Bus I.D. Numbers - Mine are screwed up.

[Chaz]

Hey Guys,
  Jerry and I were just talking and the subject of how many 4108's were built and the numbers and such and it got me thinking again.   (scarey thought.....I know, I know!  )
  Below is a post Russ sent me when I was just a little bitty newbie. 
  All of it sounds right except my title clearly says it's a 1973!!!!!! How could they screw that up?? (Jerry had a good answer, but I'm afraid I might step on a toe or two.  ;DLOLOLOL)
  I don't really care what the title says to be honest- it's so old, it doesn't matter- but I would like to know it's actual pedigree.................. if nothing else, for posterity. 
  So, is it possible to get the real "poop" -there's that word again!  - on what I have? Like I said, the info below sounds like it could be correct as the destination sign reflects that it was from No. Indiana, but it would just be nice to know for sure. People often ask what the year is, and it just makes me feel wierd not telling them definitvely what it is. Not that it really matters.
 
    Thoughts??

        Chaz
 

Re: Lots of questions-newbie needs help...please!
« Reply #13 on: October 17, 2006, 09:58:10 PM »   

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Chaz -

FYI - P8M4108A-197 was delivered new in September 1977 as fleet number 78 to Shoup Buses (Cardinal Buses), based in Middlebury, IN.  More than likely, it spent approximately 10 years in Shoup's fleet before being sold off to it's next owner.

So, two bits of ID info about your bus have been solved by the VIN:

~~ It's a 1977 model, not a 1973.

~~ It's a 35-foot 4108, not a forty-foot 4905.

Some other tidbits:

Coach electrical system, unless changed by a previous owner, is 24VDC.

Coach should have the preferred Sheppard power steering on it.  Easy way to tell - look at the steering gearbox.  If it has hydraulic hoses going to it, it's a Sheppard.

If it's still the 4-speed stick shift, you'll get about 8-9 mpg.  If it's an automatic, you'll get 7-8 mpg.  Be safe - figure 750 miles and it's time to look for fuel. . .   

Top speed with the stick shift should be about 75 mph, and about 71 with an auto.

Rear axle ratio is 4.125:1

If it's a stick shift, the bevel gearset has a 0.808:1 ratio, yielding a 3.33:1 overall rear axle ratio in 4th.

If it's an automatic, it will be different, depending on the auto trans model.  When you get back, post a pic of the tranny to help ID and thus give better info.

If it's a stick, it will have a "wet clutch".  Impossible to put into 1st gear at a stop w/o grinding.  Nature of the beast, something you'll have to get used to.  Two solutions: Either shut off the engine, put into gear and restart, or: put in clutch, wait a couple seconds, bump gearshift into 4th, then slip it over into first.

Again, welcome aboard!!

FWIW & HTH. . .







Report to moderator    Logged 

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Russ
PD4106-2784
Fresno CA

[RJ]

Chaz -

When you sent me the VIN, I looked it up in the "General Motors Coach Parlor Car Delivery List" that I have sitting on the bookshelf right behind my computer.  This is the same Roster that Doug Wotrig (Tekebird) and JL Vickers have, and all three of us agree that it's extremely accurate.

The reason your title says it's a '73 rather than the accurate '77 is because somebody somewhere screwed up - period.  Most likely a non-attentive clerk at a DMV, or a previous owner trying to pull one over on the DMV to save some $$$ on registration fees.

FYI:  According to the above roster, there were 67 PD-4108s built/delivered between May of 1970 and August of 1971.  Beginning in December of 1971, GMC changed the nomenclature to P8M-4108A, and then proceeded to build 232 of them, with the last one being delivered in November of 1978.  Added together, a total of 299 were produced.

OTOH, if you didn't give me an accurate VIN to begin with. . .   

No. . . wait!  Things are only screwed up because you and Jerry got to talking, and that got you to thinking!!  ROFLMAO!!

FWIW & HTH. . .

Hey Guys,
  Jerry and I were just talking and the subject of how many 4108's were built and the numbers and such and it got me thinking again.   (scarey thought.....I know, I know!  )
  Below is a post Russ sent me when I was just a little bitty newbie. 
  All of it sounds right except my title clearly says it's a 1973!!!!!! How could they screw that up?? (Jerry had a good answer, but I'm afraid I might step on a toe or two.  ;DLOLOLOL)
  I don't really care what the title says to be honest- it's so old, it doesn't matter- but I would like to know it's actual pedigree.................. if nothing else, for posterity. 
  So, is it possible to get the real "poop" -there's that word again!  - on what I have? Like I said, the info below sounds like it could be correct as the destination sign reflects that it was from No. Indiana, but it would just be nice to know for sure. People often ask what the year is, and it just makes me feel wierd not telling them definitvely what it is. Not that it really matters.
 
    Thoughts??

        Chaz
 

Re: Lots of questions-newbie needs help...please!
« Reply #13 on: October 17, 2006, 09:58:10 PM »   

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Chaz -

FYI - P8M4108A-197 was delivered new in September 1977 as fleet number 78 to Shoup Buses (Cardinal Buses), based in Middlebury, IN.  More than likely, it spent approximately 10 years in Shoup's fleet before being sold off to it's next owner.

So, two bits of ID info about your bus have been solved by the VIN:

~~ It's a 1977 model, not a 1973.

~~ It's a 35-foot 4108, not a forty-foot 4905.

Russ
PD4106-2784
Fresno CA

[Nusa]

I have a notarized official copy of my birth certificate that shows me a good thirty years younger than I actually am. All because the clerk at the courthouse accidentally typed in the current year instead of my birth year. Fortunately, my dad got me two copies, and only one was incorrect, so my passport application wasn't delayed.

Sadly, I can't think of any advantage of being able to produce paperwork "proving" I'm still in my 20's.

[tekebird]

you could sell your identity to someone in thier 20's

[Runcutter]

Chaz, if it helps, you might look at the post (now on page 5) - GM Final Vehicle Records Available.  Ours came in, includes delivery date, original owner, optional parts, serial numbers, etc.

http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=5416.0

Arthur

[Chaz]

No. . . wait!  Things are only screwed up because you and Jerry got to talking, and that got you to thinking!!  ROFLMAO!!   

Nah. I guess I really do have a bad title. Sucks.
I'm not a total stickler about stuff like that, but I would like to be accurate, ya know? I guess I will go with '77 since that seems to be what is correct. If it ever comes to proving it with what I have- registration/Title- I guess I'll just have to do my fast talking then. 

  Well, I guess I just myself a newer bus!!!! Could be worse.............. (usually is  )


    Thanx,
        Chaz

[maria-n-skip]

Chaz,

   There are probably more reasons but the only 2 major times it can be a problem
is if you go to sale the bus (God forbid) and if it is stolen (God forbid) so
what it really comes down to any problems would be an act of God.


Just a thought

Skip

[RJ]

Chaz, if it helps, you might look at the post (now on page 5) - GM Final Vehicle Records Available.  Ours came in, includes delivery date, original owner, optional parts, serial numbers, etc.

http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=5416.0

Arthur

Chaz -

There you go - Arthur's got the solution for you.  Besides, having a copy of the FVR would be proof to a DMV about the ID of the coach - and to a potential buyer, should you ever decide to sell.  (I have the FVR for my 4106 - very interesting document.)  Added plus: By donating to the museum, you get an additional tax deduction!!


All -

For those of you who have MCIs and Prevosts, both companies will provide copies of the FVR if you inquire.

FWIW & HTH. . .