What was old is new again

CrabbyMilton · July 31, 2015, 09:03:17 AM

Some of you skoolie people have wondered why gasoline engines have gone away given that diesels have become complex and costly to operate in lower volume applications. Plus, they can be "scarey" when starting them on a -10 Monday morning. Well, we'll see how the market bears this out and I think BLUEBIRD is acting shrewdly. I wonder if they may offer this in the ALL AMERICAN as well?
https://www.blue-bird.com/blue-bird/Press-Releases/63.aspx

luvrbus · July 31, 2015, 10:07:18 AM

They have these gasoline engines running 300 miles nowadays then use propane no telling how long it will last.

The new diesel engines with the pumps,heaters,relays,tanks and programing for the def and so on are a real PITA

CrabbyMilton · July 31, 2015, 10:14:36 AM

That FORD V-10 is a tough tried and true engine. Some of the very early versions in the late '90's had problems with spark plugs shooting out of the engine but that problem has long been corrected. It's also a very smooth and quiet engine so that's a good thing in a bus too even though diesel's are much quieter than they used to be. But hey, what's wrong with sound of a 2 cycle DETROIT?

Iceni John · July 31, 2015, 11:50:07 AM

So maybe all those Hall-Scott engined Crowns were just ahead of their time?! I wonder what the overall cost of ownership will be over the entire life of this Blue Bird, including engine rebuilds or replacements every one or two hundred thousand miles? When they were offering a choice of gasoline or diesel engines, Crown would mostly sell H-S to low-use operators on the assumption that their lower initial cost would be offset by higher running costs; Crown's higher-mileage customers always preferred diesel, even with a higher initial cost. I'll be curious what the break-even mileage is for gasoline versus diesel?

John

Jim Eh. · July 31, 2015, 02:48:41 PM

Quote from: CrabbyMilton on July 31, 2015, 10:14:36 AM
That FORD V-10 is a tough tried and true engine. Some of the very early versions in the late '90's had problems with spark plugs shooting out of the engine but that problem has long been corrected. It's also a very smooth and quiet engine so that's a good thing in a bus too even though diesel's are much quieter than they used to be. But hey, what's wrong with sound of a 2 cycle DETROIT?

LOL, try running a straight pipe on a Triton engine. The bloody thing sounds like an F1 engine like in the Honda commercial. The revs build so fast it's incredible.

HB of CJ · July 31, 2015, 02:51:04 PM

Crown Supercoaches forever! Way back before the dawn of time, or around 1970, Crown had a bumper to bumper parts and labor 200,000 mile guarantee. But a good Crown Supercoach cost over twice what a cheapo schoolie cost. They built their products too well?

Later we had a Crown Supercoach triple combination Fire Engine. Had a 300hp Hall Scott. Two big carbs. Every time we turned hard cornering the engine would back fire, sending long flames out of the huge exhaust stack. Bitchin! Got about a whopping 1 mile per gallon.

luvrbus · July 31, 2015, 03:12:22 PM

Ford engines are nothing new to Blue Bird the FC models used the 361 and 391 on some models I have a pusher with 534 Ford V8 you could install the Cat injection system and make it diesel I love to hear it run

Charles in SC · July 31, 2015, 06:10:36 PM

I have a 2000 F250 with the v-10 engine. It has been great but I think the ones in the small busses must be geared lower.

CrabbyMilton · July 31, 2015, 06:26:17 PM

There is something to be said about those old monster gasoline bus and fire truck engines. Those old SEAGRAVE and AMERICAN LaFRANCE V12's were sweet with a sound like no other. The fire apparatus around here(Milwaukee and midwest) mostly had WAUKESHA L6 engines in apparatus when they had gasoline engines in them along with many MACK apparatus. The HS engines were mostly on the west coast but I would imagine some made it east of the Rockies. I bet that was a sight to see and hear when those huge engines backfired like that. Hope they didn't "create" business.
There are fairly new BLUEBIRD VISION propane powered skoolies with that FORD V10 that serve the school district in the small city of Waukesha. They are fast and have a nice exhaust note and tranny whine from the 6 speed automatic. The first time I got along side of one and didn't know that company bought them. I couldn't believe how quiet they were since I was used to the diesel sound in those.

luvrbus · July 31, 2015, 06:37:46 PM

We have a couple of the old fire trucks here in Valley they use for parades that have the old V12 Ford flat head engines with dual pipes they do sound sweet if you can get one started

I hate working on that distributor installing points and condenser in those things what a dumb place to put a distributor

chessie4905 · July 31, 2015, 06:42:33 PM

V

Iceni John · July 31, 2015, 08:01:11 PM

Quote from: HB of CJ on July 31, 2015, 02:51:04 PM
Crown Supercoaches forever! Way back before the dawn of time, or around 1970, Crown had a bumper to bumper parts and labor 200,000 mile guarantee. But a good Crown Supercoach cost over twice what a cheapo schoolie cost. They built their products too well?

Later we had a Crown Supercoach triple combination Fire Engine. Had a 300hp Hall Scott. Two big carbs. Every time we turned hard cornering the engine would back fire, sending long flames out of the huge exhaust stack. Bitchin! Got about a whopping 1 mile per gallon.

One favorite trick of the Crown drivers to deter tailgaters close behind them was to turn off the engine at speed, pump the gas pedal a few times, count to three, then turn the engine back on. The resultant flame would come several feet out the rear-facing exhaust and scare the living snot out of anyone behind. If you got the timing wrong or got too much gasoline into the exhaust it would blow the muffler completely off. Fun!

John

oltrunt · July 31, 2015, 08:09:22 PM

Used to do that with my mothers '54 chevy---'till I blue the muffler off. Oh well, a boy has got to be a boy--I did pay for the repair though--Bla Bla, Bla. Jack

HB of CJ · July 31, 2015, 09:15:20 PM

Way back before the dawn of time and stuff like that we had several, (eight) Old Seagrave fire engines, squads and ladder trucks. All came from the factory with the 300+ hp V12 Seagrave 900+inch gasoline engines. Two starters. Had two (2) separate distributors.

Sounded so cool. Five speed manual transmissions. Four road gears plus a granny. Some had synchronizers, some were crash boxes. But ... by 1976 or soss, parts became an issue and the shops re-powered them all with hot 671N DDs. I got to help. Very long time ago.

bigred · August 01, 2015, 05:22:43 AM

I have been predicting for a couple of years now that we would be seeing a lot of the school systems going back to gas powered vehicles.The only thing that has kept them from doing it before ,is the fact that they think Diesel would be easier to get in case of another embargo.With that threat becoming less all the time ,there is not much reason to keep running these diesel money pits.