supporting 4104 after lifting rear wheels

[Nel]

I am planning to remove the rear wheels one side at a time to check brakes,pull the drums,fix a broken brake shoe return spring,lube, etc. I have a 20 ton bottle jack. I need to know the best place to place the jack under the axle below the air beams and also would prefer to use wood blocking for jack stands once its up. I will be using the wooden ramps I made that work just fine to get the rear up a little more and then the jack to lift an inch or two from there.
    I have been working on cars all my life and the 4104 for the past 4 years , just want some added advice from the fine nuts on the board that have been there. Thanks, Nelson

[Zephod]

I would jack the axle as close to the spring as possible, preferably on the wheel side. As for support... could put the blocks under the axle or the chassis.


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[PP]

Your 4104 is definitely a different animal than my Prevost, but I raised mine on the bags as high as they would go, placed wood blocks beneath the points where the suspension pivots and under the engine cradle. Then I let the air out of the bags and used a 12 ton jack just to life the axle high enough to slide an old highway sign under the tires. Removed the axle nut and slid the entire assembly out to the side. A little grease on the highway sign helped tremendously. I cleaned and inspected the brakes and replaced the wheel seals and then slid it all back together. Didn't have to break a single lugnut loose. I wish I could take credit for this neat trick, but it was actually Gumpy (a fellow Minnesotan) that turned me on to it.
HTH

[chessie4905]

We had steel plates secured to bottom of beams to be able to jack up wheels. About 1/2 thick and around 6x8 inches. They had four tabs that were curved up around beam lip, but not far enough that they couldn't be removed. Each tab had a threaded hole for a 5/16 bolt, which when threaded down, it contacted the curve of the beam flange, securing it to the beam. Although they were made removable, we left them in place. To raise the coach required a harbor freight low profile 12 ton jack as clearance isn't great. Since a low profile had limited range, it was just enough to get wheels to clear. By using a plank ramp, you could use a regular jack. By all means, get a Harbor Freight air assist bottle jack. They aren't that expensive and save all the effort of pumping the handle, especially as you get older.

http://www.harborfreight.com/catalogsearch/result?q=Air+bottle+jack

[luvrbus]

Northern Tool has the air/hyd 12 ton jacks which is all you need for under 70 bucks with free shipping  fwiw your local Home Depot sell air/hyd jacks also

[dtcerrato]

Nel
The easiest way is to build up your air, once the bus is as high as it will go - block underneath the rear bulkhead (transverse bulkhead just on the forward side of the rear wheel wells. You can block it with good stout wood but use a small steel plate on the top of the wood block where the bus will settle down on it. Don't block it tight, leave about a 1/4" of space. One set of wood blocks on each side approx. just inside the inside dual. You'll see some vertical angle riveted to the bulkhead there. Now let the bus settle or purge the air out of the rear suspension. The edge of the vertical transverse bulkhead should come down right on the small steel plate. If this wording is not clear to you I can take a photo of my bus that is sitting on them now & try & send it to you.
I haven't found an air assist hydraulic jack that works under the 4104 due to the lack of height. The only hydraulic jacks that work fine for us is the 20 ton "stubby" jacks. Retracted they'll go under anyplace under the bus. FWIW.
It would be best to block both sides on the back & let the front go all the way down - that will give you more clearance on the back & you can work both sides before raising the buss suspension.
After the air is out of the suspension system and it's resting on the blocking - jacking the axle up is a breeze cause there's no bus weight on it just the weight of the axle. Of coarse don't trust the jack - block the axle too!
Make certain that the ground you are on WILL support the wood blocking, if not it will sink & sometimes not right away!

[Nel]

Thanks guys for the tips and the air jack is on my list.   Dan I like the idea of supporting the bus body that way, just knowing all that weight is supported at another point makes it less intimidating when your working on it, not really sure how to purge the suspension, since I notice that even when the air pressure reads zero on the dash, the suspension is still aired up for a while, Thanks again

[chessie4905]

When you have those rear hubs off, check the fit of the inner bearing to the axle stub.make sure there isn't a worn area where it rides on stub. A sloppy fit there will cause frequent oil seal failure.