Hey guys, happy new year!!!
First off, I wanna say that I hate that it looks like I pop on here only when there's an issue, but know that I do lurk and read threads, just don't have much to contribute...
Anyway, as some of you know we had a rather catastrophic engine problem last year that we're still reeling from.
After we put the new engine in, we really didn't do that much driving, but we'd been driving the bus a bit more over the last few months and trying to get back on the road.
So far everything had seemed ok and she was running pretty well.
We were making our way out toward Quartzsite, for the big "show" and to hopefully meet some of the fine folks on this board.
We were at a BLM area in Tonopah, AZ and having a good time (well until our beloved dog of 12 years passed away, but that's a whole other story).
When we went to leave last week, I was checking the engine bay as usual after a start, and noticed what sounded like a clanging sound. It was definitely mechanical, and it was somewhere on the driver's side of the engine. I could not tell exactly where it was coming from, but current suspects are the generator/alternator, air compressor, or transmission. The problem only started to happen when the engine was in gear, and it was only luck that I noticed it -as I don't make a point of having the engine in gear while I'm outside ::)
Anyway, we had a short distance to drive (only went to Saddle Mountain RV park a few miles down the road for a dump-n-fill). By the time I finished freaking out about what it could be, the sound had completely stopped.
So we risked it and drove to the park.
We made it to the park ok and have stayed the rest for the week.
Now fast forward to today, when we were about to hit the road to make our way toward Q. Well I started the engine as usual and everything sounded fine. But this time I wanted to intentionally be outside when the bus was in gear to see if I could regenerate the sound. So I had Julie put it in gear (reverse first, since that's what seems to have triggered it last time), and had her drive in reverse. It didn't do it at first. So then I had her put it in drive and move forward a little. That's when I could hear the sound clearly. It's a metallic clanking sound that clanks occasionally. It can be pretty loud at times. So I attempted to get the camera so I can record the sound. Well in that amount of time (roughly 5 minutes or so) the sound had stopped. But for that 5+ minutes it was definitely making the sound. So we played with it a bit more, taking it into gear, out of gear, reverse, forward, throttle up in place in gear... nothing. No sound.
As we were shutting down, Julie noticed the RPM gauge was not working. The RPM is triggered by the generator/alternator. So we fired it back up again, and this time checked for charging, and lo and behold, no charging either.
So, after giving it some thought, we decided to not push our luck and camp here for a bit longer, and seek y'all's council.
So what are your thoughts?
I tried to get my head in there and really listen, but it sounded like it was coming from everywhere on that passenger side.
It seems to completely stop after either it's warm, or settled, or air is full, or the gremlins stop chewing it up, or or or? Hard to tell.
The alternator is definitely not charging, though, and no RPM either. All wires are still in place and nice and tight.
At this point I'm really nervous to drive it. From what I've heard, if it's that flippin' engine-attached/cam-driven POS, I'm worried it could cause issues with the engine.
I had the dum****s at Farmington double-check to make sure the timing and gears (between it and the cam) all lined up, and as everyone here said, make sure they "blue-mark" it to make sure it's hitting on the right gears. I also had them check it to make sure the bearings are in good shape, etc. Not sure how much of that latter part they actually did, but they swore up and down that they checked the gear alignment.
What do you think my options are? Can I drive it? If I disengage the generator field wires, then could I drive it???
I don't care about it charging the batteries. I have a pair of ginormous 8Ds for start and they're in decent shape. Whenever we're parked, I use an automatic charger to keep them healthy, anyway. So I'm not concerned about charging with it at the moment, as I could easily make up for that.
Where can I go or have look at it around here?
Anyway, we're staying here at least another night while we regroup.
I'm not sure what we're going to do, and I'm about at wits end with this %$^$%^$%^ bus!!!
But I also don't want to make things worse.
Your help and advice on this is greatly appreciated, as always,
George
I would not drive the bus. A knocking noise is not good. If it's your alternator it could wipe out your gear train and engine. I had a V730 with a similar knock and the nut had backed off on inner shaft that held the beveled gear on.
Two possibilities to me. One could be that torque converter bolts are loose. The other is the alternator drive has an issue. You could use a mechanics stethoscope to verify that. I wouldn't drive it till you check it. You could have a mechanic remove it and check for any loose or broken parts. If noise is still there, could be torque converter. BTW, coach can be driven without alternator. Just install a fabricated block off plate over the hole and carefully tape over wire ends. Mine was that way when purchased. Some mechanic convinced previous owner it would save 30 hp. Guy ran gen set when needed. No charge light stays on all the time. I pulled the temp cover and cup gear and adapter are both there. I have a good alternator to install, but need to set up dial indicator to make sure mounting adapter is concentric to gear. Procedure is in shop manual and very important that it is correct
And this is precisely why some guys swap to a belt driven pulley setup. I'd like to do this myself. Ticking time bomb in my opinion.
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George, when it starts to rattle have her turn the steering wheel if it goes away you lost the coupling on the power steering pump.If you need some help to be sure.
I have a good friend about 40 miles from you that owns a shop if he is home he will come to you ,Kevin Looney 602-810-1845 and he will treat you right
Quote from: luvrbus on January 07, 2018, 06:10:15 AMGeorge, when it starts to rattle have her turn the steering wheel if it goes away you lost the coupling on the power steering pump.If you need some help to be sure.
I have a good friend about 40 miles from you that owns a shop if he is home he will come to you ,Kevin Looney 602-810-1845 and he will treat you right
Is the coupling on the power steering pump related to the alternator? (It makes sense to me that - if it is the power steering - it knocks on startup but then as the pressure builds up and stablizes, doesn't knock anymore. I was just wondering if the PS pump is connected to the alternator. Not doubting you, Clifford, I just don't know DD engines and was wondering how they work.)
If the alternator coupling was in fault it will certainly not stopping making noise.
Are you sure that the noise is not comming from the unloading valves from the compressor ?
It look like there is two différents issue there.
Bruce, those engines transmit noise from 1 end to the other and are hard to pin point ,the power steering pump on most GM are directly under the alternator if not on the blower drive.
It is sorta like looking for the fathom battery draw that kill the batteries except you have no fuses to pull to find rhe bad circuit.Sean had a coupling go bad on his NeoPlan that sounded like the alternator. I use a Steelman electronic stethoscope it does good at detecting lot better than a old over the ear with a probe.
If George dosen't get help and makes it to Quartzsite I'll drive over and lend him a hand it only 2 hours from me
Quote from: luvrbus on January 07, 2018, 06:43:12 AMBruce, those engines transmit noise from 1 end to the other and are hard to pin point ,the power steering pump on most GM are directly under the alternator if not on the blower drive.
It is sorta like looking for the fathom battery draw that kill the batteries except you have no fuses to pull to find rhe bad circuit.Sean had a coupling go bad on his NeoPlan that sounded like the alternator. I use a Steelman electronic stethoscope it does good at detecting lot better than a old over the ear with a probe.
If George dosen't get help and makes it to Quartzsite I'll drive over and lend him a hand it only 2 hours from me
Thanks, Clifford. That helps me understand what's going on.
He could always use the same method of a grand entry to the "Q" by arriving on a Landoll as Ed did last year! Planty of hands will come out of the wood work to assist just to be a part of it. ::)
;D BK ;D
Quote from: B_K on January 07, 2018, 08:54:36 AM
He could always use the same method of a grand entry to the "Q" by arriving on a Landoll as Ed did last year! Planty of hands will come out of the wood work to assist just to be a part of it. ::)
;D BK ;D
LOL then I had to drive to Quartzsite to get Ed running
Quote from: B_K on January 07, 2018, 08:54:36 AM
He could always use the same method of a grand entry to the "Q" by arriving on a Landoll as Ed did last year! Planty of hands will come out of the wood work to assist just to be a part of it. ::)
;D BK ;D
LOL, BK we could start a whole new tradition...
Just tell the landoll driver to point us in the direction where he sees a good bunch of buses and plop us down there ;D
Thanks for the info and diagnostic steps. I really appreciate it.
I wondered about the PS pump. All that stuff is right there -alternator, PS pump, air compressor, and tranny bell-housing. And Clifford you're absolutely right about the sounds on this thing pinging from one end of that engine to the other. It's really hard to localize it. But if I had to, I'd say it's above the trans housing, and more localized to that component cluster on the passenger side of the engine, with the PS pump, alternator, and air compressor all inches from one another.
I will add that I continue to add trans fluid to the tranny, but I can't get it to register on the stick higher than the lowest mark. I tested it, in neutral while running. Initially it didn't appear on the stick at all. Then I added a quart and that got it to register, but adding an additional quart increased it none at all! So I'm not sure where all of that oil is going. I don't see any huge puddles of oil under the bus. We do have a small leak in the trans pan. I had the geniuses in Farmington drop the trans pan to check things out and make sure all looks good -while also changing the fluid and filter. Since then the pan leaks oil (it never leaked before).
So I used some silicone gasket sealant (on the outside lip of the pan) to try to control it a bit - until I can get to a legit shop with someone who knows what they're doing to replace the gasket. So I'm not sure where that oil is going or if it's related to this. It shifts perfectly fine and solidly hits all shift points and lockups (near as I can tell). So I'm hesitant to dump any more oil in there.
The trans oil does have a secondary radiator that's attached to the outside of the engine rad, and has oil routed to it from the bell-housing, to the radiator, and back in. Perhaps they never fully filled that radiator?????
I also tried to listen to the PS pump when it was running. It sounded "OK", but definitely hard to tell. I did also have Farmington replace the PS pump, because the old one was having issues. Perhaps it flamed out....
So it's possible there's a compound issue? Because the alternator is also not providing RPM signal and doesn't appear to he charging either....
Clifford, thanks a lot for the info on your friend here locally. I plan on giving him a call. Hate to call him on a Sunday, but at least I can get the ball rolling with a voicemail perhaps.
Still hoping we can make Q, but that light is dimming a bit more... we'll see :)
I will report back as I gather more info. I'm hesitant to start it a whole bunch more times (that it might make things worse). But we'll see.
Thanks again!
George
George,do you have the hability to check your oil filter by open it?
Very easy,you remoove it,open it and squize the paper element on your hand. If you see metal on the paper,dont start your engine anymore. If you don't see any metal dust you can continue your diagnostic.
For the generator,check if you have 6 volts at the R on the generator. If you don't have 6 volts over there maybe the relay is burn. You also have a relay just beside your voltage regulator. Whent you put the ignition on,There is suppose to have voltage 12 or 24 volts at the P position on the regulator. If not,the relay is no good .
Just a start......
Did you get help today George
Quote from: luvrbus on January 08, 2018, 05:59:51 PM
Did you get help today George
Clifford, I called and left a message for Kevin. He was busy and said he'd call me back sometime today. So hopefully we'll be able to make contact today.
I've been giving this some thought, and I think I'm just going to pull that alternator (whether or not its the current culprit). That thing has been a source of concern and fear for me for some time. I should've just had them leave it off. But I, in no way, trusted them to redo that with a pulley/belt driven alternator. So I figured this one could last long enough till I got to a competent mechanic. And now I'm regretting that decision. I just didn't want to go completely without engine-driven recharge. Oh well.....
I'm considering removing the $%$%$ thing myself, but that thing weighs a ton and I'm not sure how much oil will drip out once I do remove it. Plus I don't have a replacement cover-plate for it or a way to fashion one, here.
Unfortunately I'm in an RV park and can't do too much playing around (so no pulling oil filter to look at, etc).
Once I talk with Kevin and figure out a plan, I can talk to the park people and see if they'd allow him to work on my bus here on-site.
The alternative option is to tow it out of here -which I would think would be more disruptive overall :/
The only oil you'll get is a little from oil feed line. Rest drains into Bell housing and down to oil pan. There will also be about a cup of oil that will run out of the diode reservoir if you turn it upside down after removal.There is not a tremendous amount of oil up there spraying around when running. A gasket could be made from a piece of gasket stock and a thin piece of sheet metal. Get a mechanics stethoscope from NAPA or similiar. Pull off the metal probe end and use the tubing end to zero in on noise. You could pull alternator out a couple of inches to see the cup gear and driven little gear on alternator and inspect with a strong led flashlight. If there is a problem with the gearing, it'll be obvious. If they look ok, spin the small gear some, looking for roughness. If smooth, Push it back in place and reconnect. Just to check it, you can turn off battery disconnect and leave wiring connected. There should be enough slack. The oil line might need to be unhooked though.
Just got off the phone with Kevin. Had a good conversation, but the short of it is that he doesn't have time to drive out here to look at it. He's stacked up with a bunch of other work. He did say that if it was at his shop, he'd be able to work a little time in to look at it.
We played the "what could it be" guessing game, and his thoughts were (not surprisingly) the same as others have suggested here. It could be a lot of different things, but without being able to look at it himself, he obviously couldn't take more than a guess.
If the alternator hadn't stopped charging with the RPMs reading zero, I would've just risked driving it to his shop. He's only about 20-30 minutes from me. But considering my luck thus far, I'm hesitant to push it much beyond that.
The fact that it stops making the sound AND that it seems to only start making the sound when we shift into gear really throws a wrench into blaming the alternator as the sole cause. I can't think of a scenario where the alternator is toast, and would stop making noise after 5-10 minutes; or only start making the sound when it's in gear. Unless, of course, those are merely a coincidence.
So, I don't know. I guess my remaining option is to have it towed to his shop for him to look at.
Or I could try to remove that thing by myself. I lifted that thing when it was sitting on the bench in Farmingtom and it's a heavy beast.
So I might have to rig up some sort of pulley system to prop up its weight while I'm loosening things... ::)
I am intrigued by Chessie's suggestion of sliding it out an inch or two and checking it visually before fully removing it. But my understanding was that gear-set had to be lined up just right before install and I'm not sure what pulling it out a couple of inches will do to that...
No, the alternator goes in one way, just mark it at top stud to make you more confident. The gear meshing issue is that 3/4 inch adapter that goes between it and and bell housing. It !ocates exact position of gear mesh and clearance at tooth mesh when running. If this adapter is off center some, tooth mesh could bind in one side of cup gear and be barely engaged on opposite side. You can see how this could cause failure of the drive system in a short amount of time. If when sliding back into position, gears don't want to engage, make sure mounting surfaces are parallel and wiggle slightly side to side and up and down. Just don't bull it. If it still won't engage, you can turn the little gear a touch and repeat. A pry bay may help working it back in by gently prying up between bottom of alternator and top of bell housing. Or, you could remove it, and if ok, either reinstall or make a temp gasket from two or three pieces of cardboard. Restart engine and check for noise from other areas. Then you might be able to drive it to mechanic. He can reinstall it while there.
That friggn alternator weighs 100 lbs watch it they can hurt you, use your tow service and tow it to Kevin he is just off I 10 plus he is big,strong and young
Actually....103 lbs. Unless you've done some heavy work on your own, have tools and can get some help on getting it out and back in, just bite the bullet and get it towed. Hopefully, it is not that far. Especially after the financial catastrophe of the engine repairs.
There is no way for you to remove the alternator alone.
We used a little engine crane with a special tool fixed to the positive bolt and a kind of vise grip on the upper part of the casting. You may be able to take the weight of the alternator by lifting it by the bottom with the crane and with help pulling it out.
OK, you guys have convinced me, lol.
I was already hesitant trying to yank that thing out of there by myself, and seeing the comments above has removed any remaining doubt.
While I might maybe sorta be able to possibly pull that thing out myself, I might also make matters worse -if I drop it on top of the tranny housing, or torque/crunch/tear-up that gear-set under too much weight, or drop a 100lb chunk of metal on my feet :o
So, towing it sounds like the better option.
While I would have liked to leave here under my own power (this thing has spent an inordinate amount of time riding proudly high on top of a landoll), it might make for less of a show overall.
... I still wonder if buying a landoll and putting the bus on it, full-time, might make a better (and more cost-effective) long-term solution :-\
That will be good if you try someting before ring the towing.
There is certainly a garage with and old timer mechanic around your place.
Ask him to have a look with his stethoscope. He will tell you right away where the noise is comming from. In 27 years, I never came across a noisy alternator whent I put the transmission in gear......I often saw a 730 noisy whent I put in gear.....you probabely have two problems. The alternator is easy to check in a few minutes. There is a relay beside your voltage regulator. Check it . Don't give up !
In talking with Kevin, he's not sure if he has a replacement blank plate for that alternator.
He said he should be able to fashion one, if needed.
But just in case, and not sure if it matters, does anyone have an actual plate they'd be willing to part with?
If so, would you be willing to send it to Kevin's shop?
I'd, of course, pay the cost of such -just let me know how much and how to send the funds.
Thanks!
Detroit never made a 9 inch blank off plate for the alternator Kevin will need to make 1 ,he will need to remove the sun gear to make a flat plate work or have it cupped for the sun gear
George are you having any problems with your start batteries going dead. If your Alternator isn't working it shouldn't be charging the starts? Say hi to Kevin for me.
Mine still has the cupped gear in place. The block off plate is flat, probably because the centering adapter is still in place. The plate does not look like a custom one off job. Maybe a marine item?
I have never been able to find the 9 inch cover I can find the one if you remove adapter that goes from 5 in to 9 inch on the older 71 engines I have bushel of those
My v-drive 6V92TA circa 1982 does not use an adjusting spacer. The 50DN fits right on the flywheel housing using studs. When I eliminated the 50DN I made a cover plate out of 1/4" steel using the gasket as a template. If Geom has the same alternator and can use mine he should pm me. It is a 24v 50DN.
Geoff
Some of the 50D used a 7 inch bolt pattern same as the compressor
Thanks guys. I'll discuss with Kevin and figured out what size it is and perhaps reach out to Geoff or Clifford if those are the parts that will work.
On another subject, in working with my tow insurance company, I'm having difficulty getting them to send a landoll. They're saying one is not required for this vehicle and that it can be pulled conventionally with a typical wrecker.
He said they'd slide a lift under the wheels, pull the drive shaft and lift up for towing.
I called Kevin and he wasn't certain but said it should be ok, just more work for him to get it going again.
From previous posts and my own experience I thought a landoll is really the way to tow these.
I'm "discussing" it with their management now, but I wanted to get some additional input just in case.
Thanks!
You are fine with a wheel lift wrecker they don't damage like the old chain and hooks style,Interstate in Phoenix has 20 Landoll's and the wheel lift type.I use Interstate they have never damaged anything for me and they are probably going to be used by your towing co because they are the most reasonable in Phoenix 105 bucks a hour 3 hr min is what they charge me
Thanks Clifford!!
If the wheel-lift type is ok to use (after they disconnect the drive shaft) then I'll go ahead and approve having them send out one of those.
It doesn't have far to go anyway, I just didn't want to possibly make it worse.
I thought the towing instructions were in the book, but they're not. Kind of an odd thing for GM to leave out of the manual (considering they have an entire 20 page chapter dedicated to the pooper). But I suppose that speaks to just much GM expected these things to be towed, lol ::)
Quote from: Geom on January 10, 2018, 09:07:44 AM
Thanks guys. I'll discuss with Kevin and figured out what size it is and perhaps reach out to Geoff or Clifford if those are the parts that will work.
On another subject, in working with my tow insurance company, I'm having difficulty getting them to send a landoll. They're saying one is not required for this vehicle and that it can be pulled conventionally with a typical wrecker.
He said they'd slide a lift under the wheels, pull the drive shaft and lift up for towing.
I called Kevin and he wasn't certain but said it should be ok, just more work for him to get it going again.
From previous posts and my own experience I thought a landoll is really the way to tow these.
I'm "discussing" it with their management now, but I wanted to get some additional input just in case.
Thanks! Have them pull the axle.Most decent wrecker company's have blank off plates to keep your axle grease from coming out.Whole heck of a lot easier than taking out the drive shaft!!
I've had buses towed into my shop and the tow driver is supposed to put the axles back in, but I tell them not to bother because I am afraid that is all they are going to do-- put them back in. If I do it, I clean the surfaces and put it back together so I don't have any complaints about axles leaking down the road after the repairs are made.
Quote from: Geoff on January 10, 2018, 03:17:19 PM
I've had buses towed into my shop and the tow driver is supposed to put the axles back in, but I tell them not to bother because I am afraid that is all they are going to do-- put them back in. If I do it, I clean the surfaces and put it back together so I don't have any complaints about axles leaking down the road after the repairs are made.
Geoff I ain't try'n to argue with you, but in all the years I have been involved with towing we NEVER re-installed drive shafts or axles as our insurance company would not cover it if anything were to happen because we were not certified mechanics and very rarely did anyone at any shops complain. The only time I got complaints was from Joe Smoe private do it yourselfer that would have MOST DEFINITELY sued us had anything gone wrong!
I always told anyone who questioned me to call the office and if they told me to I would replace them. (never once did I even get questioned about it by the dispatcher, nor told to do it.)
And as you noted what is better a guy getting paid to put them back in and taking his time to do it right, or a "steering wheel holder" that just wants to slap 'm in and get the heck on done the road?
;D BK ;D
Sorry, BK, but this is Arizona and no tow truck driver has told me he was not allowed to put the axles back in. They always ask if I want them to do it.
Geoff
Quote from: Geoff on January 10, 2018, 04:40:22 PM
Sorry, BK, but this is Arizona and no tow truck driver has told me he was not allowed to put the axles back in. They always ask if I want them to do it.
Geoff
Hey no problem Geoff, but in IN, KY and TN where I have always worked when driving tow trucks our liability insurance would not cover it, so the bosses would not allow it. (I know for a fact I am smart enough to do it, and do it right. But why bother if it's going piss off the boss and create more work for me?)
;D BK ;D
They always ask me and say no just leave me a new gasket
Quote from: luvrbus on January 10, 2018, 05:19:50 PMThey always ask me and say no just leave me a new gasket
I've never had to do this. Am I right that you only pull one axle and let the diff take care of the other one?
Thanks. This will be good to know in the future, I'm sure. ;)
Quote from: Oonrahnjay on January 10, 2018, 06:24:23 PM
I've never had to do this. Am I right that you only pull one axle and let the diff take care of the other one?
Thanks. This will be good to know in the future, I'm sure. ;)
When I was towed last year the tow truck driver would NOT reinstall the axle! Besides, neither he nor I had a new gasket. He took out only the passenger-side axle because we were going only a few miles on slow streets, but he said if it were much further he may have removed both axles. He also said he really didn't like to remove driveshafts unless there were no other choice, but it still took many hard whacks with a BFH to loosen all the axle's split cones. Interestingly, the driver-side axle end is still pristine and unmolested, but the passenger-side one shows signs of having been removed before - obviously it's safer to not work next to passing cars!
I had to thoroughly scrape and clean the old hardened Permatex goo before I could install my new gasket. ABC Bus says they never use gaskets, only compound there instead, but gaskets are cheap and easy to use. It took a whole quart of oil to fill up the diff, and I jacked up the far side to ensure the oil flowed through into the bearing. After my first short trip afterwards I rechecked the diff oil level and it hadn't changed, so I guess all the oil had reached everywhere it should. I now keep a few spare gaskets and a spare quart of oil in the bus, "just in case" . . .
John
As said we preferred to pull axles on buses over driveshafts. And if it was a "short tow" (10-20 miles) we only pulled one unless it was a known rear end or axle problem to begin with.
If it was a longer tow or we knew that there was a "drive line" problem we pulled both axles.
But again we NEVER re-installed them and most times we used silicone with our covers that we removed to have for the next tow.
;D BK ;D
I would NOT pull driveshaft on a buffalo to tow. Extremely short and a real pita to remove. Very hard for access to differential end and would have to tie so as not to contact turning flange. Pull the axles only.
Quote from: chessie4905 on January 11, 2018, 03:49:19 AM
I would NOT pull driveshaft on a buffalo to tow. Extremely short and a real pita to remove. Very hard for access to differential end and would have to tie so as not to contact turning flange. Pull the axles only.
LOL I won't pull the friggn drive shaft on any GM to tow they are a real PITA with all the flange bolts
Pulling the driveshaft on ANY bus is a PIA! But that said there have been several occasions where I had NO CHOICE, but to pull the shaft.
Once I beat and beat on both axles for over an hour each and never could get either broke loose, so I finally did break down and raise the front of the bus high enough I was able to get to the driveshaft and removed it, what a PAIN it was like 14 bolts on both flanges! (but it beat buying the customer a transmission!)
;D BK ;D
Remember Geoff when mine was pulled into your shop, when you could still get into it, the driver had pulled the axles and I don't remember he even asking you if you wanted them reinstalled. Thanks for taking us in that day and rebuilding the motor.
ED
OK Guys, thought I'd provide a quick update.
We ended up getting towed from the RV park -serving as that afternoon's entertainment.
It took him like 6 hours to finally get that tow done. I kinda felt bad for the guy. I still think a landoll would've been A LOT easier than all the futzing and jacking and banging/clanging/measuring/adjusting/positioning/etc it actually took to finally get that up on the wheel-lift and rolling.
I tried to tell them ;)
Anyway, the next morning Kevin and I began trying to recreate and isolate the sound. And, of course, now it would not make the sound at all!!
No combination of neutral/reverse/forward/back/under-load/no-load/whatever would get the sound to happen.
So I took it for a spin around the block and back. No sound.
I continued messing with it myself, for a while longer... no sound! ::)
I also figured out that the generator not working was my duh.
The last time I started it, I wanted to be back there when the engine started so I can hear everything as it fired up. I used the rear start switch. And if left in the middle position, several electrical things are taken out of circuit -including the alternator relay. Once returned to run, the generator was charging and rpm showing fine.
After talking with Kevin, we decided to go ahead and drive to Q. It's only around 100 miles away and makes for a pretty good test.
We made it here yesterday. I stopped a couple of times to verify if there was any weird sound and still nothing.
So, while I'm quite glad that it wasn't a serious thing... I'm still baffled by what it was -and I don't like these kinds of mysteries. :-\
I didn't imagine the sound. And it was definitely disconcerting. But try as we could, we couldn't recreate it.
The plan now is to stay close to the area for a while and try to not go too far off the beaten path from a towable location; and hope for the best.
I decided to just leave things as they were. We could've removed the generator and all that, but by all accounts everything looked fine there.
----
On a more pleasant topic, hopefully I'll get to see some folks and their buses from this forum. Not sure where everyone landed (need to reread Gary's post), but we're currently north of town off of Plomosa road.
Thanks to everyone for their advice and help.
And Clifford thanks a lot for Kevin's contact info.
Kevin is definitely good people and it was a pleasure to meet him. If we can squeeze into his busy schedule, we plan on making a second trip out here in a few weeks to take care of some other stuff.
~George
Yep Kevin is a good guy and sharp glad you got to meet him.if you are around next Sat I am going to look you up at Quartzsite we will be over with the Gm and Eagle people.LOL if I get through with the GM bus in the shop in time,when people stuff a 6v92Ta in a 4104 it is nightmare took me 1 whole day just to remove the friggn turbo
Clifford My turbo sets right on top of the 730. First thing you see when you lift up the gate.
Impress the car people to see a turbo on a old gm bus.
uncle ned
OK, I think I've come closer to identifying the clanging sound.
The cap on the transmission dipstick has always been attached using this goofy setup with an upside screw attached with a nut on the outside of the cap. It's worked itself loose (but not fully off) several times before. Each time I tried a different way to keep it from working loose, tightened it, and kept an eye on it. Yet every time it would eventually work loose again. Usually I've caught it in time to retighten it.
Except this last time. I noticed that it was completely off, when I was doing some other work back there. That, coincidentally, was right before we started hearing the sound :-\
I managed to find the screw and pull it back up using a magnet. And I thought that was it. And didn't think much more about it. I latched that sucker down and used pipe-thread compound to lock it into place. And it holding fine now.
But, I'm now wondering if there wasn't a washer or something there that went down the dipstick tube and into the transmission pan ???
The sound came back again, the last time we ran the bus.
Once again it was when we shifted into gear (drive specifically).
Once again it stopped after a short while. It clanged around a bit -for a few minutes. Then stopped.
I checked sound with the screwdriver handle against my ear and it really sounds to be coming from the transmission bell-housing.
Is it possible that a washer or something is causing the clanging?
If something falls in the pan, wouldn't a screen or similar catch it and stop it from getting sucked in?
Anyway, I'm feeling kinda stupid at the moment :-\
Your thoughts are appreciated as always.