Bus vs Super C

chessie4905 · September 26, 2021, 12:15:53 PM

they won't be scared away much if the 6.5 diesel forum is any indicator. people buying them in even junk condition to find out what the naysayers said was true. They plow ahead anyway.

richard5933 · September 26, 2021, 01:08:16 PM

Guess it's important to reiterate that some of us sought out an older 2-stroke bus because we wanted an older bus. Style wise, the older fleets had much more going for them than the newer smooth-sided squared off designs in my opinion.

For certain getting an older bus means more maintenance and repairs, but avoid those by getting a newer bus defeats the desire of having/driving an older bus.

Kind of like when I did a frame-off restoration on a '66 MGB. I could have bought a modern 2-seat sports car for lots less than I spent, but then I wouldn't have a '66 MGB.

I'm willing to trade off modern driving conveniences for vintage styling. Does that make me nuttier than someone converting a modern bus? Possibly.

Back to the Super C side of this, there are lots of vintage trucks which would be great candidates for conversion into a motor home, and one real advantage to using a vintage truck as a starting point is the ease of swapping drivetrain and suspension components when compared to working with a vintage bus.

someguy · September 26, 2021, 01:27:48 PM

Quote from: richard5933 on September 26, 2021, 01:08:16 PM
Guess it's important to reiterate that some of us sought out an older 2-stroke bus because we wanted an older bus. Style wise, the older fleets had much more going for them than the newer smooth-sided squared off designs in my opinion.

Great. You make decisions, you pays your money and you take your chances. Older, shiny sided buses come with older 2 stroke diesel engines with questionable reliability. If that is your trade off, then that is your trade off.

QuoteBack to the Super C side of this, there are lots of vintage trucks which would be great candidates for conversion into a motor home, and one real advantage to using a vintage truck as a starting point is the ease of swapping drivetrain and suspension components when compared to working with a vintage bus.

There won't be much difference swapping into a truck versus an older bus. Bus swaps are harder because the 2 strokes are shorter and the radiators aren't standard. Other than that, a swap is a swap.

windtrader · September 26, 2021, 03:50:50 PM

Starting with a moving box truck to do a DIY Super C conversion is most likely to be limited to what's available in the used market, 26' is the max for a used box truck. Naturally, there are always exceptions but odds are 26' will be the max.

Comparing a 26' box truck to a run of the mill 40' bus, there is a major difference in usable interior space. Plus for a bus. Comparing apples to apples, then the bus would need to be a 4 stroke (i.e Series 60 or similar). Service on the engine and transmission are the same. Suspension is different and most other components are not shared.

With the vastly greater number of used 26' box trucks on the road, odds are one can drive one into nearly all general truck repair shop and get parts and service. Buses, as we know, take a fair bit of hunting to find a reputable shop near home. Plus goes to Super C for ease and cost of maintenance.

Acquisition costs. Did no research on the box truck prices vs bus prices but guessing box truck can be had for less than a similar bus with Series 60/Allision drives. Plus goes to Super C

Mileage. From comments it seems a box truck/Super C will get a few miles better mileage than a bus. Plus goes to SuperC.

More pluses to Super C but somehow personally, I still like my bus. lol

Melbo · September 26, 2021, 04:17:32 PM

I like my MC8 with the L10. It's a four stroke and no electronics. I have no heat issues and it is very basic.

It is not the race car some people here want but it is a pleasure to drive and we like the setup.

To each their own.

Melbo

luvrbus · September 27, 2021, 04:50:20 AM

The 2000 dollar liner kit are the fresh rebuilds in buses with less than 10,000 miles since a so called rebuild engine people buy and most don't even make it home.Liner kits are a bandage just money wasted to get by,if you are going to rebuild one do it right the 1st time because later you end up doing it anyways.those kits some are just junk,to each his own as they say

Jim Blackwood · September 27, 2021, 07:31:51 AM

Richard. your MGB resto wasn't a "frame off" because the MGB is unibody. Do you participate on the MGE or BritishV8 forums?

Probably right about the Mayflower conversion. Getting that through a campsite would be a challenge. Might need a scout car.

Jim

Tedsoldbus · September 27, 2021, 07:52:06 AM

I think I went ga ga and purchased our 1980 shorty Prevost, because as I age, I long for an earlier time. When my nieces and nephews come to visit us at the lake, they stare at their phones......aaaall day. Can barely get them in the boat. Watch an old FMCA meet video. Such a different time. When I start up the 6V92, that some of you are sure is about to blow up on a back road or bad neighborhood, I still like it. It still has rivets holding the sides on. It is stainless steel when they could still afford to build them that way. We only take short trips so I won't be getting towed from N Dakota. Just not afraid of it. Love to fix the things I can. Pay for what I can't. It just feels good to look at it, and helps me with my "oldness". I'm 64 now. I'll be 70 in a few years. Anyone got a nice looking Flxible I can just park in the driveway when I hit 70? Doesn't even need to run....
Tha's why I have a bus.

Busted Knuckle · September 27, 2021, 07:58:35 AM

Someguy I'd really like to meet you and talk face to face sometime.
Your knowledge of EVERYTHING surpasses GOOGLE and it would be nice to sit down and enjoy a coke, beer or coffee with such a genius.
You ain't getting squat with a $2000 overhaul kit.
An I wanna see this truck rear end swap when yer done!
I'm really interested in seeing this bus your building in person too!

BK

richard5933 · September 27, 2021, 08:56:04 AM

Quote from: Jim Blackwood on September 27, 2021, 07:31:51 AM
Richard. your MGB resto wasn't a "frame off" because the MGB is unibody. Do you participate on the MGE or BritishV8 forums?

Probably right about the Mayflower conversion. Getting that through a campsite would be a challenge. Might need a scout car.

Jim

I think you know what I mean here. Hopefully you are joking, cause if we're at the point of policing grammar and the use of generic terms like "frame off" something is out of whack. To clarify, my brother and I did a restoration removing everything and everything that could be removed, restoring and/or replacing as needed before putting it back together. Took us a couple of years and we had a great time.

6805eagleguy · September 27, 2021, 11:25:18 AM

Quote from: someguy on September 26, 2021, 10:53:42 AM
A 6V92 overhaul kit is $2000. https://www.ebay.com/itm/220423672040?hash=item33524650e8:g:LJgAAOSwszZa2f1f

And the other side of the coin is that no modern diesel engine is inexpensive to rebuild. A Cummins ISB is probably the cheapest. You can't even get parts for Ford 6.0 and 6.4s anymore. A Ford 6.7 is worn out in 250,000 miles if you are working it and they are very expensive (for a pickup truck) to rebuild - $15K and up.

I stand by my statement that the best RV conversion platform is a modern coach with a Series 60.

Cough. No offense,just a small fact check. My company runs countless 6.7 powerstrokes. The entire range, 2011 to 2021. I drive a 2012, but that's besides the point. The 11/12 engines had occasional valve problems, we had a 11 break a chunk of valve of 2 months ago, fresh engine being installed for 9 grand. This is a 350k truck. To get 15 k would have to be brand new everything. Turbo, long block, fuel system etc. pray tell what happens at 250k because we have a lot of trucks just crossing that mark or already crossed in the past few years

Jim Blackwood · September 27, 2021, 11:58:17 AM

Very nice Richard. But don't look back, we of the "Modified" class are gaining on you. Of course I have no doubt you would consider it a travesty to engine swap a '66 and in some ways I agree, yet some do.

And with that perspective in mind, I have no doubt that engine swapping an early bus is possible. But as we like to point out, just because it's possible doesn't make it a good idea. A lot of things have to line up both literally and figuratively, and I suspect the cost would just be out of bounds in almost all cases. So the choice becomes looks or performance. And there's nothing new about that.

Jim

someguy · September 27, 2021, 02:57:13 PM

Quote from: 6805eagleguy on September 27, 2021, 11:25:18 AM

Cough. No offense,just a small fact check. My company runs countless 6.7 powerstrokes. The entire range, 2011 to 2021. I drive a 2012, but that's besides the point. The 11/12 engines had occasional valve problems, we had a 11 break a chunk of valve of 2 months ago, fresh engine being installed for 9 grand. This is a 350k truck. To get 15 k would have to be brand new everything. Turbo, long block, fuel system etc. pray tell what happens at 250k because we have a lot of trucks just crossing that mark or already crossed in the past few years

Where did you get your engine for $9K ? Does that include labor ?

My buddy runs a fleet of F350s. He trades them at 150K. Turbo assemblies are expensive. The fuel system is prone to grenade. Pump, lines and injectors are $4500. The fuel cooler is prone to fail. The air to water intercooler fails.

Ford builds great transmissions, bodies and frames. Their engines are horrifically complicated. Just open the hood on a 2011+ PSD.