My first case of 'user error'

richard5933 · August 31, 2017, 03:22:06 PM

I guess that it was inevitable, but today I had my first case of damage by user error. Drove a while with the hand brake engaged. It happened because I had to stop halfway down my driveway when a door swung open and I stopped to fasten it down. Guess the interruption to my normal routine was enough for me to skip a step. When I finally noticed the brake was on I stopped to check things over. I realized that the hand brake would not hold the bus anymore. Ah oh! That can't be good...

Long story short, when I got home I blocked the bus and found the hand brake adjusting point. A few turns on this and everything seems to be good again. The hand brake engages after only a few clicks on the ratchet, and once engaged seems to hold the bus still just fine.

I had thought that the thing wasn't fully adjusted before this happened since it took quite a few clicks on the ratchet before engaging, and I'm guessing that if the bus rolled along so nicely it couldn't have been set too firmly prior to my error.

Question?? Is there supposed to be a tell tale light that indicates when the hand brake is set? Seems like that would be a good idea for the next time I forget to look left...

For safety's sake, I did make an appointment next week to have the bus put on the lift at the shop so that they can fully inspect to be sure that I haven't caused damage to the hand brake or worn it to the point it needs new shoes. They'll also confirm that everything is adjusted properly.

I feel stupid for having done this, but at least it's something that should be recoverable.

Richard

Iceni John · August 31, 2017, 03:59:43 PM

My concern would be about overheating the brake and possibly causing a fire. It probably wouldn't be difficult to put a microswitch on either the brake lever (it is a mechanical brake, yes?) or brake itself, and a bright red light on the dash somewhere, maybe a flashing light or with a buzzer as well.

John

richard5933 · August 31, 2017, 04:05:10 PM

John - Apparently the brake must not have been adjusted too well to begin with, as there wasn't even the usual smell that comes from overheated brakes.

I also thought of doing some type of light, but right now I'm thinking of something more along the lines of what is done with aircraft. A bright red strip of fabric which is connected on one end to the brake lever/handle with a clip on the other end. I can just loop it through the steering wheel and clip it back to itself when I set the brake. Maybe this will force me to get into the habit of checking the brake. before going anywhere.

Richard

Zephod · August 31, 2017, 04:13:56 PM

Your bus should NOT move with the parking brake applied - no matter how hard you press the accelerator. This is a standard test with all school busses. If you can move it with the parking break applied you shut it off, call a mechanic and take a spare bus.

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bigred · August 31, 2017, 04:26:32 PM

My first motor home was a 75 Winnebago Brave .It had the adjustment knob on the end of the lever and also had a light .I can't list the times I for got to release the parking brake on that thing.(and that was back when I could actually remember things )LOL

TomC · September 01, 2017, 08:23:53 AM

This is one good argument for switching to Maxi-brakes. My bus will not move until parking brake is released. And-it will just about put you through the windshield if applied while moving (as a test). Good Luck, TomC

RJ · September 01, 2017, 10:00:27 AM

Richard -

On the 4106 I owned, the fast idle wouldn't engage unless the handbrake was on.

Find that circuit and tap into it for your light.

Simple!

FWIW & HTH. . .

Gary Hatt - Publisher BCM · September 01, 2017, 12:38:00 PM

Gone are the good-ole-days when I used to drive Mack trucks that allowed you to adjust the spring tension on the cable directly on the handle as bigred alluded to. Guess that required you to have some common sense when using the parking break.

eagle19952 · September 01, 2017, 05:47:27 PM

Quote from: Zephod on August 31, 2017, 04:13:56 PM
Your bus should NOT move with the parking brake applied - no matter how hard you press the accelerator. This is a standard test with all school busses. If you can move it with the parking break applied you shut it off, call a mechanic and take a spare bus.

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IF you cannot adjust your own clutch and brakes..u have no business sitting in the seat.

richard5933 · September 01, 2017, 06:19:52 PM

Quote from: eagle19952 on September 01, 2017, 05:47:27 PM
IF you cannot adjust your own clutch and brakes..u have no business sitting in the seat.

Don't know if I totally agree with you on this, but generally speaking I think I get your message. I feel pretty confident in doing repairs like this, and I was able to adjust the hand brake to get it to hold rock solid. However, since I don't have a pit or other good way to do a thorough examination to see how much of the brake shoe is left I thought it best to have the shop lift it and take a look.

Of course, just because I can do repairs doesn't always mean that I have the time or desire to do them myself. I also factor in the aggravation and frustration level, and since owning the bus is supposed to be fun there are just some days I'd rather have someone else take care of things.

Richard

kyle4501 · September 01, 2017, 08:27:01 PM

Quote from: eagle19952 on September 01, 2017, 05:47:27 PM
IF you cannot adjust your own clutch and brakes..u have no business sitting in the seat.

Just because you can, doesn't mean you should . . . .

Just because you should, doesn't mean you can . . . .

Zephod · September 02, 2017, 02:15:59 AM

Quote from: kyle4501 on September 01, 2017, 08:27:01 PM
Just because you can, doesn't mean you should . . . .

Just because you should, doesn't mean you can . . . .

Exactly. I'm paid to drive, not fix schoolbusses. In fact we are told not to attempt roadside fixes.

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lostagain · September 02, 2017, 06:33:09 AM

In commercial driving in the US and Canada, you have to demonstrate to a DOT officer that you can adjust air brakes. That is also one the prerequisites for getting a CDL. The responsibility falls directly on the driver for out of adjustment brakes. In Canada, you need an air brakes endorsement to operate a vehicle with air brakes, which includes a motor home with air brakes. So the same applies. I know that private motor-homes in the US can be driven without any knowledge of how the air brakes work, but I have to agree that if you cannot adjust your own brakes, you shouldn't be in the driver's seat.

JC

Zephod · September 02, 2017, 07:05:49 AM

Quote from: lostagain on September 02, 2017, 06:33:09 AMIn commercial driving in the US and Canada, you have to demonstrate to a DOT officer that you can adjust air brakes. That is also one the prerequisites for getting a CDL. The responsibility falls directly on the driver for out of adjustment brakes. In Canada, you need an air brakes endorsement to operate a vehicle with air brakes, which includes a motor home with air brakes. So the same applies. I know that private motor-homes in the US can be driven without any knowledge of how the air brakes work, but I have to agree that if you cannot adjust your own brakes, you shouldn't be in the driver's seat.

JC

Yup. I remember my CDL test, rolling under the work bus, identifying all the parts and talking my way through checking and adjusting them.

I'm not allowed to maintain my work bus.

My work bus has pita brakes. They're either on hard or having no effect. Then there's the air leak because of a faulty valve that means I have to stomp the footbrake a few times after releasing the parking brake. And the blasted interlock that comes on randomly even though I release the parking brake with the footbrake applied. Maintainence won't do a thing to it saying everything is within parameters yet other busses have way better brakes.

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muldoonman · September 02, 2017, 04:21:42 PM

Quote from: Zephod on September 02, 2017, 07:05:49 AM
Yup. I remember my CDL test, rolling under the work bus, identifying all the parts and talking my way through checking and adjusting them.

I'm not allowed to maintain my work bus.

My work bus has pita brakes. They're either on hard or having no effect. Then there's the air leak because of a faulty valve that means I have to stomp the footbrake a few times after releasing the parking brake. And the blasted interlock that comes on randomly even though I release the parking brake with the footbrake applied. Maintainence won't do a thing to it saying everything is within parameters yet other busses have way better brakes.

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I hope you ain't driving kids around with that problem. I for one wouldn't drive something that has trouble stopping and all I use to drive around were cattle.