Thanks to Bryce Gaston and John316 for helping with brake issue!

[belfert]

We had some brake issues last Thursday morning and I want to thank Bryce Gaston and John316 for their help with the problem.  Bryce referred me to Arrow Stage Lines for help.  Arrow Stage Lines said they could send a mechanic, but they suggested a way to release the brakes which worked.

I am absolutely going to be learning everything I can about air brakes in the next few days and weeks.  If I had the vacation time I would go to Dallas next week for the Bendix Air Brake School.  I am going to order some training videos from Bendix tomorrow so I can watch those.  I've already learned a bunch about the air brakes just from my experiences in the last 10 days.

[rv_safetyman]

Brian, it sounds like you are home now.  I hope you made it to your event and home again with no more problems.

You have taken some flack on this issue, but I venture to say that many (most?) of the folks on this board would not have the knowledge to resolve the problem without help from one of the bus boards. 

I think I know quite a bit about our air brake system (took the course) and I still had to scratch my head.  In addition, I learned a couple of items from your experience.

Thank you for posting when you have an issue so that we can all learn.

Jim

[belfert]

Nobody has ever answered my question about exactly how someone can learn how to properly inspect air brakes?  Even if pulled all the drums off my bus I wouldn't know if what I was looking at was correct and serviceable or not.  Being able to check and adjust the brakes is different than identifying bad parts like worn s-cam bushings.

I'm planning to go to training on servicing air brakes, but I only have one vehicle to work on.  One really needs to see a wide variety of vehicles to gain the knowledge and experience to be a good mechanic.  I didn't learn to be a good server administrator overnight, or by working on just one server.  I have experience working on hundreds of different servers.

I'm also not clear on why taking a bus to a good mechanic to work on the brakes is considered such a bad thing versus doing it yourself?  People take vehicles to mechanics every day to get them fixed.  My mistake here was a miscommunication between the mechanic and myself.  What I wanted and thought I was getting was a yearly full inspection of the brakes.  What I got was they were just checking and adjusting the stroke and lubricating the brakes.  It is an extra hour or so of labor to completely inspect the brakes.

[John316]

Brian,

First off, that was some good background on the other thread, about your bus. Thanks.

I am glad that you all go rolling under your own power. I was getting ready to load up my truck with the tools and air compressor, when you said that you were rolling. I was more then happy to come get you rolling, but it was nice that you got it taken care of.

I think the training videos will be a great start. I have been to the Bendix brake school, and it is amazing. Seriously, well worth the trip!

I think that folks on the board often suggest looking things over yourself, because you will often question more things then a mechanic will. I, however, do not understand why folks say that you should be doing most of the work/inspections yourself. If you don't have the know how, then I don't suggest it. But get the know how, and learn from the bus boards, and you will get it.

To answer your question, I don't think many of us on the board will tell you how to properly inspect your brakes. As you mentioned, it is a learned thing. The Bendix brake school is a fantastic start. If you go, don't be afraid to ask any question. Those are good guys (you were right, Clifford).

I would not consider myself to be a "good mechanic" at all. However, I know a lot of the basics, and give me enough time, and I can figure just about anything out (knock on wood). It will take time, but you will get it. Just keep crawling around, and keep on looking and trying to figure things out. In time....in time.....

And from one guy who earns his living on a computer, to another. You don't have to work on machinery all your life to be able to work on your bus. It is like a computer, in a lot of ways .

God bless,

John

[bobofthenorth]

I'm not preaching - just saying.  If you do an annual DOT inspection on your bus you will know what its condition is.  You can then decide to remedy or not remedy everything on the list but at least you will know.  Some people are capable of doing that inspection themselves; most of us are not.

[Busted Knuckle]

Brian while I appreciate the thanks it ain't necessary! I just do what I can to help out when I can.

As far as telling you the "proper" way to do a brake inspection. I honestly couldn't explain it right it's just something I learned from all the yrs I have turned wrenches. (I did take some auto shop training in school, and a couple different specialty courses after that but most of it's been hands on!)

Now on the other hand if something goes wrong with the computer, I'm on the phone with the guy who does my computer work right away and telling him to come on by and see what I've done to it this time!

As far asking what it took to get it released and safe to roll on, I just wanted to learn from your experience. Because as I told you on the phone when what suggestions I had didn't work I was bamboozled as anyone.

I just wanted to learn what the final answer was in case I get asked that question when go on "Who wants to be a Millionaire?" 
  BK 

[eagle19952]

You can get a head start here:or EAR start as the case may be.
http://www.lowestpricetrafficschool.com/handbooks/cdl/en/5/1

This is why you hire a pro WITH the proper tools....or you find some old hand with 40 years experiance,
http://www.frasergauge.com/literature/fraser%20price%20list%202011.pdf

http://www.frasergauge.com/literature/F-8098.pdf

http://www.frasergauge.com/Tool%20Kits/High%20Floor%20Tool%20Kits.htm

[luvrbus]

Brian before you pay 50 bucks for the CD let me check Cole gave me 4 not long ago I may have 1 left if I do I'll give it to you

good luck

[artvonne]

I'm also not clear on why taking a bus to a good mechanic to work on the brakes is considered such a bad thing versus doing it yourself? 

  Well, if you have a good mechanic who rides around with you wherever you go, and who will jump under your bus whenever it goes bang, I suppose you dont need to know anything other than how to tell a good mechanic from a bad one. Which is almost impossible unless you are a mechanic yourself. You made a reference to seeing a Doctor in another thread. My dad is 89 years old, been living with me over 25 years. He's 100% disabled Vet. In those ensuing years we have seen multitudes of Doctors. And ive come to see them no differently than I see mechanics. Generally, most shouldnt even be practicing. And overall I would suggest staying away from them as much as possible would be the best thing most of us could do for our health. 90% of the meds they hand out do more harm than good. And just like your Bus, knowing a bit of human biology and medicine can do a lot more for you than anyone else is going to help you with. 

  When you venture away from home, if you have a problem and need help, you really dont know who your going to run into, and good still dont equal honest. There are tons of crook mechanics who are believe it or not, real good mechanics. Thats what makes em good at being crooks. Just like most doctors.

  Smokes coming out from under your Bus from a leaking oil line, you stop and make a call. You have no clue whats wrong. Bubbas Truck Service shows up. Bubba spots the oil line, but sees you standing there clueless. Bubba could just fix the line right there, but hes short of money this month so he says you need to have it towed into his shop so they can get a better look, better not run it. Next thing your motors half torn apart, hes running up a big bill, thats getting bigger by the hour, and what are you going to do?

  No one is going to look out for you better than you are. Well, usually anyway. Thats just the plain hard truth. Thankfully we have this forum as a source of real good and honest people who can offer amazing quantities of help and knowledge. But still, we should all endevour to learn and do as much as were able. Knowing enough about the mechanicals to know whats good or bad will save you money, and maybe you can help another Bus nut along the way.

[bevans6]

I think learning how to inspect brakes is going to be a different learning curve for each person depending on your background and experience.  I took the DOT air brake operators course to get my air brake license to even be allowed to drive my bus.  It teaches everything you need to know about how to inspect brakes - by inspect they mean the mandatory daily inspection that each and every air brake equipped truck driver is supposed to do to his/her truck.  The principles are identical for buses, but you just can't physically get under a bus the same way you can get under a truck to do the inspection so the rules are different.  But you do learn about everything you would need to know about how the brakes operate and what to physically look at and check.

Beyond the air system, which is really quite complex and frankly hard to understand fully, you get into actual mechanics.  I've been working on brakes on one thing or another for 35 years, and they are really all about the same.  Bus brakes, inside the drums, are about as simple as it's possible to get, to be honest.  But you need to be sure!  I would probably think twice about getting a pro to do major work only because I've gotten shoddy work from pro's on a regular basis, at this point around 50% of the jobs that have been done on my bus by pro mechanics and well regarded shops has been found to be faulty work.  That shoddy work is why I learn how to do as much as I can myself.  One, so I can do it myself if I need to, and two, so I can tell if the work has been done right.

Here is the thing - the work is not hard to do except in the physical sense.  You don't need a university degree and post-graduate education.  But it is physically demanding and it does demand a sense of detail, and knowing what is right and what is wrong, and caring.  Most of the faults that I have found in work done on my bus were simply not caring.  It was as hard a task to do it wrong as it would have been to do it right.

Really glad you got on with your journey OK.

Brian

[luvrbus]

I think Brian is doing a good thing when taking the Bendix course not knowing anything about his brakes it is nothing like a DOT or driving course it covers all aspects of different braking system relays and all the best 300 bucks any of you bus owners could spend,they even furnished the lunch for 3 days lol

good luck

[belfert]

Brian before you pay 50 bucks for the CD let me check Cole gave me 4 not long ago I may have 1 left if I do I'll give it to you

I didn't see your message before I ordered.  I just ordered the DVD version of Bendix video training for $31 including shipping and handling.  I also ordered the service manual on CD as part of the order.  I'm not sure I'll get the service manual as it was marked as $0.00.

I called Bendix about the training class yesterday and they won't have the 2012 schedule out until late January.  I would like to do the one in Chicago so I can just drive down there.

[buswarrior]

If we can't find good training info...

How do you think the mechanics are getting trained?

We have a big problem on this continent when it comes to what people think they know about brakes and their maintenance, and the truth.

Without Bendix, we'd be even more sunk.

Get on their site and read, read, read...

happy coaching!
buswarrior

[belfert]

I got the Bendix training DVD and workbooks in the mail Saturday and I plan to view the DVD tomorrow evening.  One of the four parts is about trailer brakes so I won't be bothering with that part.

Most new truck mechanics usually go to a school of some sort where I assume they learn about air brakes as part of the training.

[buswarrior]

Big assumption...

Where's their training materials?

It's the stuff a busnut needs, and can't find.

happy coaching!
buswarrior