Options, Advice, Decisions Part 3

[windtrader]

Buy an already converted bus project.


Well, lots of research and process of elimination leaves this last option, putting smiles on many here.

A factory built conversion is beyond my upfront spend. I could wait until ready with the full spend but would miss out the enjoyment and trills of bus conversion ownership.

Sticks and staples - Just not going there.

Travel trailer - Just not going there.

DIY was my last preferred option due to really wanting a newer 4 stroke motor coach. As reality emerged, the amount of resources, everything from time, money, parts, labor, skills to tools and facilities, it is now clear just how large and enduring a commitment it takes to ensure a completed conversion. But life happens, so even with the best plans and intentions, some projects will fail to succeed.

There are a variety of successful conversion builds. Scott and Heather did a roof raise that required completely stripping the top half of the bus including removal of all windows, fully repaneling the sides, reinstalling windows, etc.  It seems one can leave the original windows in place for the most part, seal them well and insulate and panel over them, leaving a few open as desired. That alone would reduce the size of the conversion by a significant amount. But no matter how you slice it, DIY is a huge job.

Already converted option - Yes, y'all recommended this option all along. I'm thick but usually come around. Mostly by process of elimination, looking at already converted is my last and only viable option if I want to jump in the near term.

Having to let go of a 4 stoke coach is difficult but its just unrealistic at this time. Not all gloom though as there are plenty of nicely converted coaches plus the market very small by nature and especially soft in recent times. Critical task is being 100% sure it is as fully inspected and tested as possible before driving off.

Thanks again for all the support and guidance.

[muldoonman]

What's your budget? Might be a 1991 low mileage professional converted XL Mirage Prevost in your future.

[Cary and Don]

It seems that there was a partially converted coach available not too long ago at a very good price. All the expensive stuff was completed. This would be very doable for someone new to the conversion process. It was really reasonable since the owner had died. Maybe, somebody remembers it.

Don and Cary

[Melbo]

There are some older conversions with a four stroke.  I have an 8 that has an L10.  Mike has a 7 with an L10.  They are out there.  Not a common as the two strokes in the older buses but they can be found.  Lots of people have repowered with four strokes into older buses.  Good luck finding something that works for you.

Melbo

[eagle19952]

just so you know... L10 Cummins ZF

the ZF part of that nomenclature above...

a complete rebuild of any motor would be more welcome than a ZF failure.... I've been told...

there are still many things to consider.

No offense.

[kyle4501]

FYI

http://newellgurus.com/showthread.php?tid=3375

A lot of bang for the buck . . . . With a good sized down payment, wouldn't be too difficult to finance the balance. Assuming the interior suits your needs.

[windtrader]

@muldoon - Total project budget is 50k, initial spend 20-25k.

@melbo - I have seen 4 strokes in older coaches but not often and slim pickings for sale. But will keep an eye open for sure.

@eagle - Thanks for the decode. DD was the standard plant in the MCI D series and DD in the older GM and MCIs. I'm comfortable with these two due to the number of them built.

@Kyle - If I had 50k to spend today, I'd give an older Newell serious consideration.

I'm hoping a bus pre-purchase inspection checklist is available somewhere. I'll be asking prospective shops about their process and checklist. It would be great to cross check the two lists. Specifically, the coach specific items would be extra useful. For example, there are certain places where rust might be found or known weak parts or components.

[windtrader]

Is there a compiled list of recommendations for bus shops and mechanics?

I have a few for NorCal but may need one for San Diego. Thanks

[RJ]

Don -

Have you taken the time yet to physically get up from your keyboard and go LOOK at some bus conversions for sale?

As Buswarrior mentioned in another thread, you're at a point where you need to SEE these beasts in person. Lots of them.

Here's an intelligent suggestion:

Get on one of those Las Vegas gambler's special flights out of SFO, OAK, or SJC this coming Friday night.  Rent a car at McCarran and drive the 60 miles or so up to Pahrump Saturday morning, where there's going to be a bus rally (that runs thru Wed AM) with 30 converted coaches.  You'll get to meet some of the folk who frequent these forums, and most will let you tour their rigs. You'll be able to ask more questions and get far more informative answers from face-to-face conversations with owners than the hours you're spending staring at a computer screen.

The education you'll receive over the weekend for the minimum trip cash outlay, will be priceless.

GO!!!

FWIW & HTH. . .



PS: I'll be there. Just look for Aesop's Tortoise!

[DoubleEagle]

Don -

Have you taken the time yet to physically get up from your keyboard and go LOOK at some bus conversions for sale?

As Buswarrior mentioned in another thread, you're at a point where you need to SEE these beasts in person. Lots of them.

Very good advice, you also need to actually drive a few different buses before you actually make a decision. The mind can dream up a carefully considered choice, but your physical body needs to plant itself in the drivers seat and experience the real feel and sounds of the bus. For example, a four stroke might be a wise choice for various reasons, but the sound of a two cycle can be music to the ears. Every version of the engines available have distinctive sounds that you may enjoy, or not.

It's not unlike choosing a life partner, would you choose someone based on pictures, descriptions, and recommendations alone? It's not a business decision, it's an emotional bond between you and the bus because you like the look, appreciate the condition, and it makes you feel good when you are in it. Otherwise, you might just as well rent an RV, and turn it in when you are done with it. There are many people on this board who have had their coach for decades, and they cherish them. If you are lucky, you might be able to take over someone else's coach that has been meticulously maintained. Doing a conversion yourself is creative and exciting, but it is expensive and time consuming. There are plenty of good coaches out there for under $50,000.

[windtrader]

@RJ and Eagle - Thanks for your feedback and encouragement. Everyone has their own unique milieu of methodology, needs, interests, styles, personalities, etc. that makes life so interesting and wonderful. Buying a bus conversion was not on my radar until a couple months ago when I checked one out, got a good look, and a nice long ride in it. After that it got on my radar.

I'm most comfortable building a solid understanding of what I am looking to purchase beforehand as evidenced by the prolific posts here, researching other notable websites, private conversations, and chats with professionals over the phone. I've looked at a number of buses - passenger buses still in service and those just retired and already converted buses. Those are the most quantifiable as they are closest to a known specification. Factory conversions follow next in terms of known pedigree. Lastly, private conversions are unique, wide ranging from the mundane, utilitarian, hacks, professional, dated, refreshed,  to highly creative. 

Market condition assessment. Supply, demand, actual price to SELL today (90 days). Over the past couple months I have tracked inventory and monitoring sold buses. Sadly for sellers, there are a lot more listed buses than those actually sold, primarily not selling due to owners coping with the lack of return on the money spent on the project. Most folks understand that until it is their turn to list then sell.

Thanks again to all who have taken time to help me, I now have sufficiently defined parameters to engage in a serious search. I know what I am looking for, what I am getting into vis a vis owning a bus, how to accurately establish bus condition and history, and current market value.

When I come across the right one and make the deal, it's just an hour from a bank wire transfer to title and keys then on the way home. Same way as I buy many things and always served be well. Stick with what works.

Don

[Iceni John]

FYI

http://newellgurus.com/showthread.php?tid=3375

A lot of bang for the buck . . . . With a good sized down payment, wouldn't be too difficult to finance the balance. Assuming the interior suits your needs.

I wonder why its original engine had to be replaced after only 110,000 miles?

John

[luvrbus]

I wonder why its original engine had to be replaced after only 110,000 miles?

John

I don't doubt it since he mention new radiator probably used the wrong antifreeze or never tested the antifreeze and had so much silica drop out and it plugged the cooling system and overheated,the hydraulic fan drive on a Newell are not the greatest either in the older models       

[Melbo]

Just an note on the ZF --- the rebuild (I had it done when I was home and R&Red the trans myself) was way less than half the amount I have heard about dropping an engine.  One time the brain box took a bath and died.  I was able to drive home without it and picked one up at my leisure.  So I guess I am saying what scares and intimidates some people can really be a non issue depending on your perspective.

Melbo

[Geoff]

I wonder why its original engine had to be replaced after only 110,000 miles?

John

I'm willing to bet the engine over heated from some problem and the driver kept on going to the next exit instead of stopping.

--Geoff