Before you decide to use an EV as a towed

[richard5933]

Keep in mind that when the gasoline-powered car was first introduced, there were loads of naysayers talking about how absurd and impractical this idea was when gasoline wasn't available at most carriage houses.  Infrastructure changes and grows based on needs and demands - while we're past the official 'early adopter' stage of EVs, the technology and infrastructure still have plenty of maturing to do.

As Milton pointed out above, (unless supercapacitors make some significant leaps) we can expect partial or full battery pack swapping to become a feature sooner than later.  Engineering-wise it's not that complicated to standardize a battery pack design which could be removed and replaced with a fresh one within a timeframe comparable to a gas/diesel fill-up, the various corporations involved just need to come together to make it happen.

I agree - we're definitely in the starting phase of a major transition period. It's just that I hate transition. I'm better at it now than I used to be, but not much.

[dtcerrato]

I'm glad I'm 70 because I never want to own a self driving car nor an EV.

[windtrader]

There is a lot of hoopla and consternation about EV charge stations. EV is a paradigm shift so people need to think differently from fueling a gas vehicle.


Virtually every consumer owned gas car driven on pubic roads has to fuel at a commercial fueling station. So everyone thinks about distance between fueling stops at the gas station.


With an EV, many owners will find charing opportunities everywhere besides a commercial fueling station. Primary option is plugging in at home. Unless you drive more than 300 miles in a day, you simply return home and charge it up, ready for another 300 mile trip the following day.

From a practical standpoint, it is quite reasonable that most drivers drive about 300 miles in a week. So, you just need to plug in and charge up at home a couple of times a week.

It will be very interesting to watch the evolution of public charging stations. My guess is there will be a lot more fueling up at home and not public charging stations.

Naturally, along the major interstates where folks are likely traveling distances, there will be more stations. Just look at the rollout already - they are situated along the major travel routes.

The other development is the fast charger technology called super chargers. They are amazing how much mileage can be added in a very short time.

The fear and anxiety over shortfalls and inconveniences with EV charging will abate as the general public grows more comfortable with how one actually uses and charges an EV differently than a gas vehicle.


For those full time busnuts, EV faces far more real concerns as there is no assumption of a home charger capability and left to the charging options on the road. It will be quite some time, if ever, that charging an EV in the wild will be as convenient and accessible as gas.

[RJ]

It will be quite some time, if ever, that charging an EV in the wild will be as convenient and accessible as gas.

Don -

Some folks have already figured out how to charge their electric car in the wild!

[CrabbyMilton]

There is a lot of hoopla and consternation about EV charge stations. EV is a paradigm shift so people need to think differently from fueling a gas vehicle.


Virtually every consumer owned gas car driven on pubic roads has to fuel at a commercial fueling station. So everyone thinks about distance between fueling stops at the gas station.


With an EV, many owners will find charing opportunities everywhere besides a commercial fueling station. Primary option is plugging in at home. Unless you drive more than 300 miles in a day, you simply return home and charge it up, ready for another 300 mile trip the following day.

From a practical standpoint, it is quite reasonable that most drivers drive about 300 miles in a week. So, you just need to plug in and charge up at home a couple of times a week.

It will be very interesting to watch the evolution of public charging stations. My guess is there will be a lot more fueling up at home and not public charging stations.

Naturally, along the major interstates where folks are likely traveling distances, there will be more stations. Just look at the rollout already - they are situated along the major travel routes.

The other development is the fast charger technology called super chargers. They are amazing how much mileage can be added in a very short time.

The fear and anxiety over shortfalls and inconveniences with EV charging will abate as the general public grows more comfortable with how one actually uses and charges an EV differently than a gas vehicle.


For those full time busnuts, EV faces far more real concerns as there is no assumption of a home charger capability and left to the charging options on the road. It will be quite some time, if ever, that charging an EV in the wild will be as convenient and accessible as gas.

Well said and all excellent points. We will get there eventually but not yet and yes transitions do stink. I will go out on a limb though and say with all of these school bus and transit fleets moving toward EV's you will likely see a big old diesel generator on the property. Not knocking it but until the grid is expanded, what else can they do? Pack a portable generator when you take your EV on a trip that way at least you have some peace of mind anyway.

[chessie4905]

also expect your home electricity rates to sky rocket in coming years. They have to get the money to update the grid somewhere

[richard5933]

...Virtually every consumer owned gas car driven on pubic roads has to fuel at a commercial fueling station. So everyone thinks about distance between fueling stops at the gas station.

...Primary option is plugging in at home. ... So, you just need to plug in and charge up at home a couple of times a week.

...My guess is there will be a lot more fueling up at home and not public charging stations....

I think that your argument is a common one and likely what 'they' are hoping will take place. The major flaw with it is that there are millions of people who don't have a stable, convenient parking location - they live in densely populated urban and near-urban areas and older neighborhoods with street parking. I've lived in places like Milwaukee where it's a constant daily struggle just trying to find a place to park when you come home from work, and that place could be a block or more away from your front door. Even if they install a few charging stations on every block it won't do the trick, because there is no practical way to get cars in/out of the charging stations once every other space on the street is occupied.

Faced with this dilemma, I've heard 'them' say that "They'll be able to charge at work". Really? Who's going to pay to install all these charging stations in low-wage workplace parking lots? What about the people who street park again at work?

"But they can just charge when they go to the grocery store." Okay, how's this going to work? Mom and two little kids need to run to the store for their groceries - now she's going to have to find a grocery store with a charging station open near her house, and she'll have to stay in the store long enough for the charge. Hopefully the discount supermarkets are going to join in on the fun and install charging stations. No more running in to shop quickly and get back out.

My point is that even for people who simply use their cars for commuting to/from work there will need to be a viable charging network where drivers are confident that they'll be able to charge up when needed. And to make it widely accepted across the spectrum the charging needs to be as easy and available as filling a gas tank is right now.

I know that there is lots of work to be done, and that more charging stations are being added. But if we're talking about EVs replacing ICE vehicles over the next decades it will have to be done in a way which meets the needs of all people who currently have ICE vehicles, and to me an ad hoc system which grows piecemeal is not the best way to go if one of the goals is to give people the confidence they need to know reliable charging options exist.

[chessie4905]

there is talk about inductive? charging driving down the road. Interesting concept. Issues like living near power lines issues come to mind. But they'll  get it all worked out over time. Since the transition will be more like 50 years, there will be time to deal with the hurdles. Oil will definitely be declining in supply, so it time for the change. Cliff probably remembers when everything was operated with horses. lol That got worked out in time.

[dtcerrato]

Don -

Some folks have already figured out how to charge their electric car in the wild!

Lol, just strap it to the roof and leave it on (I mean there!)

[lovetofix]

Lol, just strap it to the roof and leave it on (I mean there!)

And put a 15 gallon gasoline tank in the trunk. Then you can just fill up when you head out and charge while you drive.

[richard5933]

there is talk about inductive? charging driving down the road. Interesting concept. Issues like living near power lines issues come to mind. But they'll  get it all worked out over time. Since the transition will be more like 50 years, there will be time to deal with the hurdles. Oil will definitely be declining in supply, so it time for the change. Cliff probably remembers when everything was operated with horses. lol That got worked out in time.

I like the concept of inductive charging, but two things come to mind. The first is the efficiency of inductive vs. plugged in charging, and how much loss there will be across a national fleet of vehicles charged this way.

The other is whether or not there will be any danger for people near the inductive charging area, especially people with cardiac implants, pacemakers, etc.

[Dave5Cs]

By the time they get it figured out there will be something else new and exiting to power cars or spaceships. Who knows.

The problem right now is they tell us this all is to stop greenhouse gasing and make a smaller footprint Blah blah blah?
But is you talk to the people in the know they say to produce all this power for these cars that you still will have coal fired plants and Nuclear power plants all with pollution and or bi-products that will last for millions of years even buried in the hole in Utah. So it really is not stopping anything but some oil use and replacing it with dirty coal etc.

You will still need lubrication  also on a lot of things as well as Plastics which take oil to make.

[chessie4905]

yeah, but the touchy Feely good part will be there. like saving all the trees so they can burn down, meat substitutes that have all the additives to save the cows and chickens.

[richard5933]

I don't have any problems accepting that EVs will result is less energy use overall. There is an inherent efficiency in a centralized production system. Of course, this depends on having a modern distribution system capable of transmitting the power without excessive loss along the way.

Surely having a centralized plant making electrons move is more efficient than having millions of small little power plants running all over the place.

I think of similar to large complexes like university campuses which heat using a centralized steam plant rather than installing lots of smaller boilers all over the place to produce steam.

That said, it is true that it will not totally reduce oil consumption for production and manufacturing.

[Jim Blackwood]

Ah, for the days... when you went to the drug store and bought a gallon can of petrol.

Jim