Alternative start battery

[Jerry Liebler]

It appears my 2 8D start batteries have gone T. U.   They are about 5 years old & 1 definitely has a shorted cell, the other is sulphated pretty bad and not recovering with pulsing.   I'm thinking of replacing them with multiple smaller batteries. The 8Ds are just too heavy for this old man.   Each 8D sits in a tray and they are wired in parallel (12 volt bus).  It appears that 3 ea of group 24 batteries will fit in the place of one 8D.  The 8D s were 1100 CCA  and I can get 650 CCA group 24s.  Even if I went with 6 group 24 batteries their cost would be less than 2 8D.  My engine starts easily and I have a Webasto for preheating.  Should I go with 3, 4, or 6 of the group 24s?
Regards
Jerry 4107 1120

[Len Silva]

Three Group 31's fit in the space of one 8D on my 4104.  More than adequate for my temperate climate.  If I was spending time in sub-freezing temperatures I might consider more.  I believe the Eagle 15's were equipped with 3 group 31's.

[Brian Diehl]

Jerry,

I'm running 2 Group 31 batteries with the Alliance brand from FreightLiner.  I beilieve they cost around $90 - $100 each.  They are 1125 CCA @ 0 degrees F, 1260 CCA @ 32 degrees F.  They do a great job starting my Cummins.  The ISM is using the starter from the old 6v92 detroit beast.  Of course, I have a solenoid driven cross connect from the house batteries to the start batteries.  This gives me a backup source of battery power.  Otherwise, I probably would have gone with the 8Ds.  So far I have not needed the cross connect to start the bus unless I've forgotten to keep the start batteries on the charger.  All the electronics slowly drain the batteries over the course of 3 weeks or so.  

The cost was less than 50% of the cost of buying two 8Ds from Napa as they appeared to be the only place I could find who carried them around here.  You may consider checking into these for your rig.  They fit beautifully in the original space vacated by the 8Ds.

Here is the information on the batteries:  http://www.alliancebrandparts.com/Core/Pdf/AbpCatalogElectrical.pdf
HTH

-Brian

[Stormcloud]

Jerry:

I replaced my 2-8D batteries with 4 auto batteries, in a series-parallel arrangement to achieve 24 volts at over 1100CCA.
I bought them at WalMart simply because of low price/best warranty.

They have already replaced one that shorted through....no questions asked.
And, they're a helluva lot easier to move.

The bus starts quite easily with this setup. (8V-71NA, batteries in factory compartment at front wheel).

Best regards.

Mark

[JackConrad]

Jerry,
   I don't remember if your bus is 12 or 24 volt.  On our MC-8 (8V71, 24 volt), we use 2 group 31 batteries connected in series. We have never had a problem starting our bus. Disclaimer: We will in the south and have never had to start our bus when the ambient temp was lower than 35 degrees.  Jack

[jjrbus]

Amen on getting rid of the 8D's     Like many others I was lured into 2 group 31 batteries (non turbo 6V71)  I have started my bus in cold weather with a disclaimer of course. I used the block heater first, I would have also done that with 8D's.  I also have a selector switch to cross tie the house batteries to the start batteries. House batteries are 4 6V golf cart type batteries. It appears that WalMart no longer carries the group 31"s
NAPA has a selection of amperage ratings in different groups, I know you are aware of  that Jerry but someone else reading the post may not. After my last experiene buying batteries, my next purchase will be from NAPA.   
                                                           Jim

[Dreamscape]

I switched from 8 D's a few years ago.

I bought two group 31's at Sam's Club for about 75 bucks a piece. I also have a switch to tie the house and start, but have not had to use it, 12V system.

Paul

[belfert]

I found a local truck parts place that sells the group 31s for about $80 which is a pretty good price these days.   I am pretty sure even Sam's Club is higher.

My bus came from the factory with four group 31 batteries.  I would go down to two, but there are something like 16 connections between the four batteries.  It is a convoluted mess, but that is the way the factory did it.

No reason not to use group 31s as some buses like mine came factory that way.

[TomC]

I took my two 8D's out and replaced them with 2-31's that are 950cca.  Turns over the 8V-71 just fine.  If I have a problem with them, I can just hit my jumper switch on the dash and I have two 150 amp continuous rated solenoids (look like the old Ford starter solenoids that were mounted on the inner fender on Ford cars) that jump my two 8D AGM house batteries.  I have started the bus on the deep cycle when the starter batteries were low.  Also is used to charge the house batteries when driving since I have one of my 10 gal water heaters wired through the inverter to maintain hot water during the day.  Good Luck, TomC

[Hartley]

I took my bad 8D's out of my MC9 a while back and installed 4 group 31's. I then encountered another problem. The engine spins over so quick and fast that my fuel pressure starter cut-out was shuting down the starter before the engine could get going. I fixed that and have been tickled with the better performance of the 31's even in cooler weather. I paid $68 each at a truck supply place for the sealed maintenance free style. 1150/990 CCA version.

Dave... ( Now If I could afford fuel... that's another problem.. )

[white-eagle]

two of my three NAPA batteries were out of warranty and barely able to start the bus.  i think one of them was shot and dragging the other two down.  they said 2 were no good failed the test and since winter was coming, i replaced them with 2 Crowns for $85 ea. and the local truck parts place delivered them while picking up the other 2.

He even helped me lift those heavy suckers into the tray which was obviously not designed by anyone who actually had to change out the batteries.

even if i had the option and room, i would not use 8D's.  too heavy, too expensive and if you blow a cell, you're replacing a lot of lead.

also, i have 6 Walmart GC 6volt batteries for house batteries, tied in with jumpers when needed.

[Sean]

Jerry,

FWIW, my 8v92 starts fine on a pair of Group 65's, which are just a tad bigger than the 24's.  They're going on three years old now with no problems, although I did have to jump from the house system after sitting for two full weeks just a few days ago, so I am thinking it's getting time to replace them.

I'd think that three of the group 24 would be more than adequate for your needs.

-Sean
http://ourodyssey.blogspot.com

[VAN]

Back when I was having batt/cable issue's batts went bad ,I too went with 3 new 31's in parallel for 12 volt start thats hard to beat,   Van

[gus]

Jerry,

I have the same setup as Paul, will never go back to the hernia-makers!

Two GP 31s starters are all you need unless you live in a very cold climate.

[Lin]

Just trying to understand this stuff.  My current 8D's are fine and hopefully will remain so for a while.  When they do go, it seems that something smaller will be good.  Of course, I have a 24 volt system so will have to go with 2 or 4.  The issue of group number, as I understand it, merely deals with size and fitting the old trays.  I am, however, a little confused by the power ratings.  We have CCA, CA, Reserve Capacity, and Ah.  I know what each of those means, but am not sure which should be given priority in making a choice.  Since CCA is calculated at 0 degrees, and I do not expect to be in such places, does it make sense to ignore that and use CA?  Does supremacy is one rating imply supremacy in others also?  Should RC and Ah be given equal consideration to cranking amps?  It is amazing how long I have been using batteries and how little I know.

If this should be listed in a separate thread, let me know.