Isolating House Battries

Eagle Andy · December 04, 2011, 03:11:15 PM

I have a question about my system, I will try to explain it the best I can, so please bare with me

. Currently I have two 8ds for start battries and two 6 volt golf cart battries for house battries. There used to be 6 for the house but they frooze two years ago and I have not replaced them. Well I'm getting ready to replace all my battries before we head to the Q in Jan.
Now this is where i get confused. I stay plugged in most of the time while the bus is at home. I have a 2000 watt three stage inverter/charger. I have two perko switches one back in the back Bay with my battries and one up front that is tied in for the battery for my 12 KW generator. On the switches they are labled 1, 2, and All on the back switch in the battery compartment right over the 1 is written house and over the 2 is written start. then right next to it is a keyed switch that say House battery disconect.
So my question is should I beable to Isolate the house batteries from the start battries with these swtiches. I know you can't see how it's wired and maybe i just need to start chasing cables. I just want to understand what I have so I don't run down start battries sitting at the Q. I'm also considering 4 house battries instead of two.
I'm putting a couple of pictures to show you it might help. Thanks abunch Andy

Eagle Andy · December 04, 2011, 03:12:16 PM

bobofthenorth · December 04, 2011, 03:31:56 PM

Hard to say Andy without tracing wires. If I had to guess I'd say the Perko switches are set up to source power for the house from either the start bank or the house bank and the keyed switch is a crossover for starting/charging. On image 5510 you can see a solenoid mounted to the bay wall below the Perko switch - could that be a crossover solenoid? Just guessing without more details on the origins of the wires.

If you're going to change batteries anyway, give some serious thought to eliminating the house/start banks and just running one large deep cycle bank. Don't take my word for it - Sean has voted in that direction as well. As long as your generator battery is "outside" that bank you'll never be stranded and you'll get much better bang for your battery buck IMHO.

Eagle Andy · December 04, 2011, 04:36:03 PM

Thanks for the reply Bob, So if I understand you right Bob are you saying just to have one set of battries for start and house being and just let the alternator charge them all while running down the road. So maybe have one more 8d in there ?

Joe Camper · December 04, 2011, 04:42:15 PM

I can see a big red relay in the photo down low. When you put the selector in the all position can you here it energize? The other key is a master disconnect for the house.

The orange switch is a manual merge. Put the orange switch on 1 and shut the key off and see if it kills house power. If it does 1 is house bank. If it doesnt put orange switch on 2 and turn the key off I suspect that should then kill house power and 2 will be those batts.

Just a guess

bobofthenorth · December 04, 2011, 04:46:13 PM

Quote from: Eagle Andy on December 04, 2011, 04:36:03 PM
Thanks for the reply Bob, So if I understand you right Bob are you saying just to have one set of battries for start and house being and just let the alternator charge them all while running down the road. So maybe have one more 8d in there ?

That's what makes sense to me. Get as many deep cycle batteries as you can afford and use them as start batteries and house batteries. Let the alternator charge them on the road and your inverter/charger charge them when you're running the genset or tied to the utility. That's the way my boat is set up - when we bought the boat I thought "that's gotta go" but the more I use it the better I like it. If I hadn't just bought new start batteries for the frenchy-bus last summer I'd be changing it over too.

Joe Camper · December 04, 2011, 04:55:38 PM

Is the chassis on an Eagle 12 or 24 volt? If it is 24 the lead coming from the chassis batts going to the orange switch will be coming out of a battery equalizer not the bank of chassis batts themselves. If that is the case I do not believe power will flow thru that equalizer giving 12 volts to the house without the key on and engine and alt turning.

I would also try checking voltages in each position on the orange switch, first with the bus off take some voltages and then checking those voltages again with the bus running and see if the voltages change and when. That will answer some.

Eagle Andy · December 04, 2011, 05:59:28 PM

Thanks Joe I will check it out and see whats going where. oh this Eagle is 12 volt Thanks again will keep you all posted what I find.

Joe Camper · December 05, 2011, 04:29:24 AM

I would guess when you switch in position 2 with the charger on the inverter running the chassis voltages will jump and when you select in 1 and then start the bus the house voltages will jump.

Just a guess and there is probably a few more ways to get to the finish line if given a bit more thought. Kinda tough to be sure from where I am sitting.

rip · December 05, 2011, 05:22:23 AM

Andy; If you are thinking about combining house and starting batteries that is what I did eight years ago.I have four 8D's for house and starting and have not had any problems.I have a separate battery to start my generator so I can't get stranded,however that has not happened yet.I have a 24 volt system with a 4024 inverter.
Don

Joe Camper · December 05, 2011, 06:12:53 AM

Don, Are they deep cycle batteries?

How far from the starter and how far from the inverter? Or where did the inverter and batts end up, rear bay?

How big the cable did you need to use for both runs?

Curious and interested.

If my assumption is correct I think Andy can have 1 bank on the bus now, but only when he wants to, by switching into all.

Andy see if you can hear that red solonoid down low in photo1 click in when you go to all position on the orange knob. I would also verify the opporation of that solonoid Check the small wire to it and see if there is a signal going to it when you go into all, the solonoid may be bad. You also might run another signal to the solonoid and see if it opens. Assume nothing.

If you have what it looks like It is a good set up and when you figure it out you will be way happier

. I would loose the 6 volt batteries.

luvrbus · December 05, 2011, 06:22:22 AM

Andy looks like it time to call Terry lol that guy amazes me with his setups and they work once you figure out what he did

good luck

Joe Camper · December 05, 2011, 06:47:21 AM

Disconnect the house bank at the batteries and go into all and see if the house lights up? Make sure that solonoid is working thou.

Just thinking out loud. I have to deal with weird electrical things on other peoples buses frequently. That is not easy to do so Im not poking fun here.

There are a lot of things to get sourted out on a conversion that someone else did it addition has seen 2 prior owners since you and very little documentation. See it alot.

I met a fellow who bought a prevo MH a CC conversion. They have a huge usually computer controlled dc distribution panel on the front wall of the forward bay takes up that whole wall almost very specific to CC older ones had these cards that had to be inserted.

All the dc house stuff all the numerous switch panels need this.

Not only was that panel missing when he bought the bus the owner did not know there was one in there originally until after he bought the camper.

I ran into them after a very major electrical surgery buy a place in Elkhart (that I would highly recommend to even take on a task this monumental).

Anyway when I met them they were still in the dark with the coach. In order to run any house systems while driving the

gen had to run PERIOD and they assumed that was just the way it was.

Well we all know that ain't right. I found a bad solenoid that is energized by the key that allows the bus alt to charge the house and ,again, they had no idea. Out of the barn they could run off inverter for about 4 hr or so then it was gen time. LOL

Joe Camper · December 05, 2011, 07:25:26 AM

Andy see if that red solonoid is energized when you turn the bus ignition on.

Eagle Andy · December 05, 2011, 01:07:56 PM

Well I did some testing, with the orange switch in the off position and the keyed switch off I have no house power. The small solanoide below is hot and that is wired to the Bus power switch in the engine compartment, I have two one kills the start battries and the other kills power to the rest of the Bus.
Ok when I put the switch in the 1 positionand the key switch off I have still have no power to the house when I turn the keyed switch on I have power to the house.When i turn the orange switch to the 2 position and turn the key switch off i still have house power.
when i test all the termauls on the orange switch i show 16+ volts on all the ends on either side of the solanoide i show 16+ volts and nothing off the small wires. Now withh the key on and the orange switch in the all position I show 17+ volts. Does that make any sence lol