Commercial vs non-commercial use - let the flames begin!

[Boomer]

I have noticed that most all of the big entertainer leasing companys, NiteTrain, Hemphill, etc. are all sporting USDOT numbers now.  The gestapo finally catches up. 

[white-eagle]

We made sure we didn't have ANY lettering that stated we had antennas when were were doing shows.  i agree with whomever said "if you are deducting it, you are commercial."  If you are getting the benefits, be prepared to pay the piper for the rules.

Also, please note the TSA (airport gestapo) is now doing routine vehicle inspections on some public highways, like I-40 which runs from west coast to east coast.  One more inspection that you could fail, then fall prey to all the other government buzzards.

[Van]

Weren't they x raying for weapons of mass destruction, lol although a bus in the wrong hands could do some damage I supose.

[rv_safetyman]

If you are getting the benefits, be prepared to pay the piper for the rules.

Tom, I am not sure I understand.  Yes, I did write off my travel costs on my tax filing.  I also claimed my sales and paid taxes on those sales (both state and federal).  Seems to me I paid the piper.

Jim

[white-eagle]

If a single red penny is claimed as an expence, good luck with the denial?
If it all comes from after-tax income, personal use all the way?

Tom, I am not sure I understand.  Yes, I did write off my travel costs on my tax filing.  I also claimed my sales and paid taxes on those sales (both state and federal).  Seems to me I paid the piper.

Jim

don't take everything personally, jimmy.   i just meant, for those of us that were getting tax deductions, there were some payment issues such as higher insurance costs, meeting more requirements, dot, etc.  Seems to me you did pay the piper, as did a lot of us.  and for those of us taking deductions, we should expect some rules to go with them and not be surprised to be taken as commercial.  If your expense is so small it's not worth taking a deduction, then you probably aren't/weren't commercial.
As shown, BW made the comment i referred to, not you.  I don't think i was even thinking about you specifically.  i went back to find out who did say what i was referring to.  Surprised to find those words of wisdom from BW. (just kidding BW).

[buswarrior]

The surest way of changing the world is to do so in such a way that you don't get credit for it.

Thanks Tom, if you remember the information, but not where it came from, my job has been done.

Now you get to wonder what else I put in your head that you can't remember that I did?

happy coaching!
buswarrior

[rv_safetyman]

Tom, not sure I meant my words the way that they came out.  Surely nothing against you. 

I guess it was my extreme frustration coming out.  It just seems that every turn in the road is another "challenge" for a small business to overcome.  I have always tried to play by the rules, but the tipping point was this whole subject of classifying our bus as a commercial vehicle. 

Clearly there is enough "definition" from the various regulations and organizations that would allow any person in authority to cite us. I can even see some justification.  But to make the commitment that John316 did is huge. Lots of expense.  Lots of procedures that must be followed. Very easy for "a person in authority" to find some little item to literately shut you down at the scales or in a random roadside inspection.  For me, I just did not want to deal with it - chose instead to ignore the whole issue.  When we got the service truck wrapped with company information, I became very concerned.  Fortunately we have never been stopped. 

I had been warned never to go into Michigan as they really are on the watch for income from small folks like us who don't have the resources to fight some legal action - we are sitting ducks.  With every government agency desperately seeking income, I think the writing is on the wall - we are an easy target.

When I say tipping point, I am addressing our decision to close the business.  I am getting too old and worn down to keep beating my head against the wall.  Should have done it a few years ago, but I kept hoping that we could make a go  of it.  Sad thing is that we have developed some encouraging non-RV business and developed a related product for a very promising market.  But the new market sales will take our customer many years to develop and our current sales are not sufficient to keep our head above the water.

Sorry about the rambling and my inability to keep my emotions under control.

Jim

[challenger440]

Well Jim and everyone else, it's not going to get any better.  In the town I live in, 2/3 of the work force is employed by either the state or fed government.   Someone has to pay for  that workforce.  The small business's that I personally  know  pay so much in taxes, fees, administrative costs,  alternative minimum tax,  healthcare, work comp, unemployment ins. etc that their business's are on the verge of not making a profit.  Guess what, when that threshold is reached, bye bye  jobs, goodbye taxes, goodbye families making a living.

I do not see a way out of this mess.  None of the state employees that I know are willing to give up their jobs.  And I don't think the government on any level is going to really cut spending. 

  So where does that leave us,  If a government agency can see a way to pull a couple of thousand out of our wallets (remember that is where their pay check comes from)  you can be sure that they will.   Someone has to pay.

j m

[buswarrior]

Take note:

Every big business had a streak of lawlessness in it on the way up...

many smaller businesses maintain that streak.

In fact, my dear American friends, your existence as a country is based on rebellion against the establishment...

Just imagine this as the topic for the leaders of the fight and the founding fathers?

How might it turn out?

happy coaching!
buswarrior

(Hey RJ, great thread!)

[RJ]

(Hey RJ, great thread!)

[oldmansax]

Take note:

Every big business had a streak of lawlessness in it on the way up...

many smaller businesses maintain that streak.

I assume you have some facts (not opinions or anecdotes) to back up those statements?

Not saying they are not true, but would like to see documentation.

TOM

[white-eagle]

Take note:
Every big business had a streak of lawlessness in it on the way up...
many smaller businesses maintain that streak.

I assume you have some facts (not opinions or anecdotes) to back up those statements?
Not saying they are not true, but would like to see documentation.

TOM

GM is cited for manipulating transportation and highways on youtube.
Some big stock companies on trial for mismanagement right now.
A few congressionals have been on trial for breaking election laws.
and if you read your insurance policy, it doesn't cover commercial use of the bus/RV.  I know a lot of RV show vendors who declined to pay the premium price for commercial coverage, but had no problem using the bus/RV to tow or carry their goods from show to show.  and we already discussed the expense deductions without meeting dot requirements, etc.

I think BW made a generic comment that is basically true.  Anyone here think they can pass an audit without some infractions?  Good luck.
Let's not get into the "prove it" argument.  it could get worse than the straight weight vs multi 

[chev49]

the government, which is the biggest business of all.. has no lawlesness it it whatsoever...