getting bus up to temp

Dlsnow · September 19, 2012, 04:09:32 PM

Put about 400 miles on without stopping (except getting pulled over) yesterday. Bus didnt get up to 180deg F. Stayed at about 160 and took about 100 miles to get there.
It was about 50deg outside most of the ride.
Is this normal?
Oh and I got pulled over for the excessive exhaust. I didnt think it was that bad but im sure it stunk back there.
bus runs with no smoke if its between 60 and 80 outside.

gus · September 19, 2012, 04:53:55 PM

If your radiator is easy to get to use a big piece of cardboard over it. Cut a couple of holes in the cardboard that you can fold back to leave openings, you don't want to block too much of the radiator.

I'll probably have to do this to my 8V this winter also.

160 is too cold.

Dlsnow · September 19, 2012, 07:01:37 PM

Over the radiator itself or the mesh screen that covers the opening to the radiator?
Is this why semi's have those zip up covers in front? I always wondered.
BTW my bus had those air scoops someone made to get more air to the radiators.

luvrbus · September 19, 2012, 07:36:02 PM

Thermostats and new seals are hard to beat lol,the trucks you see have modern 4 stroke engines a 195 degree thermostat is about the norm for those big difference in air being forced through the radiator than your bus trying to pull air in JMO

Dlsnow · September 20, 2012, 11:58:09 AM

I dont know what you mean by "thermostats and new seals are hard to beat"
We will be heading south soon and temps will be higher, but for the next few weeks were here in 50-60degcentral temps.
Im about to put some cardboard in there for a run today.

buswarrior · September 20, 2012, 12:16:21 PM

No, that is NOT normal.

You have a thermostat problem.

Stuck open, or removed entirely, neither is a good thing.

Open them up and see what's in or not in there.

Don't block the rad on a rear engined coach unless you are prepared to stop on the shoulder to remove it when you overheat.

As noted, this isn't a semi-truck with front mounted ram air through the rad. They block the rad in order to cut down on the super cooling of the ram effect, a coach doesn't have to block that hurricane into the engine room.

happy coaching!
buswarrior

Frank @ TX · September 20, 2012, 02:32:14 PM

Hi Disnow,
Like some have said you may have a thermostat problem.
With either cold or hot weather the thermostat has the job to keep the engine at the temp that the thermostat is designed to do. When the engine is too cool it will not burn all the fuel ( IE the dark smoke you saw ). Get the thermostats out and check if they open and close in a pan of hot water on the stove. Check the temp when they open and it should be the same as the stamped numbers.
Have fun
Frank

Oonrahnjay · September 20, 2012, 03:58:25 PM

Quote from: buswarrior on September 20, 2012, 12:16:21 PMNo, that is NOT normal. You have a thermostat problem. Stuck open, or removed entirely, neither is a good thing. (snip)

Quote from: Frank @ TX on September 20, 2012, 02:32:14 PM(snip) Get the thermostats out and check if they open and close (snip)

Both of these commenters are getting close to an important point. When you're dealing with a vehicle that's been through a "poor maintenance history", it's frequent that the thermostats get removed. The radiators may be clogged, the hoses my have loose linings, water jacket cavities sludged up, the water pump may be worn etc. -- rather than really fix it, the "easy to keep it rolling and get it sold off" is to remove the thermostats. That gives a little more cooling from a very compromised cooling system -- it's not RIGHT but it may "help". The only thing to do with a system like this is to go through it. One of the first things is to do is make sure that the thermostats are there. If they're not, you'll have to replace them. Then get an IR thermometer and check the heat distribution. If the thermostats are working right, the hoses "downstream" of the thermostats should be cool until the thermostats open. There should be no cool spots on the radiator, etc. If you find problems, fix them in a logical sequence.

Keep checking until the system works as it was designed to in all situations. I think that there is a good chance that the bus is telling you that it needs basic work. Good luck.

luvrbus · September 20, 2012, 07:26:04 PM

There is a thermostat on each bank they have seals in the bottom of the housing when those go bad or were not installed it is like having no thermostats fwiw

good luck

Dlsnow · September 21, 2012, 07:47:54 AM

Thank you all so much - thermostat issue sounds most likely given the following
bus overheated on a 90 deg F day this summer
runs great on 70 deg F days (no smoke)
doesnt get up to temp when 50 - 60 deg F outside - and smokes a greyish color

I found the water temp gauge in the engine bay is disconnected (corroded wire) from the probe

I am away from the bus right now (and the manuals) where will I find my thermostats?

thanks again - you guys are awesome

TomC · September 21, 2012, 08:20:04 AM

The whole purpose of the thermostat is to warm up the engine, not to keep it cool. You need to replace both thermostats with 180 degree. Then you engine should come up to 175 fast where the thermostat starts to open. On my engine I know the thermostats are fully open at 185 degrees and if the engine continues up to 190 it's time to turn on the misters. Good Luck, TomC

buswarrior · September 21, 2012, 01:50:15 PM

And, it sounds like the rest of your cooling system needs immediate attention.

The radiators are suspect number two, after ensuring all the air that the fan pulls is actually going through the rad, and not around it or through gaps in doors/seals that are intended to prevent that.

happy coaching!
buswarrior

Dlsnow · September 22, 2012, 06:28:31 AM

I have alot of space around the rads for air to go.around
suppose i seal that up next.

RickB · September 22, 2012, 07:12:33 AM

Disnow,

Are you still in the Minneapolis area? Might be time to stop by one of the local bus nuts and have them take a look. Sounds like you need a hands on discussion of how the cooling system works on your bus. You can learn it here but it takes a lot longer than in person with Gumpy or Brian or myself or any of the other local folks.

I'd be more than happy to take a look if you're in the area and I have rebuilt my entire cooling system.

Let us know

Rick

Dlsnow · September 22, 2012, 08:08:22 AM

Rick-were in central Wicsonsin now...would love to meet and learn from you busnuts
I checked out the thermostat housing on the heads.
Seems like I will need a dd v71 manual to get the part numbers for gaskets, thermostat and seal info.

I didnt want to remove as I have to move the bus in a couple days. Sounds like people are using 175 thermostats with success. Where should i order the parts from?

Any busnuts in Tulsa, OK or Fayetteville, AR? I plan on being there in October.