Go Greyhound and leave the driving to us

[Runcutter]

Absolutely right on the 4905's.  I drove and instructed on them in service.  Standard instruction was that if you take a corner in a 35 foot transit (old look or fishbowl) such that your right rear wheel was 6 inches from the curb, the same maneuver in a 40 foot transit would have the right rear wheel hit the curb.  Do the same in a 4903 or 4905 and you'd jump the curb, kill the pedestrians, and hit the building.

Lots of fun in downtown Boston.  Right turn from Tremont to Stuart, to get into the old Trailways Park Square Terminal.  Instruction was drive down Tremont.  Pass Stuart, and when the driver's seat is 1/2 way down the next block, then start to think about turning the steering wheel.

Arthur

[Jim Blackwood]

So I'm curious. For those of you who drove those older buses, or drove a lot of different buses would be better I guess, how did that compare to driving the DL around the corner?

Jim

[Coach_and_Crown_Guy]

So I'm curious. For those of you who drove those older buses, or drove a lot of different buses would be better I guess, how did that compare to driving the DL around the corner?

Jim

I've driven them all including the 4903(the early ones with the tag axle). They eventually got the weight limits raised and did away with the tag axles and GM had a retro kit to remove the tag axle assembly from that third bay and install a floor and turn it into a third luggage bay. It was foreseen so the tag assembly was engineered to simply be unbolted and removed. After a short while GM updated the 4903's with some welcome dash changes and interior lighting enhancements and 'Twang the 4905 was born. They did the same things for the 35ft 4107's and turned them into the 4108. I really liked the dash changes and the other slight modifications to the rest of the bus weren't bad at all.

When making a turn with the 4903's that I drove the most you literally went sideways as you turned since the front wheels were designed to be turned farther than any coach I've ever driven. It almost pivoted around the rear axle. So what you did when making a right turn from the curb lane was to aim directly at the car sitting in his left turn lane and at the very last second, after watching his face get all panicky and start to move over on his front seat, crank the wheel hard over to the stop and that bus would start moving completely to the side with almost no forward motion. I had lots of fun scaring the folks while doing this and once you had the knack of it the 4903/5's were very nice and easy to drive around town. 

BUT there WAS one thing they absolutely sucked at which was that huge long distance in wheelbase between the front and rear axles. They were always begging to get high centered and we did manage to do that unfortunately more times than we all would like to admit. That was the real Achilles heel. Well, the 4-spd manual with it's highway designed gear spacing and rear end ratios made them very ugly when off the level paved highways and byways. Steep driveways, in or out, standard GM solenoid reverse operation, these were the devils we had to contend with and we all made do with them as that was the state of the art and all we knew. We learned to never stop or park them in any situations where you were required to use reverse, in case the solenoid failed. We always stopped/parked so we could leave going forward, and always level or slightly down hill.

As to the question of how they turned when compared to most any MCI offering from the MC5 upward to the current ones today I'd have to say the 4903/5, 4107/8 were unique in their built in very tight turning radius's that GM engineered into them. They were unique even from the previous 4104, 4106 series since they didn't handle that way at all. I'm not kidding when I say they would move almost sideways when turned to the stops. It was very different from other models and came in handy in tight quarters.

I've got way too many years driving DL's and J coaches along with all the others like Van Hooligans which are common in service due to their being lower cost to acquire, but I feel you get what you pay for, but that's just me. I feel they all turn about the same with no real surprises so once you are familiar with one you can deal with them all in a very predictable manner with no unpleasant surprises.

The one thing I really don't like is the design today of the Volvo, Setra, and other European coaches that all seem to have a very long overhang in front of the front axle that seems to ride much lower to the ground as if to find and hit and drag on every little thing it can find. Driveways, dips in the road, most things that are no problem for any MCI or Prevost seem to require the driver to use the built-in coach raising feature to clear the obstacle. That big chin they have is sticking way out just looking for something to hit and hang up on. This isn't my idea of progress at all. It complicates and makes for many chances for driver error to cause damage to, or strand, the bus due to insufficient coach ground clearances. This is a pet peeve of mine lately and why I really only prefer to drive the MCI's when possible. 

For a private owner and his conversion coach I'd caution him to look carefully at where he intends to take and use his coach and whether one of the cheaper to acquire Euro style brands would actually be a good one to use. They may be easier and cheaper to find and buy, they also will have imported and harder to find parts of all kinds, and much more complex systems that will break with great regularity. Go ahead ask me how I know this. One reason I'm not a fan at all of the Van Hooligans. The Euro coaches all seem to suffer from weird (to us here in North America) handling characteristics and clearances.

A good MCI or Prevost is probably worth the extra initial cost when factored against the overall ongoing costs of keeping it repaired and on the road. I'm not sure I can say this so much about the latest and much more complex offerings from MCI and Prevost, as well as all the other brands, due to the excessive meddling by Gov't regulations and laws and such. That's why I'm interested in pre-2000 vintage MCI's in the hope of finding a good vehicle that's solid, simple, repairable, and reliable.

[chessie4905]

Great comments. My 4905 does turn sharper than our former 4104 and ACF Brill. Btw, the Brill had a long wheelbase too. AND manual steering.

[luvrbus]

Passengers side bay doors and skins are in demand around here lol so are gate posts

[windtrader]

OK Clifford, couldn't refuse the bait. lol
story behind each event. two involve "posts", they are very sneaky and jump out from nowhere. one nailed me this season too.

[luvrbus]

A rock where they were using dynamite for hiway construction in Idaho got me, thought I had it made till I heard it hit cost me a 315/80/22.5 Michlin tire too