was heard to say, as he fell past the 25th floor, "oh well, so far so good".  That story looses it's humorous element if you quote him as advocating jumping as "a good way to get to the ground floor". I "simply" find almost all of what you post interesting.  You are innovative at the least and possibly a trifle paranoid but it is all good.  You also seem to have assigned statements and postures to me that I certainly do not have and never have voiced sooo you might want to work on some of that as well.  At any rate, I still luv ya, Brah.

Think outside the box and not always what the book says.
Yea, I'm proud because it was cheap and it works....simply put!

Who could argue with that?  On the other hand it is a handicap to be limited to only those practices that "are" outside the box for that reason alone.  Sumply putt.

[JohnEd]

Just to prove that a vent does NOT have to go thru the roof, check out a "studor" valve.  Its a small 2 inch valve that vents the line. We removed our they the roof black pipe vent in our house and installed one of these in our kitchen. It works, per a plumber wuth many years experience and its the ONLY vent on the house. No smells, no slow drainage, nada! If you can do this in a house that doesn't move, who says you can't do it in a bus? Just saying, unless of course the methane gas has are my brain up over the years.
This is just one example.
Why is it almost every topic results in a debate? Tried and proven but were still wrong. It's not the internet bully running people off, it's this exact thing. People beat a non issue to death and they are only posting what they think rather than what they have actually done. Read all your books, laws, and codes but remember, they are only there because they are. You would have to have a hell of a lot of methane gas built up to cause an explosion and who keeps their tanks full all of the time? I sure dont!

Ace,
This is now and started out as a forum.  It is even called a "forum"....simply put and without putting too fine an edge on it.  In the heading there is even a section titled "Forum Rules"...not "riles".  I'll offer that as proof of the intent... Now Webster has to get involved here as he is/was the expert.  FORUM: A public meeting place for open discussion.  A public meeting involving public discussion. A program involving discussion of a problem usually by experts.  A forum involves debate, Ace.  It is that way everywhere.  Your not liking it isn't likely to change much.  And complaining that others have opinions other than your is a breach and not grounds for...

One of the many definitions of INSANITY is "to repeat the same action while expecting different results".  Somebody says TANK....somebody will say VENT and awaaaay we go.  But there are always people here that never heard the debate, Ace.  Like you 50 years ago  And there are the Lurkers.

Those Studor valves admitt air to the sewer line to prevent the exiting/flushed water from sucking the TRAP dry. Most dry traps will admit sewar gas to the living quarters, though yours may be an exception.  That sewer gas is poisonous and highly offensive.  Yours may be the exception.  They are used on runs....not as tank vents.  A tank vent MUST work both ways.  Sorta ambidextrous or bi-sezual....sorta.  The vent exhales the tank when we input sewage and it inhales when we purge the tank.  It has two jobs to do.  If your vert vent is near the trap, as it is supposed to be, then you will never have any need for a Studor valve or anything else that is mechanical or electrical.  That, "simply put", simple pipe does it all.....forever and never needs oiling.  But, thanks for the tip.

Still luv ya,

John

[JohnEd]

t.
So, please, keep the debates going. I love them and learn a TON!!! But, try to keep the civility to a max and condescension to a minimum.

How about "humor"?  Aren't we required to be able to take a joke?   I know I don't take myself all that seriously,  Sarcasm is certainly humor, and, actually, Webster calls it the wit of the Master.  Now I have taken note that, from time to time, the guy that might be termed "the unarmed oponent" gets really all huffy.  What can yoiu expect but indignation from someone that is in over their head(s).

 Just my opinion,

Your opinion carries weight with me and i thank you for sharing it.
  Chaz
edited

[JohnEd]

When you do dump do a good cleaning I use a washer system inside the tank to wash good after every dump not that hard to make one with a sprinkler head and pvc pipe dry camping for long periods I would vent to the top JMW


good luck

FINALLY!!!!!

After all these years of looking like I am sucking up....here we go.  Clifford and I have diametrically opposed opinions on a bus issue.  I have never and will never use one of those wands that you connect to a garden hose to "squirt out the inside surface" of my black water tank.  The idea is ludicrous to me.  Nonsense!  Ballder-dash and horse poo.  My tanks are never put up dry and I dump only when they are full or nearly so.  I keep them wet.  After sitting for a year I noticed that the bottom of my Black tank was bone dry and the min of brown sludge had dried and crinkled like the mud flats of Death Valley.  A few flushes to "wet things down" and not a single issue.  Those tanks have been working that way since 1973 without a problem.  Hose out the inside???  Why?  Anyone that eats in there deserves what they get.

I used that "Blue Toilet" perfume stuff once.  I didn't have a problem and I thought I might be doing some one or something a favor somehow.  The horrible stench of the efflent that came out at dump time was a real gager.  I got to reading that label to see better what I had done and the principle ingredient was FORMALDIHYDE.  Anybody that tells you that F is environmentally friendly or Green in the remote is pulling your leg.  I am not saying that the industry is not making a serious TON O MONEY from this public ruse cause they certainly are.  What I am saying is that there are a gazillion of happy campers out there that don't use that stuff and never have.  Keep your mind AND your fingers outta the sewer.....don't use that crap cause the makers are laughing at you with the same gusto as the cigarette makers are.  Go without it...cold turkey....and see if your senses are assaulted by sewer odors.  If they are then fix the problem or rerun your vents up thru the roof.

Clifford,

This proves our relationship of trust and respect on my part.  Don't go Ace on me now....please.

[JohnEd]

With that vent setup Chaz the liquids in the tank have to force the sewer gas out and if don't buy that have the local gas co in your area sniff it with their gadget it will show nothing

good luck

LIVE AND LOIN..... didn't know such a device existed.  Freon does PPM though but If I can get the gas company or water guys to do it I'll be a happy camper.

thanks,

John

[JohnEd]

I had a horrific odor,

If you are just completely flummoxed by this problem I have a suggestion:  Go to a AC specialist and have him plug your roof vent, add freon to your waste tank through a jerry rigged coupler , and run his sniffer around till he locates the "freon leak".  And continue till he is sure there isn't a second leak.

You might simply pressurize the system sitting there and do the nose sniffer thing, also. We are talking a half pound of pressure don't forget.  Don't want your potty bounce'n off the bathroom ceiling.   The crack in my pipe was on the side to the wall and it too me months to find it and the fix cost less than a dollar.

Fun talk'n with ya,

John

Now it turns out that there is a sewer sniffer that dores this and you can get the utilities to run the tests for free.  I have mixed emotions about learning that.  Especially after getting it "wrong" so to speak and nobody shared the "good info" with me and the board.  Why did it take you guys so long to speak up?( he said in his paranoia)  Clifford?

thanks,

John

[Ace]

John your comments are not even worth commenting on but I did find it very amusing to start my day off with a laugh to say the least!