High Sodium level on latest oil analysis

Brian Diehl · November 01, 2009, 07:09:29 AM

Okay guys, the engine is a 2000 Cummins ISM in my MCI 96A3.

I used a clear plastic tube and siphoned out some oil from the sump to have it analyzed. I was looking to see if I needed to change the oil as I now have 9800 miles on this oil change. In all categories my sample came back great with the exception of one. It showed a sodium level of 35. The report says it can be from oil additives or coolant. However, there is no Glycol detected in the sample so I wonder how this could be from coolant. When I compare this to my last test last year all wear metals come in at 75% to 50% of their values last year. So, things appear to be wearing just fine with no concerns noted. So, what could this high sodium level be from? The actual value reported this year is 35 and last year it was 6. This number is "parts per million".

I was hoping to avoid an oil change till I had a few more miles on the oil as the TBN number is still 8.1. However, the test report recommends changing the oil and then retesting as normal at the next oil change interval.

I use Shell Rotella T 15w40 oil.

bevans6 · November 01, 2009, 07:14:20 AM

I have no idea, but i just started to laugh (don't be offended, please!) when I read the title of your post - we are on pretty strict low sodium level diets for blood pressure, and all I could think of is "why is his bus eating so many potato chips and french fries"... Honest!

Small things and small minds, I guess...

Brian

Busted Knuckle · November 01, 2009, 07:15:12 AM

Brian don't they still use salt on the roads up north to fight snow?
Maybe your engine was licking the salty air last trip out!

Seriously, as you can tell I have no "real" clue!

BK

LOL Brian Evans & I were posting @ the same time!

Brian Diehl · November 01, 2009, 07:29:03 AM

Thanks for the laughs guys! Yes, we still use lots of salt up here! Unfortunately we don't use any fry oil or feed it any fries! I wish it was that simple!

On a serious note, we did drive through a lot of salty roads on our way out to Utah and back in April. Could I get salt in to the oil through blow by from the intake/combustion process?

Busted Knuckle · November 01, 2009, 07:30:33 AM

Quote from: Brian Diehl on November 01, 2009, 07:29:03 AM
Thanks for the laughs guys! Yes, we still use lots of salt up here! Unfortunately we don't use any fry oil or feed it any fries! I wish it was that simple!

On a serious note, we did drive through a lot of salty roads on our way out to Utah and back in April. Could I get salt in to the oil through blow by from the intake/combustion process?

Again honestly I don't know, but I'd say it is possible!

BK

bobofthenorth · November 01, 2009, 07:41:48 AM

The problem Brian is you have to be able to trust your sample, regardless of the result, or there isn't much point pulling the oil and paying the 60 bucks. Have you phoned the lab? Ask them how recent their baseline for Rotella 15/40 is. I'd push them pretty hard on the "oil additives or coolant" comment - that's inexcusable as far as I am concerned.

luvrbus · November 01, 2009, 07:50:28 AM

That's been showing up a lot lately I believe it is from the new formulated oils or as Bob stated the labs.I was all ways told not to use the clear plastic so I buy my kits from Cat and they do my samples.
Bob if you are paying 60 bucks for a sample test wait till I see your wife and tell her what I pay Cat LOL

good luck

steve5B · November 01, 2009, 08:08:07 AM

Brian,

I have an oil analysis business, If you use the oil stabilizer product (the name of the Indianapolis colts stadium) it will show up almost everytime. Sometimes if any gaskets were replaced it will show up too. The thing you want to watch is the iron 144 ppm,

This is indicate some possible ware!

Steve 5B....

wayne · November 01, 2009, 08:10:00 AM

I use Cat also $15.00

Brian Diehl · November 01, 2009, 08:10:21 AM

Quote from: luvrbus on November 01, 2009, 07:50:28 AM
That's been showing up a lot lately I believe it is from the new formulated oils or as Bob stated the labs.I was all ways told not to use the clear plastic so I buy my kits from Cat and they do my samples.

This plastic tube was the same one I used last year to pull the prior sample. I did not use the tube for anything else this year and saved is specifically for pulling the sample.

Bob, I will call the lab and ask them:
1) When they last base lined 15w40 Shell Rotella T oil
2) To be more specific about the sodium given the lack of glycol in the system

gumpy · November 01, 2009, 08:11:15 AM

My latest sample shows 3 ppm Sodium. Roughly 9000 miles on the change. That is right in the middle of the range of all samples from the life of my engine.

The report says, regarding Sodium, "Produced when engine coolant contacts a hot surface and the water evaporates leaving a residue; oil additive."

I set a goal to change my oil once a year or 8000 miles, whichever comes first. I sample and test every oil change. I don't use it to tell me when to change the oil.
Just doesn't seem cost effective to pay someone else to tell you when to change your oil. Oil changes really are not that expensive, in the whole scheme of things
bus related, and the benefit of having a pro look over the rest of the coach mechanicals once a year while it's in the air justifies the cost, in my opinion.

Brian Diehl · November 01, 2009, 08:17:03 AM

Quote from: steve5B on November 01, 2009, 08:08:07 AM
Brian,

I have an oil analysis business, If you use the oil stabilizer product (the name of the Indianapolis colts stadium) it will show up almost everytime. Sometimes if any gaskets were replaced it will show up too. The thing you want to watch is the iron 144 ppm,

This is indicate some possible ware!

Steve 5B....

Steve, I did change out my oil pan to a bus style oil pan and put a new oil pan gasket on when I put it on. I also filled up with new oil at the same time. I wonder if this is where it came from then?

For comparison's case, here are my oil sample results:
9800 miles on the oil
Aluminum = 3 ppm
Chromium = 2 ppm
Copper = 5 ppm
Iron = 15 ppm
Lead = 5 ppm
Tin = less than 2 ppm
Silicon = 11 ppm
Potassium = 3 ppm
Sodium = 35 ppm
Moly = less than 2 ppm
Water = less than 0.1 ppm
Oxidation = less than 2.0
Visc@100 = 14.6
Glycol = none detected
Fuel = less than 2.0
TBN = 8.1
Nitration = less than 2.0
Soot = 1.2

Brian Diehl · November 01, 2009, 08:26:42 AM

Quote from: gumpy on November 01, 2009, 08:11:15 AM
I set a goal to change my oil once a year or 8000 miles, whichever comes first. I sample and test every oil change. I don't use it to tell me when to change the oil.
Just doesn't seem cost effective to pay someone else to tell you when to change your oil. Oil changes really are not that expensive, in the whole scheme of things
bus related, and the benefit of having a pro look over the rest of the coach mechanicals once a year while it's in the air justifies the cost, in my opinion.

This is not about money for me. I can afford the oil change - no problems. For me this is about using the resources my bus consumes as efficiently as possible. I want to change my oil only when it needs changing since oil is a finite resource.

steve5B · November 01, 2009, 01:39:51 PM

Brian,

With that info your good to go. When gaskets are replace as you formentioned it might take a few oil changes and it will

remove it's self from the analysis!

Steve 5B...

Brian Diehl · November 01, 2009, 05:03:37 PM

Quote from: steve5B on November 01, 2009, 01:39:51 PM

Brian,

With that info your good to go. When gaskets are replace as you formentioned it might take a few oil changes and it will

remove it's self from the analysis!

Steve 5B...

Thank you Steve. It is good to know where this came from.