Serta -vs- MCI -vs- Vanhool

[Dlsnow]

I am looking at busses and have been absolutely convinced that for a conversion MCI was the only way to go - but there are so many good deals out there on Serta and Vanhools.

My intentions are to make it a shell and build it to live in for a couple years at a time with family.

Last one I did was an MCI MC7 and there were some challenges I would like to avoid.
Challenges
1. Ceiling to floor height changes over the length of the bus
2. Round ceiling corners
3. I tow an enclosed car hauler and the MC7 has an 8v71 - slow over the hills

I would like to get opinions on the Serta and Vanhools as there seem to be options.  My family and I have loved traveling in the MC7 aside from the couple breakdowns that turned into adventures anyways.  So we are more willing to make a bigger investment and get something more modern like maybe a 1995 or newer.

[chessie4905]

Check their parts availability down the road and prices. Back in the day International school busses almost made the bid for low cost. They made it up in the price of parts they sold to you down the road.

[buswarrior]

volume of potential survivors?

Penetration of your chosen marque across the continent?

and in 20-30 years, the volume of old men then who might have apprenticed on your coach model as young men today?

For instance, the 2-stroke crowd will be safe for as long as those still young armed forces trained mechanics are alive.

I doubt there will be a Setra following like the Flxible crowd?

happy coaching!
buswarrior

[lostagain]

MCI and Prevost are the top two, in quality, parts available and service. I would go with a 102 D or newer


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[eagle19952]

elder Setra and Vanhool are probably as close to the bottom of the converters choice list as one can get.

[belfert]

The older Setras have a dropped aisle that takes a LOT of work to make a flat floor.  I suspect the new Setras are still pretty pricey.

The older Van Hools rusted very badly.  I saw one at ABC companies that had so much rust I don't know how it made it to the sale yard.  The engine door hinges were even wired together!  That Van Hool said it had a new interior.  The interior was probably the only thing worth anything as the rest was scrap.  Most of the other Van Hools had enough rust and corrosion to scare me away.,

[DoubleEagle]

To make the poll more precise, I would add GM, Eagle, Flxible, Crown, and Prevost, and then you might not need "other". You can drop Serta, they just make mattresses.  

[B_K]

Yes SERTA is a mattress SETRA is a bus!
Everybody will tell you all kinds of this and that about SETRA's but when they are done telling all the bad things about them ask them how many of them have they owned and when did they get rid of their last one!
Yes they have pros and cons just like any other make!
Personally I love them as they are the sports cars of buses! Independent front suspension, steering tag axle, driver sits down low like in a pick up or van, an many other cool features! Yes the S215 and S217 did have a drop aisle as Brian says, but I don't remember how his turned out. (OH wait he never bought one, he bought a DINA which is the exact same bus I traded off for the Neoplan I have)
People will tell you "Oh you can't do this or that!" But they never tried so does that mean it can't be done?
Don't get me wrong there are things that have to be done differently to convert a different brand of buses, but that doesn't make them a bad bus to convert.

Parts can be bought straight from MCI as they now handle Setra's North American operations. And I have never had a problem getting any part for an S215 or S217, don't get me started on the DINA or the newer Setra S417's though I had plenty of problems getting those parts!

I don't care if my SETRA sells or not, if it doesn't I will either convert it, or part it out for way more than I am asking for it whole!

OH yeah Setra is designed by Kassboro who was the original designer and manufacture of the Eagle!

  BK 

[chessie4905]

You are incorrect, it is the second sports car of busses.....4106 was the first.
BK is right though, talk to present and former owners to see if it is a good candidate.
Try to purchase a brand and model that had a large representation in the bus business. Think down the road 20 years.... How are parts going to be obtained....how many items are Setra or Vanhool specific.
GM's were quite popular because of their volume, and parts were easy to obtain and  inexpensive. Not so much anymore as they got out of the business, same with Eagles to a lesser extent. MCI's and Prevosts are quite popular now and into future as long as THEY don't go out. I don't know how many Setras and Vanhools are out there.
The new business tax laws recently passed might effect how competitive they may still be. Just thoughts on this end.

[buswarrior]

They ALL run out.

Witness the GM experience

Everything was fine, for as long as the components were still being used. 15 years ago, there were V730 rebuilts on shelves, and rotating thru wrecking yards.

Then they stopped being put in buses and/or Allison stopped making them.

The 730 almost immediately became a hot potatoe to get rid of before you were left holding the bag...

Commercial viability is key to parts availability.

Get out the crystal ball and make your best guess?

Happy coaching!
Buswarrior

[luvrbus]

You need to watch the vintage of VanHools you are considering they can be a rust bucket with plenty of electrical issues,they are a nice looking bus though the taper from the bottom to the roof could deal a person misery converting one.
Parts are terribly expensive for VanHools and the Setra because of the running gear is not the standard American issue.
Check the MCI D's careful the early models can have rust problems also and buy from the west coast if possible,parts for the D will be around for a long time the last I read over 15,000 were produced and sold more than Prevost total ever manufactured    

[belfert]

I apparently struck a nerve with Bryce over the Setra.  I looked at every brand except GM and Bluebird when I was looking for a bus to convert.  (Yes, I even looked at a Neoplan.)  I looked at a Setra during my search and I visited a guy converting one.  If you want a flat floor they require quite a bit of fabrication, or some have incorporated the raised seating area into their design.  No, I have not owned one, but I have looked at them and can tell you why I wouldn't own one.

I wouldn't suggest to anyone they buy a Dina either unless they really want a torsion suspension instead of air bags.  The torsion suspension is about the only thing I like about my Dina.  It is getting to be nearly impossible to find parts that were not used on other vehicles.  Things like spindles and hubs have not been available for at least several years.  I needed a new wheel stud for the tag axle last year and MCI at least still has them, but something like $20 each instead of $3 to $4 each for truck wheel studs.  Around the time MCI filed for bankruptcy they sold off a lot of old parts to a company called Vintage Parts.  This included some of the Dina parts.

I bought my Dina because it was the most affordable coach bus at the time with a Series 60 and a B500 transmission.  I might have been better off spending the extra money for a different brand that is more widely supported.  I would probably get an MCI D series if I was starting out today.

[luvrbus]

LOL I know all about the 20 dollar studs from MCI,I finally found some for 15 bucks ea

[Jeremy]

My favourite bus has always been Vanhool, although I've never owned one - but I love the looks and I love how ambitious they are in design terms - glazed roofs, aerodynamic roofs, quad-axles, articulated double-deckers. They're spaceships compared to 95% of the passenger-carrying boxes on the road that call themselves buses.

My own bus is a humble Plaxton but it does have both a dropped-aisle and curved / tapering sides - neither of which will cause any problems at all during a conversion unless you are seriously lacking in fabrication skills - in which case forget buses altogether and buy yourself an off-the-shelf motorhome.

Jeremy

[belfert]

I built my entire conversion without being a fabricator.  I had to weld in a few pieces and got friends to do the welding as I don't know how to weld.  It was nothing nearly as complex as dealing with a dropped aisle.