Trip ends in tragedy

[akroyaleagle]

"Ifs, Ands, Buts, Wouldas, Shoudas, Couldas, we didn't have enough points." (This quote was made by Raider player John Matuzak (s)) when asked by a reporter, post game, why they lost. I hope I remembered it close enough some 40 years later.

This thread has provoked a vast amount of opinions.

My contribution was my opinion and what I felt could be added to it. Yours may differ.

We are each responsible for our own actions.

Outhouse lawyers aside, There was a huge interest in this accident because it involved one of our own. Dash camera discussion followed. The poster published his video. I'm confident he did so to better relay to us what happened.

I choose to live my life with an upbeat. I choose to be optimistic in my belief: "...reasonable men" will prevail.
I too, can cite examples of this not always being the case. We hear of those every time. We do not often hear of the many times justice did prevail. That's why we have Appellate and Supreme Courts.

I too, have a Million dollar Umbrella Policy, for the reasons cited and more.

All lawyers are not created equal. I would retain one that I felt could best represent me. Truth is, I probably wouldn't have the opportunity. My insurance would decide how they would handle everything. I agreed to that when I obtained their insurance.

I think if you do not have your investment documented with the insurer and the original receipts in your safe (not located in the coach), you do not have a prayer of recovering enough. Every action you can produce documents to prove enhances your chances. YOU are your best lawyer! If you don't, you are remiss, IMO.

I too started out with "Agreed" value. They never asked for pictures. It was expensive and the company kept raising my rates. I reached the point where "that warm fuzzy feeling" in our "deal" did not exist and changed companies.

As most of my experience dictates, someone was looking out for me. USAA, that for whatever reason, decided they would enter the conversion market. We had our interchange and they asked me for photos to see what they were about to insure. I complied and they agreed to cover it. I asked them about improvements I foresaw and they advised me to keep receipts. When major improvements were made, I advised them, furnished photos, and we adjusted the cost of the Policy to reflect that. We have a relationship that goes back nearly fifty years. I was taught very young to "Dance with the one that brung me". Every dealing I have had with them, not just insurance but investments and banking, has reflected our mutual trust. I do have that warm, fuzzy, feeling where they are concerned and pertaining to the coach, that's been more than 20 years. I have never in our time together submitted a claim that I caused or could have prevented. I have had claims. I ran a bass boat through a ladies kitchen once in Texas. That is a story best related over a camp fire. If you qualify for them, you should investigate their firm. It is First Class!

All of us have opinions and experiences, some more than others.

Please, let's not forget there are many silent "Wanna bes" and folks new to this madness that inflicts us. Our inputs sometimes don't have the effect we desire on them.

I want as many of them to come as possible! There may come a time I am in need of a few "reasonable" men. At least I might be portrayed as not the only one mad!

[luvrbus]

I have carried 1 mil liability since 1982 it doesn't cost that more and insurance co lawyers will fight for you to save a million, for $15,000 they will throw you under the bus.
This is not bus related by no means it is sad when I have to have insurance on a vacant piece of property, the City of Scottsdale makes us carry 1 mil on a piece of property to protect the public they say, if some fool runs off the road and hits a cactus or mesquite tree why should I be responsible when he or she has no business on our property   

[akroyaleagle]

"Insurance co lawyers will fight for you to save a million, for $15,000 they will throw you under the bus"



AMEN to that Clifford.

When you get a chance, I would appreciate the new phone number. Else, Frankie and I might show up like hobos on your porch and Sonya might run us off with her broom.

[luvrbus]

Joe, my old phone number is supposed to be working by Friday but I will PM my cell number.lol yea I did break down and get a cell phone

[Zephod]

Enough with the fear mongering.

I turned off a while ago. Several threads are full of ludicrous fear mongering. Just too many people with too much time posting rather than thinking or doing.

The original video of the dash cam was excellent and I forwarded the link to the safety director at my workplace fir the next safety meeting.

Coincidentally I had something similar begin to happen today. I was driving at 40mph with a fully loaded school bus around the outside of a 45mph bend. A car came over the double yellow lines into my lane. I had nowhere to swerve to. No point in sounding the horn (I regard the horn as being a fairly useless invention). I braked hard enough to slow my vehicle but not hard enough to injure my passengers. Fortunately the car driver got his head out of his damn phone and steered himself out of danger. I was expecting a collision.

Now, in my happening today.... I was covered by the camera recording the guy coming over the double yellow line. I had shown I was trying to avoid the collision by braking. I had avoided liability for injuring my passengers by not panic braking. I didn't have much warning either. He was 50-75 feet away when he began to encroach on my lane.



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[luvrbus]

I see that the video has been deleted from U Tube which is probably good IMO and I think you used bad judgement in forwarding his video

[Zephod]

I see that the video has been deleted from U Tube which is probably good IMO and I think you used bad judgement in forwarding his video

No. It had educational value. It showed what the effect of a car hitting a bus could be, including loss of control while highlighting that brakes should be used rather than horn.


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[DKO]

If an attorney stopped at the limits of your liability policy it would be one thing but those guys check your assets and go for those when they drain the limits stated on your policy,the insurance co is only liable for the terms written out on your policy if it exceeds that he going for you not the insurance co.

Clifford,

If they sue me, collect from my insurance, decide that is not enough and then go after my assets, they are going to be sorely disappointed. The bus is the most expensive thing I own by a long shot.

Once it is totaled, maybe they will not want it.

Davy

[DoubleEagle]

I see that the video has been deleted from U Tube which is probably good IMO and I think you used bad judgement in forwarding his video

I'm glad Richard deleted the video, but I'm surprised that no one has commented on what I saw in the video about the movement of the bus. I guess the whole situation is a little too difficult to think about, but it is an important lesson for us all.

[kyle4501]

I'm glad Richard deleted the video, but I'm surprised that no one has commented on what I saw in the video about the movement of the bus. I guess the whole situation is a little too difficult to think about, but it is an important lesson for us all.

I saw in the video that the bus stayed in his lane until impact.

I did call my insurance agent today - my policy is for appraised value at the time of claim. I was also told that receipts showing improvements & upgrades would add to the value.
YMMV

[gumpy]

I'm glad Richard deleted the video, but I'm surprised that no one has commented on what I saw in the video about the movement of the bus. I guess the whole situation is a little too difficult to think about, but it is an important lesson for us all.

I saw what you mentioned (even before you mentioned it) regarding the bus maintaining course and lane. I also saw a wide pavement shoulder and what may or may not have been a soft gravel shoulder. Then I watched it over and over, and in slow motion and the most critical thing I saw (without factoring in the distortion of distance caused by the wide angle camera, was that from the time the car crossed the line until impact was less than 3 seconds. I don't know if he applied the brakes in that 3 seconds. That's not evident in the video, but in 3 seconds, I would not expect to see movement to the right. It takes a minimum of 2 seconds to even process that this car is coming way over the line, which is out of the normal, and there's a potential for a collision and another full second to react. Do you automatically begin evasive action every time some nitwit encroaches on the center line when meeting? I don't because I have some trust in fellow drivers and past experiences have shown that they are generally going to correct and get over, or at the least just run a tire down the line which I can still avoid with minimal action.

3 seconds! I don't think he did anything wrong.

[DoubleEagle]

I saw what you mentioned (even before you mentioned it) regarding the bus maintaining course and lane. I also saw a wide pavement shoulder and what may or may not have been a soft gravel shoulder. Then I watched it over and over, and in slow motion and the most critical thing I saw (without factoring in the distortion of distance caused by the wide angle camera, was that from the time the car crossed the line until impact was less than 3 seconds. I don't know if he applied the brakes in that 3 seconds. That's not evident in the video, but in 3 seconds, I would not expect to see movement to the right. It takes a minimum of 2 seconds to even process that this car is coming way over the line, which is out of the normal, and there's a potential for a collision and another full second to react. Do you automatically begin evasive action every time some nitwit encroaches on the center line when meeting? I don't because I have some trust in fellow drivers and past experiences have shown that they are generally going to correct and get over, or at the least just run a tire down the line which I can still avoid with minimal action.

3 seconds! I don't think he did anything wrong.

Yes, there was no movement to the right for whatever reason, but there was slight movement to the left as he braked and blew the horn. If he had time to begin braking, he might have also had time to move to the right a little. The driver of the car had the time to wake up or stop texting to pull back to his lane (just not far enough). No judgments about right or wrong, just trying to analyze what happened. Now that the video is gone, speculation will come to an end. As far as taking action when potential danger becomes evident goes, yes, I begin to be prepared to take action at the least. Assuming that someone crossing the center-line will return is a dangerous gamble, they deserve the horn or flashing lights at least.

[eagle19952]

every instruction i ever got was you stay in your lane.
he did.

[Brassman]

Yeah he did no wrong and did as well as he could in a bad situation. Sometimes people die when they do wrong. A two-lane highway is just that kind of place -- you have just a few feet between you and death.

[Zephod]

every instruction i ever got was you stay in your lane.
he did.

Yes. The loss of control though was due to his hand being on the horn rather than both hands on the wheel. Having said that, it's debatable as to whether both hands firmly grasping the wheel and hard braking would have affected the outcome greatly.

The important thing is he did something. He sounded the horn. While my reaction is always to brake and lock the wheel rather than to sound the horn, it really depends on your training. I'm not a fan of the horn button being in the center of the steering wheel. I prefer the European idea of having it on the end of a control stem.


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