Need some advice on a mistake.

Scott & Heather · July 05, 2019, 08:03:44 AM

You guys have known me on here for over 10 years. I've made a lot of good decisions, made some bad ones, converted a couple of buses and the second one has turned out really nice. Recently I made an error in judgment and I'm looking for some specific advice from people who might know what options I have.

I purchased a 2015 Forest River Rockwood Roo off of Craigslist without a title. It was a salvage damaged unit I paid $1300 for. I repaired the damage and everything in the trailer works perfectly. Two of the three popout tent canvas were damaged in the accident so I just closed those hatches and sealed them shut with caulk. Front popout tent still works fine. Unit has a slideout dining area which we turned into a queen bed. It's a really nice camper. I have in the past been able to obtain titles using surety bonds. It has never been an issue. I'm not afraid to think out of the box and neither is my local Secretary of State so I've never been concerned about a missing title. After several weeks of drama with SOS and Lansing (sos isn't the issue, Lansing is), we've realized the trailer has a scrapped title and there is no going back. It cannot be put back on the road. Not even as a homebuild. I'd have to remove the body from the frame and only use the frame and axles to build a new unit.

I don't need wagging fingers or I told you so comments. I already feel like a dunce for wasting $1300 on the trailer, $180 on a useless surety bond and $2000 repairing the trailer and making it nice. So now, I'm just trying to make the best out of a stinky situation. I'm bummed and annoyed and just wonder if anyone out there has any creative ideas for either somehow getting this nice camper back on the road or salvaging this situation more than just selling the parts.

Here's a link with a bunch of photos of it:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/xHwVRW1BkV7oVvL18

richard5933 · July 05, 2019, 08:17:22 AM

There was an article in ATHS (American Truck Historical Society) in June talking about a similar type of thing in the trucking world. Sounded like guys used to take a crate of parts to Peterbilt and have them build a new truck around an old VIN.

Could you find a similar trailer which has been wrecked but still has a clean title? (Obviously one that's fallen apart but still not been officially listed as 'scrap'.) All you'd need is enough of the wrecked trailer to be able to use its VIN on your trailer. Can get sketchy if all you're taking from the wreck is the VIN plate itself, but I'm sure that's been done before. Can you find out how much of a trailer must be reused to be able to retain the VIN?

From the article in ATHS it sounds like others have been creative with things like this in the past.

Scott & Heather · July 05, 2019, 08:22:49 AM

Very interesting thought Richard. I have thought of this. They don't specify a percentage of the trailer being reused but I was told verbally by sos that only the frame and axles could be used for a rebuild.

richard5933 · July 05, 2019, 08:23:44 AM

Where is the VIN plate mounted on one of those things? Seems like that's the part you'd want to keep from one with a clean title

thomasinnv · July 05, 2019, 08:28:21 AM

Quote from: richard5933 on July 05, 2019, 08:23:44 AM
Where is the VIN plate mounted on one of those things? Seems like that's the part you'd want to keep from one with a clean title

Depending on year and manufacturer could be stamped into the frame rail on the tongue or directly behind the tongue, could be a sticker stuck to the body front left side, or inside the door frame.

edvanland · July 05, 2019, 08:45:58 AM

Why not check and find out what the requirements are for a home built trailer are for your state. In Arizona you can build your own trailer. I have in the past taken a old trailer frame and built flat bed trailers. Find the old VIN number and get rid of it. I would do this by welding plate over the area to make it look like I had reinforced that area never had a problem. Why not check it out? NO I never stole a trailer I would find these out in the desert

Astro · July 05, 2019, 08:55:38 AM

On a 2015, the VIN is likely on a sticker due to cheap manufacturers wanting to reduce cost.

THe problem with obtaining another "Rockwood" is that it would likely cost more than Scott's original deal and with it and the previous expenses makes buying "two to get one" costly.

I suggest you "launder' your current Roo.

Remove any and all traces of its previous life as a 2015 Rockwood Too. That means stickers, names, stripes, words, warnings, stampings, instructions, tire tags, etc. Scrub it clean. Then, go out and find the cheapest, old, dilapidated, rusty, worthless flatbed trailer about 10-12 feet in length with a good title and a serial or VIN number. Once you have title and number in hand, cut up and scrap the old trailer, toss it in the recycle bin never to be seen again keeping only the title. Stamp the new VIN from your flatbed on your new trailer on the tongue. Then, take your title with its number, maybe with your new "homebuilt" trailer (sans any markings, other than maybe "Scott's bunker" stenciled across front) and go to dmv unrelated to any you have discussed this issue with. Tell them you re-built your own camping trailer on the old flatbed (if asked, other than that say as little as possible) and want to change the type on title for insurance purposes. That should get you plates and a clean title..

Remember, brush up on your states home built trailer laws, if any and say as little as possible. Don't go back over your old DMV or SOS footprints. They will raise an eyebrow.

I heard this works.... wink, wink. Just sayin......

pabusnut · July 05, 2019, 09:03:36 AM

Scott,

If you plan to sell this unit to turn a $$, you will probably need a title of some sort.

If you want to get it on the road legally with a registration, look into registering it in Maine. You can legally register it there even if you have no connection to the state. Many big trucking companies have all their trailers registered in Maine.

I have one trailer that I am making into a utility trailer that I will probably go that route.

Sebulba · July 05, 2019, 09:19:56 AM

Scott,

I have similar suggestion. Check neighboring states and see what options there may be.

Interesting thing happened to me. I once bought a motorcycle in Colorado with a salvage title. I lived in Wyoming and Wyoming didn't have salvage titles so my bike was 'laundered' and didn't carry the tainted salvage title any longer.

Seb

Fred Mc · July 05, 2019, 10:29:18 AM

So,if you can start fresh with the frame and build a new unit who is to say how you build it.that is presuming you can build another camper using the frame vs building a flat deck trailer. Go to a different office and tell them you rebuilt it from scratch using the old material off the exisitng one. Go to the lumber yard and buy a bunch of 2x2's to show them a receipt. Most campers are bluilt using 2x lumber. Thats why the called them sticks and staple construction.

Jim Blackwood · July 05, 2019, 11:04:55 AM

Interesting thing, KY doesn't require tags on trailers. Not sure this applies to camper trailers but it could be a loophole. If you bought it in KY you might not need anything except a bill of sale.

Laws vary greatly from state to state. There's bound to be a remedy that will work for you.

Jim

windtrader · July 05, 2019, 12:57:23 PM

Hi Scott,
Your intentions did not speak to me. Are you planning on keeping and using the trailer or selling it? If keeping it, there are fewer issues to deal with.
As we all know, vehicle regulations, registration, licensing, insurance, etc. are state specific. At worst case, especially as you travel, get it registered in a lenient state. A range of ideas have already been offered up, spanning letter of the law to rogue; you need to decide where you want to stand on that scale.
You'll find a way through this.

Dave5Cs · July 05, 2019, 01:29:38 PM

Scott check the laws in MI but also check with the highway patrol there. In California and some other states when you have a Salvage title they allow you to fix it up and then take it to the HP and have it inspected for road worthlessness. If they pass it then you can get a title with their approval and its free. My son does it here all the time with cars and trailers.

Ed Hackenbruch · July 05, 2019, 02:40:38 PM

Just find somebody that wants to use it as a tiny house on a lot somewhere and doesn't care that it can't be on the road anymore.

bobofthenorth · July 05, 2019, 03:41:58 PM

You can probably sell it to a Canadian without doing anything further. We don't know what vehicle titles are. Bill of sale with the vendor name and address plus serial number and description of the trailer should get you buyer a registration anywhere in Canada. He's going to have to pay GST when it crosses the border but that should be all - thank you very much Brian Mulroney and Ronald Reagan for NAFTA. This link has some information but there's a typo in the 2nd paragraph referring to trailer imports - the wording in the link makes it sound like the trailer must be over 10,000# but in fact the requirement is for them to be under that weight.