Pre-luber or not to Pre-luber

[JohnEd]

It has been years "BUT" installing a oil pre-luber on RV engines was all the rage.  "99.9% of the where in an engine is endured at start-up".  Remember all that?  What happened?  Did oils get all that much better.  If there was ever an engine I would think would be subject to the evils of a dry start I would think it would be a DD 2 stroke.  Yet, they do just fine without it.

Those lubers used to be spendy and I dreamed up a low capacity hydraulic pump with a check valve that would do the job when driven by a smallish DC motor.  What says the board?  We sure pay a lot of attention to the block heaters and thinning the oil is only half the story....or so I am told. 

John

[Lee Bradley]

KISS?

Just one more thing in the oil system to break.  Might be worth it on an RV with long periods between start-ups or just spin it for 10 or 15 seconds with fuel off. 

[artvonne]

  John, ive taken apart engines that had thousands of hours and 100's of thousands of miles and found nice polished cranks and decent bearings with tight oil clearance. The prelube thing started in the Turbo era, people who didnt do regular oil changes were blowing turbos like crazy. It was basically a bandaid to cover neglect. The cars people take reasonable care of dont need that junk. Why would a big industrial engine be any different??? If the engine makers thought they needed it, they would have it. They are willing to stand behind their stuff with a warrantee, trust them.

[luvrbus]

No need for a pre lube on a 2 stroke only on the first start up after a complete rebuild the oil galleys stay full on a 2 stroke only way to empty one is pull the pan and remove the valves on each side of the block then it will drain dry

good luck

[eddiepotts]

Lee somewhat has it right on the part of them sitting a long time. did you ever ask why you would get 300,000 miles on an old diesel and 80,000 out of an old carburated gasoline engine? your diesel shuts down by turning off the fuel.The oil is still running as it turns off so everything keeps lubricated for the next start. Your old carberated engines would turn the electrical off and you would still be sucking gas down into the cylinders with the vacuum. Now the gas that went down into the cylinder would be eating what oil was there and leaving it bone dry for the next start. If it sat for a long time the engines would even lock up from rust. Now days with fuel injection you turn off the fuel like a diesel  to stop the engine. That's why your new cars can see 300,000 miles. So having a prelube on an old RV with a caburated 454 would not have been a bad idea.

[junkman42]

Large marine diesel engines and many land based diesel's will not start until pre-lube pump has built up pressure!  Chicago pneumatic and white Superior engines come to mind among many large engines I have had to deal with>  Good or bad or necessary I do not know!  John L

[JohnEd]

Here is what I learned recently from one of my Firearms forums:  Petroleum "doesn't actually LIKE metal".  If you dip a steel part in petro and let it sit the oil will actually migrate down the metal and leave it 100% oil free.  Now, the only thing I, personally, have found recently that I can get in 100% pure form is BS, so, I was really impressed.  Unfavorably, as it were for one of my most cherished beliefs proved FALSE.  Of course, you can add "stuff" to the oil to help it hang arouind longer but the instinct, on the part of oil, is to flee.  And, on reflection, having learned that, I discovered I had personal anecdotal evidence.

I tore down my wheels and bearings to turn the drums and rotors on my olde Winnie.  She had sat for many years prior  without being run down the road as the BCM "staff" has recommended as a "must do" PM.  Now, I make it a point to use only wheel bearing grease that is rated as "excellent" for water proof performance.  Soap base stuff can actually be used to wash your hands...blow me away.  Sooooo no soap in my bearings or anywhere else on any of my rigs.  To my utter amazement, my wheel bearings had a half circle of rust on them and I had installed them personally only a few thousand road miles prior to that event and I know how to pack a bearing.  I was clueless and so confused that i quickly rejected the info in front of me as, well, sorta, not there. 

So, here comes this piece/post about the merits of "gun oil" as a preservative.  This guy took strips of steel, coated/dipped them in various oils and other stuff commonly thought to preserve and put the strips in a "humid box".  Bees wax, get this, is a supremely POOR rust stopper.  Seems that under a microscope the stuff is made up of tiny plates that slip across each other but let water through the myriad cracks that are its nature.  ALL the oil dipped sheets started to rust at the top and the rust line crept down at various rates for all of them.  MOTOR OILS WERE USED in some cases.  They didn't work.  The stuff that LIKED steel and stayed put was SYNTHETIC.  Seems it actually penetrates into the surface of the steel and gets a vice-like grip.

Gun oils with a petro base have additives that make them work better.  None worked as well as synthetics, however.  And even synthetics worked better with some sort of additives.  In my experiments I found that "Lubraplate- chain and cable fluid" protects spectacularly almost as well as porcelain but I would fear that it wouldn't do well as motor oil. (Lubraplate...not porc..).  The second best stuff was synthetic ATF and it was a name brand.  Synthetic gun oil was third and synthetic motor oil, by Castrol was last in a field of performers.  Auto products, while they might have additives for rust prevention, aren't selected for that performance.  I think Clifford once mentioned that there is an oil that is designed to preserve engine innards for long periods of storage.  I thought grease would be the same and I guess I was wrong.  Full synthetic or my spendy blend for this guy from now on.

For me, a pre-luber seems a incontrovertible truth in its worth.  A delivery truck or transit would benefit the least but I would think that on a engine that sits for weeks or months or years would absolutely benefit.  If I had one installed I would think that I would run the thing for 10 minutes every week as a PM in addition to running the bus down the road every month to warm the oil and get the grease stirred up on all the parts that need it.

I don't have one and I have never had one......I'm just say'n.

Thanks for that info Junkman.

Thanks Eddie for explaining something that has stuck in my craw for many years.

A lot to be said for KISS.

hanks all,



John