AnOtHeR Furnace thread

[Newbob]

Hi Folks, to start I would like to say what a great bunch you guys are and how much I have learned and how interesting it is to share thoughts and ideas with you all. I'm still new and having fun with it all. Thank You.


So, I think I have decided on a standard LP RV furnace for the bus. So my question is, which one? Suburban? Atwood? I did a search and, surprisingly, did not find a similar thread. (feel free to point it out if I missed it)

I have a 28 foot FE transit bus that has only seats down one wall and LCD Televisions down the length of the opposite wall. - it is used for mobile gaming (until I turn it into a camper - hehe) so it will be used in the cold northeast winters and the doors will be opened and closed a bit. I want to size the heater appropriately and use it without shore power.

Any thoughts??

[TomC]

I have an Atwood 35,000btu that heats my 40ft'r just fine. The big negative is you have to cut a hole in the side of the bus since the furnace installs from the outside of the bus. Not a big problem, and not to noticeable if you have the access door painted like the bus (which I did).
On my truck conversion, I do not want that big cutout on the side. I am going with the Suburban 40,000btu. Two models available-NT-40 which is 23 x 12.5h x 12w. Or the SH-40 which is 20 x 9.25h x 17w and probably a bit quieter. Both are remote mounted with a intake/exhaust grill only on the side, but are installed from inside. Good Luck, TomC

[bevans6]

Ditto on the 35K Suburban.  Heats my bus in down to freezing temps just fine.  Mine is installed in a bay, has ducted heat and cold air return, but they are designed to be installed inside the living space of the RV.  You need two 2" holes in the side for air intake and exhaust.  They use a fair bit of both battery power and propane.

Brian

[Newbob]

Yeah, I guess I can't go with Atwood then - the bus has been wrapped so my cutting it up is prob over. Unless I could build an insulated drawer underneath the frame and duct it inside?

[eagle19952]

and that's why i keep throwing webasto and espar in the mix it may be expensive (sorta) but adding a few radiators (baseboard) to the existing heating system is gonna be your best way out...
Did I say they are reliable if new and maintained by knowledgeable persons ?
and they run on diesel...

[TomC]

Espar and AquaHot Diesel boilers are reliable with yearly maintenance. They are very expensive-around $11,000+ for the system compared to less than $1,000 for a propane furnace with all ducting, etc.
How much maintenance did my Atwood propane furnace require in the 19 years it was in my bus-none! I didn't have to open it up once. The only reason I replaced it was I forgot to turn it off and it ran continuously for two weeks-which the motor didn't like. The new units were quieter. Good Luck, TomC

[eagle19952]

webasto...does not cost $11000.00..

for example:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Webasto-DBW-2010-45000-BTU-Hydronic-Marine-Boat-Heater-and-extras-/171470118050?pt=Boat_Parts_Accessories_Gear&hash=item27ec6a5ca2&vxp=mtr#viTabs_0

[Homegrowndiesel]

"The only reason I replaced it was I forgot to turn it off and it ran continuously for two weeks-which the motor didn't like"
Ouch, Somebody screwed the pooch on that one. I like the Proheat, and hydronic, but all of the units should last way longer than a couple weeks. 5- 10 years, is more likely to be the average on any of the heater components.

[dbldragon]

 Our bus has working otr a/c and heat that works fine . We live on Vancouver island so have a moderate climate. Plan is to travel south in winter so not a lot of heat needed really. I would like to tie in any system with the bus systems.  Not a fan of in house lpg furnace as they create moisture. Has anyone tried to hook a lpg remote furnace to the air box of the bus .
We have looked at diesel heaters and cost is a issue .  Likely use on demand hot water system mounted in bays also. Views on idea more than welcome.

Chuck

[Jriddle]

Our bus has working otr a/c and heat that works fine . We live on Vancouver island so have a moderate climate. Plan is to travel south in winter so not a lot of heat needed really. I would like to tie in any system with the bus systems.  Not a fan of in house lpg furnace as they create moisture. Has anyone tried to hook a lpg remote furnace to the air box of the bus .
We have looked at diesel heaters and cost is a issue .  Likely use on demand hot water system mounted in bays also. Views on idea more than welcome.

Chuck

The Proheat or Webasto would be the easiest way to use you OTR system. I'm sure you can tie any heating system in if you spend the time and money. I would find a good buy on a diesel boiler and use it that is what they are made for.

Just MHO
John

[TomC]

Yes maybe you can find a used Webasto on Ebay for less than $1,000. Then you have to have it tested for pressure, probably change the igniter (fancy word for spark plug). The bare Webasto is just one component in a very complex system with it's separate fuel supply from the fuel tank and contending with the Diesel exhaust. With AquaHot, the Webasto is the base heater, then you have a tank that holds heated water for fresh water system hot water. Then there is the manifold with valves to control the water flow to the heat exchangers along with the water pumps. Then you have probably around 4 separate heat exhangers that need to be plumbed, and thermostatically controlled with power going to them. Then you have a separate circuit going to the engine to pre-heat the block. All this plumbing and hoses are possible leaking points.

Granted, a simple RV furnace is propane powered. On my bus, I only have two propane powered items-stove and furnace-and I have an internal switch operating the turn off solenoid at the tank. With a propane furnace, you install it, hook up the propane, power, thermostat (which works with the Penguin A/C), run 4 ducted outlets, and done. No coolant, hoses etc to contend with.

You create the complexity of your systems. I choose not to have the AquaHot type system because of initial cost and then the continuing high cost of maintenance. I've priced the complete system and for new, $11,000.00 is not out of line. Good Luck, TomC

[Lin]

I just wanted to note the Tom C knew he did not have to change his furnace when the fan burned out.  He just did so because he used it as an opportunity to upgrade.  The fan is easily and cheaply replaceable.  That's what I did with mine when it stopped.  There is also plenty of warning that the fan motor is likely to fail since it is generally the brass bushings on the shaft that go.  Long before the fan stops, you will be hearing it at start up.  I think I used mine for a year before getting around to changing it.

As is true in many cases, the first class system, like Webasto, is more complex, requires more maintenance, is more likely to fail, and is much more expensive.

[eagle19952]

like my grand daughter would say...whatever, 
FWIW  i worked in the Arctic in the harshest conditions known to man.... a Webasto is German made (whose engineering most regard as "as good or better than most"....a webasto hydronic circulating heater (in this instance, for instance) can be plumbed into the existing school bus heating system negating the need for any peripheral glycol tank etc.The bus already has a circ boost pump I am sure...
To each his own. I had no problem with Webasto.
It uses .16 gallons diesel per hour and burns/produces on full load at 17000btu

Uses as little as 1 gallon of fuel in a 10 hour period
High output in a compact package: 17,000 Btu/h
Reduces unnecessary idling
Pre-heats engines
Saves fuel
Reduces engine wear and maintenance costs
Reduces harmful exhaust emissions
CARB approved and EPA SmartWay Verified Technology

Here is a brand new out of the box for far less than $11000.00 in fact it's $1100.00 your off by a zero.http://www.ebay.com/itm/WEBASTO-THERMO-TOP-C-coolant-heater-airtronic-airtop-semi-truck-parts-/331091349667?_trksid=p2054897.l4275
Tell me again what an Atwwood costs...add in the propane tank in the inconvenience of keeping it full....I never had a bottle last more than a day and a half...

[TomC]

Lin is correct in that after 19 years, the only thing wrong was the fan motor that I could have easily replaced. But, the new Atwood with the larger fan running at a slower speed is quieter. Plus the electronics are updated so that the furnace turns on almost immediately when you turn on the thermostat (before there was about a 30 second delay). Good Luck, TomC

[Newbob]

Wow! - That seems like a good deal. I do have the coolant flow heater units in the bus - so this just plumbs right into my system? Any idea what else is needed? I assume it comes with the hose needed to somehow tap into the existing diesel tank/line?  Not that I'm opposed to installing a separate tank but does it have a built-in suction pump? I would look into this in depth but I could use a quick solution here - and don't want to miss the ebay sale.