Run Fridge off Starter Batts?

[John316]

lol, Clifford . I guess we are the poster child why one should go with propane .  I can't wait until we have the alternator hooked up. Then we will be smoking. lol.

God bless,

John

[Nellie Wilson]

Christy: Thanks for your explanation(s). I know these 'little posts' take time to compose (at least the more thoughtful ones  ) Still trying to wrap my pea brain around it all, but it's much appreciated. (And that goes for everybody!)

Bevans: Okay, I'll bite... send me your missive  - and thanks in advance!

LuvRbus : If that's what John316 says, who am I to quibble? Let's see, 20 Grand or 30 bucks for some hose and such? Hmmm... count this chicita as LP all the way, Jose.

Still scratching my head... but not nearly as much,

Nellie

[Don Fairchild]

Nellie;

  I don't get into these topics very often because I don't have much to contribute and although you have been given good advice there are a few things i don't see. First make sure the fridge is hooked down so it wont move around, second put in a good LP gas detector and a good carbon monoxide detector.

  We have lost enough people to natural causes, I don't want to read about you or any one else being lost to our own screw up's.

Don

[Nellie Wilson]

Thank you, Don -

Your concern is most appreciated. And your caution prompts this question:

If I have an LP 'flameout,' does the gas stop flowing?  Several posts indictate I'll get a 'warning ' on the fridge monitor, but if I'm driving or Zzzzz'ing away, that's not much help . Or, worse yet, away from the bus. I have visions of popping open the door, cigarette in hand and... KA-BOOM! (I know smoking kills, but I'd rather it be more gradual).

Nellie

[Lin]

If the flame goes out the gas will stop.  Same is true of your gas water heater and oven.  Stove tops though must be manually turned off.  It is a pretty basic function of all but the simplest gas devices like a blow torch or bottle top Mr Heater.

[luvrbus]

Nellie, like Lin said the gas will shut off with no flame there is a thermocouple the pilot heat the coupling and opens the gas valve if the flame goes out the valve closes.

good luck

[Sean]

...  Stove tops though must be manually turned off.  ...

FWIW, my cooktop shuts off automatically if the flame goes out.  Pretty much all marine models do this.

Also, note that you are required to have an LP detector that turns off the gas supply if LP is detected in the coach.  One of the reasons I wrote that it's not as simple as "some hose."

-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com

[luvrbus]

Sean, what brand is your cooktop the reason for asking 2 years ago I bought a Gaggenau gas top and never installed it because it has a 110v ignition for the burners.



good luck

[Sean]

Sean, what brand is your cooktop ...

It's a "Princess" 2276 by Seward, which is a very common marine brand.  Lots of high-end coach builders use these, too, and I picked it up cheap at an RV surplus joint.

http://www.seawardproducts.com/2276.htm

Each of the two burners has a thermocouple connected to a solenoid.  Depressing the control knob simultaneously opens the solenoid and operated the ignitor, which in this case is 12 vdc.  You have to hold the knob down for perhaps a full second or so for the thermocouple to heat up, at which point it will hold the solenoid open and you can release the knob.  You then adjust the flame as normal.  If the flame ever goes out, the thermocouple cools off in less than a second and closes the solenoid, shutting off the gas to that burner.



I love it, but as I have said before, if I were doing the coach over again today, I would omit the LP system altogether, and use a pair of 120-vac induction hobs for cooking.  (We do have a single counter-top induction hob as well, and we use that exclusively if we have shore power, and sometimes even when we don't.)

-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com

[cody]

Sean, can you site the code that requires an automatic shutoff if gas is detected? I've never heard or seen that before and I just called a friend that owns an rv shop and he thinks your blowing smoke.  I think it would be a good idea but none of the factory units I've had ever had anything like that, and I've called most of my friends that have new units and they don't have anything like that either, but like I said I think it's a good idea.

[luvrbus]

Cody, the marine world $$$ is different from the RV stuff the Gaggenau stove top I have works the same way except it uses 110v no flame no gas. 


good luck

[gus]

Nellie,

Christy has pretty well covered the vent thing. In short, the vent chimney needs to be shallow so all the cooling air entering the bottom flows over the heated coils before exiting the top. This is very important. Your 8" clearance allows most of the air to exit the top without doing any cooling.

"Automotive fuse" doesn't mean you already have one, it means you need one. An inline holder for one of these is easy to find at WalMart or a parts store. Please note, as already posted, that this will take a 10 gage wire because it draws so many amps, the reason for the 30amp fuse which is pretty big.

I'm very surprised that yours works with no 12v DC input, mine won't do this? However, mine is pretty old.

We've only used the DC frige operation in emergencies.

If my frige blows out it will automatically restart if conditions are favorable, like no strong wind/rain.

[Christyhicks]

I bought a Gaggenau gas top and never installed it because it has a 110v ignition

Hmmmm, our new coach has a Gaggenau cooktop in it and I just assumed it was 12v for the ignition.  (I have to get used to having a thermocouple of the burner. . .used to just lighting it and it being on. . have to hold the knob down for a few seconds before letting go now).  I'll check and see if it's 110v on the ignition when we get back from LA. . . .left the bus in Quartzite and took a few days before heading south and back east.  Sounds like they're getting ready to get more crappy ice in Oklahoma anyway.

I believe Sean is talking about the LP gas detector that shuts the gas off if is "sniffs" propane.  Ours in the little class C will even cut the LP off if it sniffs exhaust fumes from the water heater.  . . which is right next to the entry door, doggone it!

Nellie, the guys are talking about the safety valve on most gas appliances.  In most situations, when you light the pilot or flame, the flame heats up a thermocouple which generates millivolts and greates a magnetic field, "holding" the solenoid in on the gas valve,  to keep the gas flowing.  If the flame goes out, the thermocouple cools down extremely quickly and drops the power to the solenoid, dropping the pilot or flame out.  The big problem you will experience if you are asleep and the pilot on your fridge goes out is that your beer may be a bit warmer in the morning.  I usually deal with this situation by keeping the beer in the coldest part of the fridge, and if necessary, throwing a couple on top of the partially defrosted freezer goods until the fridge cools back down.

Christy Hicks

[cody]

I realize the marine stuff is differernt, but sean states that a leak detector is required to shut the gas off if a leak is detected in a coach, when he says coach that would indicate an rv to me, I know most appliances will shut the gas off if the pilot light goes out, maybe thats what he's talking about but nobody i called is aware of a required leak detector being mandated.  The reason I'm questioning this being mandated is because I spent several days going thru the LP system of a friends 2006 coach trying to find a leak, we could smell it but had a hard time locating it, was a bad flare on a T, but there was no leak detector in the system, we went from the onboard tank to each appliance looking for the leak until we found it

[Sean]

Cody,

I am a bit at a loss here to answer you fully, because I have an older copy of the code.

Since at least 1996, NFPA-1192 has required all RV's with any LP system or appliance to have a permanently installed hard-wired LP detector.  The section from my 2002 code reads:

6.4.8 LP-Gas Detectors. All recreational vehicles equipped with an LP-Gas appliance and electrical system shall be equipped with an LP-Gas detector listed as suitable for use in recreational vehicles under the requirements of UL 1484, Standard for Safety Residential Gas Detectors, and installed according to the terms of its listing.


However, the code is updated regularly, and my understanding is around 2005 (IIRC), the requirement was added to connect the detector to a solenoid valve capable of closing off the flow of gas.

I should note, however, that even my bottom-of-the-line 1995 Fleetwood motor home came with such a shut-off solenoid connected to its LP detector, and most commercial RVs built in that era had similar systems.

Perhaps someone who has access to a post-2005 edition of NFPA-1192 (and/or UL 1484) could chime in here with the correct language (or correct me if I am wrong about this).

-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com