Water / Batteries / Generator Layout in bays for weight distrobution

[neoneddy]

Edit: My Primary Question here is about weight distribution  

First,  I ran across this page http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=3398.0   But all the image resources are dead (never use image hosting services for you images.  They all go out of business or get bought eventually)

I see TomC's idea of water under the bed,  I like it theory for a few reasons, but we lofted our bed just a few inches to use it for storage (fits the standard big bins from walmart or whatever) or for the dog (140lb St Bernard) .. or extra sleeping room for the kids if we have more guests.. I just like the utility of the space.

I'm looking to start water install as soon as I can.  Right now my electrical / generator (in old AC condenser bay)  / batteries and water is all shaping up to be on the driver side.  I feel like this will cause weight imbalance issues.   I'm hoping to leave the passenger side bays open for lawn chairs, games (corn hole) , tables, I've even got a plans for a roll out outdoor kitchen.  I suppose many of those items will balance it all out.


I was looking at tanks like  this 100 Gal from Northern Tool. I think it will full up a side of a bay.  I'm planning to do grey and black tanks as well unless I can be convinced to just do a  combined black / grey.


https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200642859_200642859

I have a Fleet Farm here close as well and looking at few of theirs.

What don't I know that I don't even know?

[Gary Hatt - Publisher BCM]

You should consider http://ardemco.com/.  They have been building holding tanks for buses and boats for several years.  They can build you any size tank to fit your application to make the most use of your space.  Call them today at 800-253-0115.

[eagle19952]

You should consider http://ardemco.com/.  They have been building holding tanks for buses and boats for several years.  They can build you any size tank to fit your application to make the most use of your space.  Call them today at 800-253-0115.

best choice...they will spin weld all of the pipe bosses you want...get more than you think you'll need...my tanks (4) 62 gallon 14  years in are the least of my worries. great product.

[richard5933]

Seems like you'll definitely be heavier on one side than the other when your tanks for full. Of course you can certainly offset depending on where the fuel tank is, etc. Seems like you could easily use the battery bank to act as counterbalance as well. If you build a nice enclosure for the batteries you'd still have the area above it for storage in that bay.

We have only two tanks - fresh water and black water. Same with our previous coach. Not really sure that there is a need for separate gray water nowadays, and I've seen a couple of new Class A motor homes out there without a gray tank. Back when the gray could easily be dumped without a proper dump site, I guess that it was nice to separate the tanks, but I'm not convinced that they are totally necessary now. Of course, I know that other will disagree.

We don't have a city water pressurized hookup either, so both our fresh and black water tanks are the same size, somewhere between 100-120 gallons (I have not done the math yet to calculate). As long as I don't fill the fresh water to the top, I'll never worry about overfilling my black water tank.

[neoneddy]

Richard : what is your bay layout like then?

How bad is it to be out of balance?


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[richard5933]

Richard : what is your bay layout like then?

How bad is it to be out of balance?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't think we're out of balance at all, really. The generator is on one side. It weighs in about 950 lbs. On the other side are the fresh/black water tanks. A hundred gallons of water weighs about 800 pounds. Whether in the fresh or black water tanks, it's the same amount of water and weighs the same (mostly). The tanks slightly cross over the center-line of the bus.

The only thing that I'm slightly concerned about is the 450 lbs of batteries I'm about to add to the same side as the water tanks. They will be mounted just to the side of the center-line, as close to the center as I can get them.

I'm not able to weigh all the components of the coach (upstairs & in the basement) since they're already installed. I'll have to see how it weighs in my first time on the 4-corner scales, and then I'll adjust as needed to get things evened out.

[scanzel]

A lot depends on what is existing and staying in your bays. On ours the front two bays are battery bank times 8 AGM batteries plus inverter passenger side, driver side 9kw Kohler gen. next bay back 110 gal fresh water in middle center line of bay, 20 gal hot water heater driver side and cloths washer passenger side. Next two small bays have OTR heat/air blowers etc. Last bay has 110 gal black/gray that is low and extends across the whole bay. This config ate up some storage but I tried to balance everything out. Still have some storage but not a lot.

[chessie4905]

What size are the agms? Industry number. Are they single or double stacked?

[bigred]

There is also a tank manufacturer in Red Bay Alabama,but I can't remember the name of the place!!

[HB of CJ]

It is fun and easy to sit down with a bunch of copier paper and a good pencil.  Lots of erasers needed too.  Gather up all the idea you may have or imagined and set them down into brief engineering sketches.

You will need to know several things about what you want to put into your Bus Conversions. First is the performance.  Will it work for you?  Any special considerations or needs?  The items must work OK.

Next the size of the stuff.  Dimensions.  Length, width, height.  To the fraction of one inch. Size distribution of all the considered layouts MUST be considered.  You want all the items to fit correctly inside your Bus.

Weight also enters into it.  Water is heavy.  So are batteries.  So are gen sets.  Fuel. Tanks. Appliances.  Sofas.  Cabinets.  Also what is planned to be inside such.  You need exact measurements of all of this stuff.

Then when you have all of that you have fun figuring out how all of it is going to fit, work and perform not only sitting at some RV park but also heavy fast driving through that twisty mountain highway.  Road handling.

Weights and measures.  The equations can become quite interesting.  Also dynamic.  Do not forget what happens when 100 gallons of fresh water gets transfered into a gray or black holding tank.  Makes a difference.

Finally consider the passenger dynamics.  How many seating positions?  Passenger positions?  Make a difference.  Six 200 pound people moving around inside can and does affect everything while moving.

This is just a slight beginning presentation.  Lots of homework MUST be done before a final interior and exterior Bus Conversion plan can be finalized.  You want to be within 10 pounds of being perfect on all axle ends.

Does this sound impossible?  Maybe.  Maybe not.  You also need to know your chassis. Axle, wheel, tire, brake, suspension capacities and performance.  You can end up with a dangerous slug.  Or a road warrior.

Edited More: ...   It gets even better.  Or more interesting or just impossible, depending upon your determination.  Ideally after a long 7 day high speed run, the percentages of reduced weight should be the same.

You burn diesel fuel.  This reduces axle loadings.  You move around water.  This changes things.  Ideally one should counterbalance or cancel out the other.  Is this impossible?  No.  Merely difficult.  It gets even better.

Groceries get converted into black holding.  Shower water goes to gray holding.  Diesel fuel just ups and disappears.  It all matters.  This may sound like over kill but it really is not. Good planning is the key.

How important is this?  Self done Bus Conversion Engineering MUST stand up to cross examination in a Civil Trial if you are sued because you were in a bad wreck.  Particularity if you have very deep insurance.

If a good the-other-guy lawyer can even slightly prove that you DID NOT do your homework regarding your Bus Conversion and your bus was "DANGEROUSLY" out of balance you may be in $deep trouble$ indeed.   

Respectfully.

[Gary Hatt - Publisher BCM]

I don't think we're out of balance at all, really. The generator is on one side. It weighs in about 950 lbs. On the other side are the fresh/black water tanks. A hundred gallons of water weighs about 800 pounds. Whether in the fresh or black water tanks, it's the same amount of water and weighs the same (mostly). The tanks slightly cross over the center-line of the bus.

This also why you should never layout your bus such that your Fresh Water tank is on one side and the Gray/Black tanks are on the other. They should span the width of the bus as much as possible to distribute the weight at all levels.  I have seen this before. Not exactly ideal.

[chessie4905]

You want the waste water tank close or directly under toilet btw.

[scanzel]

chessie4905 if you were asking me about my AGM's they are 100ah that came out of ups that our company was removing I took 8 of the newest ones. Mine are laid out in a box not stacked about 85lbs each they are probably the grp31 in size. I have them wired in series for 24v, 400ah with a 4000 watt Magnum.

[eagle19952]

85% of the added weight in my bus is center bay, 1/3 13kw gen 2ea 70 gallon potable and 60 gallon black and AC condenser.

rear bay has centered 60 gallon grey and 20 gallon hot water heater. inverters and utility center.

front bay is stuff. beer wine chips canned goods pool noodles cooler camping fishing poles and..stuff.

[chessie4905]

Thanks for sharing that info.