From bad to worse: now the SpaceShip won't start!

[Buffalo SpaceShip]

I headed out to take the bus to the yard where we could work on the wheel seal, and now the frickin' thing won't start. I've never had this issue with this bus. It's always fired right off.

The bus is on runup ramps is the only thing different at the moment. I did inadvertantly leave the 12v-24v converter on for several hours last night, but didn't expect it to kill the batts. Even so, I've been charging on a 35A fast charger (trading batts for the 24v system) for at least an hour and a half... and all I still get is a click. The starter acts like it's trying to rotate and can't... the fan blade moves just slightly and stops.

I took some time to clean up the battery connections. They weren't too bad, but now they're sqeaky clean and Vasolined. It looks like the firewall ones are sound. I can't quite see the starter over the back of the head to see if those are tight, but I could grab the wires... still couldn't tell.

I guess I could go buy some fresh 8Ds or Grp. 31s... but have a hard time believing that it's batts right now.

The bus gods apparently don't want me to leave Texas! Arghhh!!

Brian B.

[kyle4501]

I have a friend that uses his bus to make a living. His 8V71 took a crap & he is now working in the dirt to replace the engine. Oh and it cold & he has snow to deal with too. And he dropped his laptop, so he is disconnected from everyone.

So it is not as bad as it could be. Chin-up, you are with family, enjoy what you can.

[JackConrad]

Brian,    
  Test each battery with a load tester. Last week I had a 2 week old new battery from WalMart fail. We had a  similar complaint. Voltmeter showed only a slight difference on voltages and charging batteries had no effect.  
  Another possibility, if a standard transmission, is that it is in gear. Saw that happen last Labor Day Weekend. Bus engine would barely turn. We finally realized the problem when a person was leaning against the bus when they hit the starter. Owner said he never pushed the clutch in when starting because the transmission was always in neutral.  Hope this helps, Jack

[frank-id]

Diesel engines require just air, fuel and a battery to spin the engine.  You must have air and some fuel.  Engine no spin do all the electrical checks.  Get the batteries all charged to 12.6 volts.  Check the battery switch by removing switch and disassemble unit. If possible, temperarily bolt the cables together. Try start switch.  Engine no spin, jump starter solenoid to alternator at battery connection.  Engine no spin, check cables
at starter, solenoid, and ground.  Loosen cables and move cables to make good connection, tighten bolts and jumper starter solenoid.  Use a heavy wire of about 12-10 wire size and jump power from starter positive cable to starter solinoid.  Check again the major ground, negative, connections.  The starter and solenoid is easy to get at behind the trans at right rear service door.  Frank

[Tom Y]

Brian, Try taking a volt meter start at the batteries. Check while someone tries the starter. If the volatge drops offthere is a battery problem. Check each battery.  If not there go to the starter, if the voltage stays up either a connection at the starter or starter.  A simple way to check. Just my explaining may be bad.  Tom Y

[Buffalo SpaceShip]

Gads, Frank. I wish you'd have posted your concise bit of golden advice about 2pm today. There was more than a few of us standing around trying to figure what to do next! Your post is getting printed out and put in my electircal toolbox for safekeeping. Wow.

I did hopefully determine that it was the 8Ds and got a replacement set tonight. I'll keep ya'll posted on the outcome.

"Newbie" nothing, Frank. Please post on here anytime. You other folks ain't too shaby, either. And you're right Kyle... if I had to be broke down, my Mom's driveway is about the best place to be! I feel better already.

Brian B.

[Ncbob]

Brian, applying Vaseline to the terminals of a known good battery would be a questionable practice, in my opinion...let alone one with a troublesome history. If the battery is low on voltage the terminals and posts will heat due to the extra current draw of the starter and the Vaseline will compound the situation because it will melt and act as a dielectric.

Hope your situation evolves and improves.....

NCbob

[Buffalo SpaceShip]

Wowsers, Bob... I got that advice straight outta Da Book a few years back.  It's right there in the Lubrication section.

Anyone else think it's bad practice?? I've found that the red spray doesn't protect the way that petroleum jelly does.

Hmm...
bb

[frank-id]

  Big 8D batteries stink.  They cost too much, weigh too much, warranty is just 18 months, not all places have this group and many other group batteries work as well.  Lately, I have been buying Walmart batteries for about $70 compared to $125.  Walmarts 950cca batteries spin a diesel as fast as 8D.  Most 8D's are 1005cca.  Walmarts are every place and warranty is 6-7years.  I can carry 2 Wally batts.  Group 31 batteries are
also a good size batteries but cost the same as 8D and have the same warranty.  Battery care and monitoring is very important.  A battery that indicates 12.0 volts is 75% discharged.  A fully charged battery indicates 12.5 - 12.6 volts with a digital multimeter. Most of my wrenching on equipment, wheel bearing grease is used for battery terminals.  Washing any battery with water spreads the acid solution.  I always wipe any moisture away from and off batteries with paper towels.  No water.  Good venting is required.     Frank

[Jeremy]

Re. using Vaseline - as it happens I have a tube of 'proper' battery terminal anti-corrosion paste, and it looks just like Vaseline. The texture is slightly thicker than Vaseline, and even seems slightly gritty, but I'm sure it is basically the same stuff

Jeremy

[Hi yo silver]

WHAT? You're at your mom's?  Why didn't you say so?? Get her to pour some of her chicken soup over the battrie...works every time.

[roadrunnertex]

I just talked to Brian and he has a bad starter-
Any one have any information on a starter rebuild company in the Dallas / Ft Worth,Texas Area?
jlv

[gumpy]

Vaseline should not be a problem. It will keep the terminals from corroding. While I don't use it myself, I've heard and read recommendations on it's use many times, and have never heard or read anything saying not to use it.

[TomCat]

I just talked to Brian and he has a bad starter-
Any one have any information on a starter rebuild company in the Dallas / Ft Worth,Texas Area?
jlv

Brian,

Before you pull the starter off, I'd hit the case of the starter with a hammer a few times to attempt to reseat the brushes on the armature. It always works when it's brush wear as opposed to solenoid issues.

Hope that helps.

Jay
87 SatftLiner

[oldmansax]

Here is one on Ebay right now:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/large-detroit-diesel-starter-40-mt-24-volt-cw-rotation_W0QQitemZ120051190653QQihZ002QQcategoryZ50466QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem