Bus wont start

[joedelauter]

The picture on top looks like our engine.
I will go out and get a picture of the engine with the doors open and send it too you.

Also could use some help with finding an adapter for the port to plug into to run diagnostics.
Will take a picture that and send it to you. 
Wont be able to get that to you til later this afternoon.

Appreciate your help and support and technical insight.  (way beyond my understanding)

[jraynor]

The picture on top looks like our engine.
I will go out and get a picture of the engine with the doors open and send it too you.

Also could use some help with finding an adapter for the port to plug into to run diagnostics.
Will take a picture that and send it to you. 
Wont be able to get that to you til later this afternoon.

Appreciate your help and support and technical insight.  (way beyond my understanding)

if your motor is like the top picture that is the Non-DDEC so you shouldn't have a port for diagnostics

[joedelauter]

Oh - well, guess i may have been led down a path.  Was told that it is/was a DDEC.  The mechanic that we get help from said it was not a mechanical system but an electronic one.
Will get the pictures and send them to you later today to help bring clarity, truth and hopefully some closure to my lack of knowledge.

[buswarrior]

Hold fire 'til we get a picture...

Why am I reminded of a fire arms acquisition class where a participant didn't know what a trigger was?

joedelauter, please be careful you don't hurt yourself with that coach, your posts are scaring me.

happy coaching!
buswarrior

[Dave5Cs]

If grounding number two on the relay starts it then you know its the neutral switch if it doesn't start then I would bet its the Ice Cube relay that you just pull out from the neutral relay and replace. I just went through this and that was all it was.

Part # MCI 7C-5-24 (original relay) there is 4 of them on board.

New one=ALB700HA32Z24 RelayPlatt electric normally  24.00 each. I got them for 15.89 only because they found my old account I forgot I had and I told them Grainger had them for less. LOL
Another number for it is;700-HA32Z24 TUBE BASE RELAY 24VDC

[jraynor]

Ok so the engine is a DDEC. Joe sent me the picture and I have attached it below.

Should still be able to "jump" the neutral switch via the method described. Only thing I would be weary of is if the bus is in gear or not and you try to start it and it try to move. Yes the parking brake should be engaged but you won't be able to shut down the Detroit until it has air pressure to push the stop lever on the governor.

Another question is, does anyone know where the port to connect to for diagnostics is? Maybe under the front seat? That's what Joe is thinking. I'll let him chime in

[luvrbus]

That is a transplant engine no telling it may not have 1 just the SEL and CEL on the dash,now the DDEC ll is out of the way he needs to look on the drivers side of the transmission and see if we are dealing with a electronic Allison 700 series like a 741 if so they don't have a neutral switch     

[jraynor]

That is a transplant engine no telling it may not have 1 just the SEL and CEL on the dash,now the DDEC ll is out of the way he needs to look on the drivers side of the transmission and see if we are dealing with a electronic Allison 700 series like a 741 if so they don't have a neutral switch   

It's not an electronic shift pad. It has the same shift tower like mine. I've attached the pictures below. He did send me 1 picture of some cover under the driver's seat. Anyone know what that is?

[joedelauter]

Will wait for the mechanic to look at the wiring for the switch and whether to try to jump it.
Not keen on it starting and not being able to shut the motor off.

There is a box next to the shift tower and under the driver seat.   steel cover plate, with flip lid/door.
With the new seat installed, the mounting bracket impedes being able to get the lid open.  Will have the mechanic look at that to see how he can get it open. 
One issue, the mechanic looked at the box before, and he does not have an adapter that matches the plug in this unit.   I do not know what the plug looks like, so that is another task to get clarified.

I think i will need to get more information from the bus company that I purchased this from.  They may have not given me all the information on this bus that i should have received.

Any other advice of things i should do or get answered, let me know.

[niles500]

If it's a DDEC it should shut down with no fuel and not have to rely on air pressure to shut down - FWIW

[sledhead]

the box that is under the seat that has a flip up door is the connection for the DDEC cable connection .there is one in the driver side last bay up at the tunnel as well

dave

[luvrbus]

? if he hasn't found the port why is he looking for a cable or adapter,the DDEC ll is not hard to find a cable link for.The DDEC ll showed uses the J1708 protcol,you can buy the cable everywhere for 30 bucks   

[joedelauter]

Thank you guys,
Very helpful - and also educational.  The Mechanic is backed up for a couple of days, so it will be Thursday until i can get him out to help with all of this.
Thanks again

[Templar52]

On your transmission,you should have two switches. One for the back up lights and one for the neutral switch. Simply jump them to see which one is the neutral. Whent jumped,the engine should start. If it not start,the neutral switch is not in cause. Check you FUEL switch on your secondary filter.

[Iceni John]

If it's a DDEC it should shut down with no fuel and not have to rely on air pressure to shut down - FWIW

DDEC II will shut down if you cut electrical power to it.   Just turn the start batteries off, and the engine will stop because there's no power for the injectors.   Simple!

John