Help. Want to do a bus conversion but maybe a DP MH is smarter.

[DKO]

Most of what I had is mentioned here by everyone else.

But let me emphasize that a bus conversion will not pull a heavy trailer. It is the tongue weight that is too much. The rear framing of a bus is designed to support the engine and not much else. Although late model MCIs and Prevosts can take more than the older ones. Here in Canada, Greyhound pulls cargo trailers with MCIs, but they are not 15000 lbs. I would look at high end motor home pushers with a rail frame like Freightliner chassis. Or as mentioned above, a class 8 truck conversion.

A late 90's Prevost XL with a 60 series Detroit is rated to pull 10,000 lbs with 1000 lbs tongue weight. Prevost can upgrade the engine cradle and it will be rated to pull 20,000 lbs with 1500 lbs tongue weight. Mine is a 95/96 and I had the engine cradle upgrade several years ago. I have pulled 16,000 lbs all over the country several times.

You can buy one in very nice shape with less that 200,000 miles, get the upgrade if it has not be done, make sure it is road ready and still be way under budget.

Davy

[Chris & Beverly]

How about this one?

http://www.rvt.com/Neoplan-DOUBLE-DECKER-INTERMODEL-PROTOTYPE-BUS-2001-El-Paso-TX-ID5568903-UX144345

[Jon]

If I had $200K to play with, I'd look for a Blue Bird, Newell or professionally converted MCI (don't like Prevost and all the snootiness associated with them). Keep no longer than 40ft-if you go over 40ft, many states restrict you to truck routes only and you most likely will have to get a non commercial class B license to drive it. At least in California, your class C license (normal car license) allows you to drive up to a 40ft 3axle house car AND tow up to a 10,000lb trailer.
Converting you own will make it your own-but it is a very large undertaking. Many good used on the market. Good Luck, TomC

I'm so stuck up I won't talk to myself.

[MaybeABus]

Thanks so much everyone for the good information.

As to the concerns regarding liability and legality, we do move heavy machinery all the time in our business. Knock on wood we have yet to experience a calamity significant enough to test our insurance and so on. This is the primary reason I see this as a corporate investment. Easier to explain using a company vehicle for personal uses vs. explaining why I am carrying a heavy load with a private coach. But I agree, this will all need further investigation.

As to the towing capacity, I have the horse in front of the cart right now, but think I may want to do it the other way. I spoke to the chief engineer on the project and his gut feeling is by replacing steel covers and non structural steel elements of the chassis we can shave 12-1500 pounds off the piece of equipment we will be dragging around. By rearranging the "support bits" we can save another 500# easily. Dump the Forester as the tow vehicle and get something small, like 2500# we shed another 1500-200# maybe. That would get us well south of 15K and maybe even more in the 10k range. So if the cart gets lighter I have a much wider selection of horses to choose from theoretically.

[Zephod]

If I had $200K, I could buy a brand new school bus by Thomas or Bluebird and get about $75K change!


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[kyle4501]

Some of the higher end coach manufacturers build their own chassis & have tow capacities of 25K with 10% tongue load.

[DoubleEagle]

Thanks so much everyone for the good information.

As to the concerns regarding liability and legality, we do move heavy machinery all the time in our business. Knock on wood we have yet to experience a calamity significant enough to test our insurance and so on. This is the primary reason I see this as a corporate investment. Easier to explain using a company vehicle for personal uses vs. explaining why I am carrying a heavy load with a private coach. But I agree, this will all need further investigation.

As to the towing capacity, I have the horse in front of the cart right now, but think I may want to do it the other way. I spoke to the chief engineer on the project and his gut feeling is by replacing steel covers and non structural steel elements of the chassis we can shave 12-1500 pounds off the piece of equipment we will be dragging around. By rearranging the "support bits" we can save another 500# easily. Dump the Forester as the tow vehicle and get something small, like 2500# we shed another 1500-200# maybe. That would get us well south of 15K and maybe even more in the 10k range. So if the cart gets lighter I have a much wider selection of horses to choose from theoretically.

When it comes to commercial vehicles, depending on state rules, a trailer under 10,000 lbs does not have that weight added to the gross weight of the towing vehicle, but when it is over 10,000 lbs., that weight is added and boosts the total gross weight affecting the cost of license plates, weight restrictions, and DOT inspection requirements.

[Zephod]

When it comes to commercial vehicles, depending on state rules, a trailer under 10,000 lbs does not have that weight added to the gross weight of the towing vehicle, but when it is over 10,000 lbs., that weight is added and boosts the total gross weight affecting the cost of license plates, weight restrictions, and DOT inspection requirements.

Good point. I have a CDL B which allows me to drive any single unit vehicle though my endorsements are just passenger, school bus with no restriction on air brakes or manual gearboxes. It also allows me to drive a trailer up to 10,000lbs.

Beyond that I'd need the CDL A


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[B_K]

I'm so stuck up I won't talk to myself.

Jon that's strange I always thought you did talk to yourself but didn't answer yourself!
  BK 

[B_K]

If I had $200K, I could buy a brand new school bus by Thomas or Bluebird and get about $75K change!

And just why in the world would anybody buy a brand new schoolie to convert? In the end you still have a schoolie!
  BK 

[Zephod]

And just why in the world would anybody buy a brand new schoolie to convert? In the end you still have a schoolie!
  BK 

Not so. Ordered directly, it could be had without seats, with windows replaced by sheet steel, with proper locks on the doors, without the central walkway and without the student alarm. All kinds of benefits and the manufacturer could register it as a motorhome.

[kyle4501]

Not so. Ordered directly, it could be had without seats, with windows replaced by sheet steel, with proper locks on the doors, without the central walkway and without the student alarm. All kinds of benefits and the manufacturer could register it as a motorhome.

what ceiling heights are available?

[RJ]

Maybe a bus NAME?? -

If I had a $200K budget, I would look for an early 2000's MCI or Prevost professionally converted by Custom Coach, Liberty Coach, Marathon Coach, Royal Coach, etc.  One from one of the major four/five conversion companies.  Option would be a Newell or Wanderlodge.

Look for one with a 12.7L Series 60 Detroit (pre-EGR!!) with the Allison B500 automatic.

40 or 45 foot, your choice.

As for towing the trailer, and the potential tongue weight issue, here's your answer:

http://trailertoad.com/id79.html

Some folk, when I've mentioned this option, have squawked about the price of these.  But, IMHO, the cost is far less than the repair costs of your tow vehicle from cracked chassis members after towing something with a heavy tongue weight.  I have a friend who's beautiful GM 4106 was totaled after his heavy trailer actually buckled the chassis over the rear axle.  Sad to see, as his coach was gorgeous.  (He's now got an MCI MC-9 AND a TrailerToad!)

FWIW & HTH. . .

[Geoff]

RJ--
I'm looking at your signature information And see you also have another MC5 with a 6V92  and HT 740.  What are you going to do with that one?

--Geoff

[Zephod]

what ceiling heights are available?

Not sure but those I drive which are recent models have tall enough ceilings for my 6 feet. In fact, there's plenty headroom.


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