Can't get the Beast to start

[BeastMaster]

I have a DD 8V92TA, (non DDEC) I started the engine today and within 30 seconds it just died. Never reached full idle RPM. Thought it may be a fuel problem so closed the ball valve just prior to primary filter. Replaced both primary and secondary fuel filters. Both had fuel when removed. I filled the new ones prior to replacing. I opened the ball valve and tried to start the beast. - No joy.
I suspect the fuel pump since it always looks 'nasty' around the pump like its leaking. Will try and prime tomorrow, and try a shot of starter spray in the air intake and see what happens.
While cranking, there is white-gray smoke that smells 'hot', but nothing. There is no air right now so emergency shut down is retracted. Could there be an electrical problem I have not checked or thought of. Coolant and oil levels are file, no indicator lights on dash, aside from no gen and low air.

If I replace the fuel pump, is it a LH or RH pump (I know stupid question), and should I replace the fuel lines while I am at it. Assuming Luke to be best source for the pump and lines?

Thank in advance,
Allan
1989 MCI 102C3 8V92TA with HT740

[Jriddle]

I'm not sure if this is your problem but check your rear start panel and make sure the switch didn't get moved to the off position. The engine will start with this switch in the off position and run until the air pressure comes up enough to actuate the shut down cylinder piston. Then will not run again until air pressure is lost. Don't ask me how I know but someone here helped me once with this.

John

[Cary and Don]

That rear switch is so common,  I think a lot of us flipped that switch in the beginning.

Don and Cary

[BeastMaster]

I've been trying to start it from the rear box. So don't think its the problem, but thanks for the reply.

Allan

[Jriddle]

When I had my problem I started from the rear also. I didn't notice the other switch in the off position. I changed fuel filters and all before I was told about the switch. I was only hoping it would be this simple for you. The fuel pump thing would not be as easy or fun. Hope you can get it going with out to much time and problems.


Don and Cary
I had bus mechanic friend tell me stories about moving this switch and sitting back and laughing at the new drivers that couldn't figure it out.  I don't suppose they made it easy on them either. LOL

John

[Scott & Heather]

If he's getting a lot of white smoke, he's getting unburnt fuel to the cylinders right?


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[gumpy]

Is it shutting down because the shutdown cylinder is activating and closing the rack or is it just dying? 

If you're starting from the rear, you can easily see the shutdown cylinder. You said it's retracted, but does it stay retracted?

Is the air pressure at zero, or is there some air in the system?

You need to determine HOW it's shutting down first. Then we'll focus on WHY.

[BeastMaster]

It only shut down once, now it will not start. When it did try to run, 30 sec or so, no power, and did not reach full idle rpm based on my ear. I have no tach.

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[luvrbus]

You lost prime just prime it good it will go if doesn't pick up fuel after a couple of attempts it could be the fuel pump or drive

[BeastMaster]

I'll try and prime today. Have never done it before. I have spin on filters. Working at my storage yard without to much support - whats the easiest way - being its a Sunday followed by a holiday. Was planning a trip next weekend, bummer....

Think I'll start the gen and the air compressor - put air in the bus and make sure the shut down solenoid is working properly - then prime and try again.

[TomC]

When you turn on and off the ignition from the back, you can watch the air cylinder on the governor releasing the off lever. Sounds to me like you don't have fuel pressure. Fuel injectors need over 20psi to operate properly. Even if they are getting some fuel (like getting white smoke), it won't be enough to fire off the motor. Probably your fuel pump-they are not that expensive. Good Luck, TomC

[luvrbus]

The easiest way is remove the plug from the primary filter and adapt a garden sprayer or a electric pump from Auto Zone or you can buy the manual priming pump off Ebay and pump a gal or 2 fuel through the system you don't lose the fuel it returns to the tank.

A dry 8v92 can be a bear to prime just filling the filters if the fuel pump is a little weak fwiw prime it good it will fire, the 92 will blow white or black when they lose prime depending on what mood they are in that day.

It's not the shut down if it was closed there would be no type smoke black or white

good luck   

[TedCalvert]

Make sure that your fuel shut-down air cylinder is working properly first of all.  Most installations require air to shut down, therefore removing the air line to the cylinder should allow the governor to put the rack into the "full fuel" position to start.  Just hate to see you get into deeper doo-doo tearing into the pump if not needed.  
Good luck.

Ted.

[BeastMaster]

Tom, assume the fuel pump is LH?  Might go ahead and order one along with some new fuel lines.  Looks like I'll need to drain coolant down so I can get the cross over pipe off.?

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[luvrbus]

All DD have LH fuel pumps the LH and RH are just to mark the suction,you shouldn't need to drain the coolant to replace the fuel pump unless at some time in it's life the crossover pipe was installed upside down.
Even with the crossover removed the 1 bolt is a bear you will need a 7/16 C wrench,I would not rush to change the pump just for a little seepage check it and be sure it's bad,prime the sucker when you get it running install a pressure gauge at the secondary filter if you have 50 to 70 lbs psi on the gauge the pump is good  

A new pump cost is 150 bucks,rebuilt about 140 bucks but you get 60 bucks for the old pump so it ends up costing 80 bucks the seals are 5 bucks, check Luke but PC Industries and Diesel Pro are usually cheaper if you need a pump