Anyone from Kansas that has deciphered their licensing requirements?

[Geom]

We're trying to figure out what it is exactly that we need to operate a bus/rv in Kansas.

While there's a lot of data on Kansas' many, disparate, and disconnected websites; none directly answer the question, "What do I need to operate a vehicle over 26k lbs, non-commercially".

Oh yeah, and calling the KS department of revenue (who manages licenses in KS) and the local KS DMV offices was an exercise in pointless futility.

The answer we've gotten so far is yes we'll need a different license but no one knows what that is, what the requirements are to get it, whether there's a driving test involved, and if so what book to study from for said test....

As always, any help or advice is appreciated.

Thanks
George

[eagle19952]

Here's a subject that you may do well to use the search function to sift thru...here and over at BNO.
Once you use the word commercial, excommercial bus or any derivation there of you are scr%wd, and complicate your situation beyond belief, the term is futile to say the least in your quest, a bus is no longer a bus....it is a motorhome.
UNLESS you are contemplating or referring to a a seated coach.....
then you will stuggle for answer to the point of insanity....

[Jon]

According to this site you need a non-commercial CD if the coach is over 26,000.

http://changingears.com/rv-sec-state-rv-license.shtml

[pabusnut]

My advise is to go to the local DMV in person.  Ask the question, and take a copy of it typed out on paper with your letterhead with you, like it was a letter to them.   Ask them to note their answer on the paper and sign and date it, referencing the legal reference.  If they don't, ask for a supervisor who can.  Don't leave until you have an answer.  If nobody can or will answer locally, ask them who can and get that person's contact info.

If you get no response, contact your state congressman or assemblyman.  The DMV seems to answer them with the correct answer.

I live in PA and had to go to the head of Driver Licensing for the Commonwealth of PA to get an answer!

Steve Toomey
PAbusnut

[gus]

It is already converted don't ever use the word "bus", always say "motorhome" and your problems will evaporate.

I know of no state that has any extra license requirements for a motorhome no matter what the size if it is not used for commercial purposes.

[luvrbus]

Several states require a different license for a motor home over 26,001 lbs or 40ft in length they are all listed on the FMCA site 

[Geom]

From our research so far, about one third of US states have some kind of special requirement for a vehicle over 26k lbs (commercial or not). There is also a federal standard, but it's intended primarily for CDL drivers. They defer non-CDL stuff to each respective state but mandate a base minimum to each state for CDL.

I do know that Kansas has this requirement. They call it a non-commercial class B. We managed to rune that bit out of the random bits of info we've gathered so far. The challenge is in figuring out what's needed to get one of those.

On one extreme (from one KS official) is that we need to take a full CDL test  . On another extreme (from yet another KS official) is taking the exact same driving test and book material we have already taken  (huh??)

I suspect that most people just ignore it or don't look into it and just assume their handy driver's license, already in their pocket, is all they need.
Which based on the PITA KS is turning this into, it is sounding more and more like what we should just do. 

[Utahclaimjumper]

 Geom,, What bus are you going to use?? most GMC 4106s or 04s come in at close to 24K full up & ready to go. The MCIs are a bit heavyer depending on content, anything with a tag axle will be even  more.>>>Dan

[Iceni John]

Two questions that may or may not complicate things!
A)  Is your state's weight factor the actual weighable weight or GVWR?
B)  What is your bus, oops Motorhome, now registered as?

Why I ask is that in CA it's only GVWR that matters, not the actual weight.   My bus is still registered as an "Auto (Bus Body)" by the CA DMV  -  they wont give me the magic "Housecar" title until it's got enough things done to it to make it no longer a vehicle that could potentially be put back into bus service.   They won't even consider retitling it until it's no longer NSBY!   Therein lies the crux of the matter  -  a Housecar of any GVWR can be driven on a regular Class C license as long as it's not over 40 feet, but my bus is technically not yet a Housecar, and as such if it exceeds 26,000 GVWR it needs a non-commercial Class B license.   A Class C is generally for vehicles less than 26K, unless they're Housecars.

Is KS similar to CA in this regard?

One hint  -  try going to small rural DMV offices a few minutes before they close on a Friday afternoon.   The staff there will sometimes slide things through that they wouldn't ordinarilly do, especially if they are going home in the next few minutes.   When I bought my bus the Pink Slip was missing a signature from the school district that previously owned it, so the DMV girl told us to "make a call outside to the school district" to sort it out.   We came back in a moment later with a signature on the Pink Slip, she was happy, and a minute later I had new plates in my hand.   Ten minutes max in and out of there  -  easy!

John

[Geom]

@John @Dan,
Alas in KS it is based on gvwr
The buses we're looking at are the GM 410X. All of which have a gvwr higher than the limit.

The good news is that all of the ones we're considering have already been retitled as motorhomes.

We did note that nice little exception in CA for motorhomes under 40', but near as we can tell no such nicety exists in KS.

I do like your idea of going to a smaller DMV outside of town. KS, as is probably evident by now, makes the whole process a PITA. There are a total of 2, yes count them 2, DMV offices covering the entire KS side of Kansas City (a not exactly small metro area). In addition they're having ongoing problems with a botched computer upgrade, and wait times are over 2 hours on average, in person.
So finding that elusive small DMV office might be challenging, but might be worth it.

@Steve, I like your idea of getting everything down in writing and/or asking for a supervisor if the person at the counter has no clue.

[Cary and Don]

Ha!!   Kansas DMV got their computer program from the same place California got theirs I will bet.  It doesn't work here either.

Don and Cary

[Geom]

Ha!!   Kansas DMV got their computer program from the same place California got theirs I will bet.  It doesn't work here either.

Don and Cary

Lol, yeah... And they were quite proud of it too, to the tune of $50+mil and still counting!
Then it started running like crap and causing multi-hour delays. The present 2 hour delay is actually their idea of improvement, after several months of all day (or don't bother showing up) type delays 

[RJ]

Geom -

Now to really drive you crazy:

GM never published any GVWR for their parlor coaches until the NTSB insisted starting about 1976.

So when you meander into a KS DMV and they ask about GVWR, tell them it's an antique that was built before GVWRs were required by law, therefore published data does not exist.  Then ask the technician to call over a supervisor to figure this out - keep going up the chain of command until you've driven them crazy or they become so exasperated they just call it a motorhome and are done with it!

And for heaven's sake, NEVER, EVER mention the word "bus!"   It's an "Antique Class A Diesel Pusher Motorhome" built in 195X/196X.

Most states allow the operation of RVs with a standard Class C license, but some require a non-commercial Class B for those rigs over 26,001 lbs.  If your state requires this, then you'll have to take the CDL written exam (including air brakes), most likely also have the basic CDL medical exam, and more than likely a behind-the-wheel drive test, including a pre-trip inspection (including an air brake check - which you should know how to do anyway!)

So run the coach over a set of truck scales as empty as possible to get a weight slip before you attempt to register/drive it.  (Added bonus: with the weight info, you can properly set the air pressure in the tires for the weight being carried!)

Or move to a more RV-friendly state, such as SD!

FWIW & HTH. . .

[belfert]

People keep bringing up going to a rural DMV or to the DMV at the end of a day.  That may work very well for getting a bus registered or titled, but it won't help much if the state requires a special driver license to operate an RV over 26,000 lbs.  If you are stopped by an officer he could very well ticket you for the wrong driver license.  If the officer really wants to make your day go bad they could require a driver with the right license come to the site to drive the vehicle away.

I know in Minnesota a lot of the "DMV" offices are run by others besides the states.  One needs to be sure the DMV office has actual state employees if you want to get an official answer on something like this.  I remember having to make a few phone calls to figure out if I could legally drive my motorhome (my bus) on a freeway marked as no trucks over 9,000 lbs.  I was told since my motorhome is not legally a truck that I could drive on that freeway.

[niles500]

http://www.kslegislature.org/li/b2013_14/statute/008_000_0000_chapter/008_002_0000_article/008_002_0034b_section/008_002_0034b_k/

(4) class A motor vehicles include any combination of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating of 26,001 pounds or more, provided the gross combination weight rating of the vehicle or vehicles being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds, and all other lawful combinations of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating of 26,001 pounds, or more; except that, class A does not include a combination of vehicles that has a truck registered as a farm truck under K.S.A. 8-143, and amendments thereto;

(5) class B motor vehicles include any single vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001 pounds or more, or any such vehicle towing a vehicle not in excess of 10,000 pounds gross vehicle weight rating. Class B motor vehicles do not include a single vehicle registered as a farm truck under K.S.A. 8-143, and amendments thereto, when such farm truck has a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001 pounds, or more; or any fire truck operated by a volunteer fire department;

(6) class C motor vehicles include any single vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating less than 26,001 pounds, or any such vehicle towing a vehicle not in excess of 10,000 pounds gross vehicle weight rating, or any vehicle with a less than 26,001 gross vehicle weight rating towing a vehicle in excess of 10,000 pounds gross vehicle weight rating, provided the gross combination weight rating of the combination is less than 26,001 pounds, or any single vehicle registered as a farm truck under K.S.A. 8-143, and amendments thereto, when such farm truck has a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001 pounds, or more, or any fire truck operated by a volunteer fire department; and