Welding- not exactly a bus question

[Lin]

I have done a little welding about 20 years ago with a 120 volt cracker box.  Not much experience.  I want to buy a decent, used machine now and have been looking to see what is available.  I am rewiring my garage to be a small shop and will have a good 240 circuit. Originally, I only thought of getting a stick welder but now think that I would be better off, both for ease and range, with a machine that did MIG and flux core.  What advise do the master welders out there have on this subject?

[DMoedave]

Lin, i will never be a master welder but i have a FirePower 130 by Thermodyne. Its a small 110 v MIG unit that has a gas bottle but i usually just use the flux core wire without the gas. It does a great job on most jobs. A good old stick unit is great for heavy duty stuff and you have the 220. There was a great article in The Coach Builders Bulletin and i bet you could get a reprint from George Myers. Some MIG units used to have wire feed problems but if you take care of the hose and nozzle you shouldent have problems. After you get used to the feed rate and power settings you will be looking for stuff to weld! And get the flux coating that you dip the nozzle into to keep the spatter from sticking to the nozzle.

[kyle4501]

When I bought my mig welder, I was warned to avoid the welders at the big box stores - seems many of those (regardless of brand) are disposeable in that repair parts aren't available. Several friends had welders that the shop couldn't get parts for. 

I bought a Millermatic 172 & I love it!  It is a 220v unit & draws ~22 amps at max, so it will work off a dryer circut. I also bought a 100ft long 10ga extension cord & made ends for it so I can use it at other locations - like a friend's house.

Go to your local welding supply houses & talk to them. Often they will have trade in or off lease units at a discount. Also, if you buy the welder from them, you usually get better pricing on the consumeables. 

[Gary LaBombard]

Lin,
I have mentioned a few times on this bb'd about the welder I also use on my bus conversion, "The Rustless Money Pit".  I have been using my welder for five years now, it is 110volt, has done 99% of all my Eagle Frame Replacement / reinforcement project.  I have gone through over 15  10 lb. rolls of flux core wire I buy at Home Depot, $39 per roll. 

My Welder is the (Hobart #140) model.  This is portable so you can put in your car and bring to your friends house to help him with his conversion also.  My bus does not have anything on it over 1/8 thick, (Believe Me) and this mig machine has been a blessing as I get good penetration and to weld this much wire roll after roll is impressive to me.  I would recommend getting a roll around cart, (Small one) and now some of the Hobart Welders include this cart so shop around.  I paid about $459 I believe for mine.

I did purchase the model #135 first because of cost but I believe this is an older model no longer sold, I am really happy with the #140. I complained of a problem to the Hobart technicians about my (#135 model), they immediately within hours authorized my exchange at the store I purchased this #135 machine and was able to trade up for the #140 model and have been happy every since.  I have dealt directly with the hobart Representatives on one issue I had and they immediately oven night mailed the part I needed with no cost or question.

Do everything ( DMoedave) has recommended such as getting the tip lubricant to keep splatter from covering your nozzle and you should be good to go.  I use the (.035) wire, a little larger and have put on a (.040) tip to give a little more clearance because of heat expansion of the wire as being used.  This will help.  Never let your welding cable get a sharp corner when being used, try to keep as straight as possible when using to prevent friction of the wire moving in the cable. 

Now this is just my preference, you have to make the decision, I have used mine extensively as you know and am still using it.  I do know that if mine burns out, the mother board is not a hard item to get from them and I can't promise you this but know the cost if any will be very minimal.  These are great people to deal with and I have in the past.

Having your welder portable on your conversion is a plus also so you can use a heavy duty extension cord to weld on any end of the bus if you need to when on the road or your shop. 

You can also use the gas with this but with working in the wind at times I choose to stay with the fluxed wire and wear a welding jacket.  The splatter is very minimal if any and nearly rubs off or scrapes very easily with a wire brush with a blade on it.

Hope this helps, Welding with a mig is the way to go, stick is too hot for my project as the metal is not that thick, anyplace!!

Good Luck
Gary   

[muddog16]

I have the same welder that Kyle does!  Miller seems to have taken the lead in small portable mig machines, Lincoln's are good also, with todays technology most of them are probably good! Small easy to move around, the extension cord is a must!
In a little over 3 years the only thing I've replaced on my welder is the liner on the lead! They are fairly inexpensive to replace.  Something that I do to help the liner life is to take a foam ear plug and run my welding wire through it to act as a wiper before the wire goes into the lead it helps keep it clean!  Which ever machine you choose, purchasing the gas shielding attachment and getting away from the flux core wire will improve your welds and definately make them stronger, not to mention they will even look better.  Mig machines have a tendency to make you look better than you actually are!  A few things to remember when welding is to use the correct wire, clean the metals that you are going to weld, make sure they are dry, use the correct temperature setting for the metal thickness you are using! Follow these few guide lines and you are on the way to making better welds!  The more you use it the better you will become!...........Good luck!

[jjrbus]

A long time ago, in the last century. I actually worked as a welder. There werre no mig welders then only stick.  The first time I used a mig I could not belive how easy it was to use. I could teach a 12 year old girl  to weld in a few minutes with one of those things.
There are some good ideas posted here but will add my 2 centavos worth.  If you are just going to be doing some light hobbiest type work, a cheap (gasp, did he say cheap?) Harbor Frieght type will work fine. Not everyone needs SnapOn!
If buying for myself I would buy a 110 volt unit for portability issues. It is tempting to buy a large gas tank, but they can be awkward to move around, even with a cart. Too small a tank and you are running for refills all the time, I would want a tank that is practical to carry.
Next would be a trip to the library, find a basic book on welding, you dont need to become a welding engineer. But there are some things you should know, like welding galvinized metal gives off posionous gas. If you can find someone that knows how to weld to show you the basics would be a good plus. also they may have a class at your local school. This is a good place to get momma involved, lonely women make good welders.

[chazwood]

I have a Lincoln 175. Works great. Bought it off eBay. saved about $200. There are bunches of them for sale on there every day.

Allow me to offer this.


Using the gas (mig) is best when welding the small, thin, delicate stuff. Works great on sheet metal (the argon gas actually surrounds and cools the weld spot and keeps you from burning giant holes in your work)  If you use argon to weld the big stuff, (especially bonding thin to thicker) be careful. You must check to see if your penetration is sufficient. It is easy to be fooled.

Flux core, on the other hand, gets much hotter. Good for melting into the thick stuff.

My rule of thumb....if you can't bend it with your bare hands............ flux it.

A beginner tends to stare at the brightest point of light as he welds. This will be a mistake because it tells you nothing. (kinda like your teenagers face......when you ask him what he's doing ) Ignore this spot. A pro will concentrate his attention on that dark, liquidy-looking puddle that follows behind the bright spot. If you don't look closely, you never even see the murky puddle because your so busy being blinded by the bright burn.

I'm not a welder, but I play one....... in my imagination.

[JohnEd]

Chaz,

Great post!

I will add "CENTURY" to the list of "good" brands.  An item worth considering is maintainability.  The gas/wire feed line is not carried for the cheapo welders so you have to order those.  My Cent had interchangable parts with a Miller and any other I think.

You want GREAT looking welds?  Strong welds and all that from a rank novice?  Get that Argon and CO2 blend that they say is "most" recommended.  Most shops just use CO2.  There is a pultry difference in price and I questioned a friend as to why he went for the savings?  He shared that while the diff in price per tank was small....CO2 was liquified and a tank lasted 6 months in his com shop.  The "optimum" mix lasted a couple weeks.....so thats why.  I buy the mix...no spatter....it sings pretty...welds look great...welds are strong.

I never use flux cause i put up a peice of cardboard to shelter the weld from the breeze.  I WOULD use flux core if I welded on the prarrie.

MILLER/HOBART/ LINCOLN are brands that have the most resale value.  Your wife might care....or other heirs.

John

[Lin]

Let me summarize to confirm what I am hearing.  It is best that I go with a MIG/flux core machine,  the big names are safe buys, and the portability of a 120 volt unit may outweigh the benefits of the extra power of a 240 volt one. 

[Gary LaBombard]

Lin,
As Johned has stated, the above brands are all good.  I think the lifetime of them all is pretty much the same also.  I would stay away from the real cheapies from HF in this case, spend around $500-$700 on a good 110 volt machine and you should be real happy.  If you will be welding over 1/4 inch then perhaps getting the 240 volt is what you need.  As I said about my little 110 volt machine, I have run over 15 or maybe 17  10 lb. rolls of wire now and she is still running smooth as silk and am sure all the above brands also will. 

The use of the gas is something also all the above will allow and the welds are nicer looking for sure and do look a lot nicer.  When the temperatures are above 90 degrees outside I put a fan directly behind me blowing into the back of my shield so that the breeze coming inside of my shield helps keep my lens from fogging up also and making me comfortable as I wear a welding jacket and all when working "Under" my bus all this time.  The argon just will not work for me also with the outside winds blowing.  If you are welding inside in a controlled temperature building or do not need a fan on you in case you get "Hot Flashes" then use the gas by all means.  My pretty welds are all covered with RustBullet and you can't tell if they are welds when done or if there is calking in the joints so pretty is not necessary.  They will all pretty much have this option now, with or without gas to use them.  Get a roll of each wire, just a 2 lb. roll, you should get a roll with your machine anyhow.  Then try for your self.  I do not know how much the tanks are to purchase or rent, I will probably never use it on my bus, then again, I may want to make something pretty that everyone will see one day.

Good luck in your decision.  I will agree that the portability of your machine will be a plus, putting in and out of your bus when on the road if you want, but remember you are limited to thickness of welding with it, do not use it on 1/2" stuff, you will never get done.

Stick with the Name brands only.  You will be very happy you did for the $$$ you spend.  NO HF CHINESE STUFF!!!!!!!!!!!!
Gary 

[jjrbus]

Use the Gas!!

Although it's the primary function of shielding gas, keeping the air environment away from the weld is far from its only function. Shielding gas also plays an important role in determining a number of factors in the welding process, including penetration, arc stability, mechanical properties of the finished weld, transfer process and more. In fact, all other variables being the same, shielding gas alone can determine the difference between a good weld and a bad weld. That's also why it is so important to use consumables that effectively direct and protect the shielding gas,