Does Anyone Know if this is Sam Walker at it Again?

[tekebird]

if you recieved a letter that was dated after you actually recieved it keep the envelope/postmark.

and go get your money back.

[JohnEd]

So is the moral here to always have a written contract, deal with licensed contractors and make sure they are bonded.  Can't we put the money in escro and pay on delivery?  Like the Gummint, pay him the interest on the down payment if it is done on time.  Your escro fee would be cheap insurance.

John

[tekebird]

most converison companies, outside of ones who build the million dollar units don't have the cash on hand to be able to build without being paid....at minimum  like draws on a house loan.

Problem is with doing draws is that if they go belly up or stop working on it you have something that may not be servicable to move or take back.

Contract Contract Contract.......reputable business that has something to lose

[JackConrad]

I occasionally do some conversion work for other people at our place.  Since I am a very small operation, I collect up front for the cost of material only. Labor is not collected until job is finished. I do this for a couple reasons, First, if something happens to me and I cannot complete the job, the customer has only paid for the material (which he still has). If I should get "stiffed" by a bad check when customer picks up his bus and settles up (happened to Fred Hobe), I am only out my labor. Just my way, Jack

[Dreamscape]

Jack, You are one of a kind, everyone should do it that way. But that's not how it works sometime. There are always bad apples in the bunch hiding somewhere.

Paul

[captain ron]

When I owned my cabinet shop I always got half down on my jobs. This helped with materials, payroll, overhead and other everyday expenses. Also kept the chances of getting screwed to a minimum or at least 50%. If a customer balks at that I would be scared of him and his ability or intentions to pay at the end. If you don't trust me and my references then go elsewhere.

[makemineatwostroke]

Guys i didn't have a problem with the Co wanting some cash up front I am going to owe X number of dollars any way.The problem I had was not being told that a contract and work date would not start till a deposit was made I could have done this several months ago and my bus would be finished in Jan. if I had been informed about the deposit.Tekebird even the big guys like i am using want money upfront and you give great advice cross your Ts and dot the I and get everything in black and white,most of all communicate with the Co doing the work

[Nick Badame Refrig/ACC]

I will put some input here also,

I have done many levels of work on busses that are mostly friends. Mostly HVAC but many times it's

electrical stuff too. I have done thees jobs with no money up front and with their coaches in my shop.

No problems yet.......However, to do work at a larger level it must require a contract to protect both parties.

When I sell equipment on line or over the phone everything is paid for upfront but usually the buyer is protected

by their credit card.

This is what I think should work for an entire build. Detailed wording of the finishes, appliances, and colors should be worded clearly.

Payment schedule
1- Deposit, will secure a build schedule and agreed amount of time to complete the entire project..."very important"
                       "have an incentive for the builder if he meets the deadlines"
2- Payment #2, Completed rough in of all mechanicals. [If mechanicals are to be done before exterior metal] "inspected by buyer"

3- Payment #3, Installation of mechanical vitals.. including batteries, gensets, inverters, panels, and electronics. "inspected by buyer"

4- Payment #4, Completion of interior finish.. cabnits, partitions, doors, and all surfaces complete!  "inspected by buyer"

5- Payment #5, Installation of appliances including seating, and flooring. "inspected by buyer"

6- Payment #6, completed paint job and final delivery.

If something simular to this is not in place, you are just asking for trouble!

Nick-

[Sean]

When I owned my cabinet shop I always got half down on my jobs. ... If a customer balks at that I would be scared of him and his ability or intentions to pay at the end. If you don't trust me and my references then go elsewhere.

I have a cautionary tale about this:

The cabinetmaker we hired for our bus also requested a 50% deposit, which we paid.  We trusted him, and he had good references, and I am sure he had every intention of finishing the job.

He died before he was halfway through.

Despite a project backlog that would have kept his shop open and his 18 employees working for another six months, his widow closed the business down immediately.  It turned out, though, that his estate did not have even enough assets to pay his back taxes -- the IRS ended up seizing her house.

Bottom line for us:  we never saw a penny of our money, and had to hire a different cabinetmaker to finish the job for nearly as much as the entire original estimate.  The whole fiasco also cost us six months of delay on the conversion, so that was six months of additional fixed-home living expense that we had to pay.  We ended up filing a claim against the estate, which, of course, was not paid.  At least that way we were able to deduct it on our tax return as an "unpaid debt."

I will never again give a sole proprietor a 50% deposit without seeing a surety bond on the results.  Your character, trustworthiness, and references aren't worth squat if you become incapacitated in some way before finishing the job, making me an unsecured creditor at the bottom of the food chain.

FWIW, many states now prohibit licensed contractors from requiring a deposit that high.  More typical and reasonable is a deposit of around 20%, with "progress payments" as the work moves along.

-Sean
http://ourodyssey.blogspot.com