here's one to think about!

Blacksheep · April 25, 2009, 08:59:30 AM

Last night Susan went out to the bus and told me the entry lights would not come on! Hmm, I go out and sure enough, nada! Open the bays and nada! Check the battery switches and they are both on to my surprise as they are and were supposed to be off. I go and check the on board battery charger and again to my surprise, it's plugged in and on! I check the battery voltage and there is none to be found! Ok so I tutrn the switches off, unplug the charger and wait a few minutes. I then re-plug the charger and go to bed. This morning, I checked to see if charger was on and it was. I checked the voltage in the batteries and although very very low, I'm hoping by the time I get home today, it will show more improvement!
My question if there is one is why would the batteries go dead with the switches ON and the charger ON? Seems to me that whatever drain there is with the switches on, the charger would make up for it by being on!
Just curious!
Ace

Utahclaimjumper · April 25, 2009, 10:02:41 AM

Ace, looks like time to do the math and find out way more came out than went in.>>>Dan

Len Silva · April 25, 2009, 01:19:07 PM

Ace,

What kind of charger do you have. Some of the inverter/charger units won't start with a completely dead battery, you need to jump them with a good battery. Or, use an automotive battery charger to get it started.

Blacksheep · April 26, 2009, 05:21:00 AM

Looks as though I may have to start from the beginning and manually charge the batteries one at a time and then hook up my float charger. It appears that after being drained and then hooked up to the charger all day and night, I am only show 2 voltd per battery. Before I replace them I will charge them manually and go from there! If nothing then, I will replace them all!
My stupitidy I guess but that still confuese me as to why!
Thanks for the emails and replies!

Ace

JackConrad · April 26, 2009, 05:33:20 AM

Quote from: Blacksheep on April 25, 2009, 08:59:30 AM
I go and check the on board battery charger and again to my surprise, it's plugged in and on! I check the battery voltage and there is none to be found! Ok so I tutrn the switches off, unplug the charger and wait a few minutes. I then re-plug the charger and go to bed. Ace

Ace,
Just a guess, maybe a thermal overload switch on the battery charger, that reset when you unplugged nd replugged the charger?? Jack

gumpy · April 26, 2009, 06:05:56 AM

I'm going with Jack's guess. Charger tripped out for some reason.

The more important question is what loads are on when you are parked. You need to address that. You should not have dead batteries if your bus sits a month without a charger on. You may have a short somewhere, or possibly a bad diode in the alternator.

In the same line as the thread title, and not trying to hijack, I had an odd thing yesterday, too. My bus has been sitting for a month, plugged in with the inverter on float. The coach batteries were turned off. Yesterday, I started it up, drove around the neighborhood, so I could back it into the driveway to get access to the generator. Plugged it back in. I didn't shut off the coach batteries, and I didn't connect them to the house charger. Last night, I went outside to shut the garage door and I heard a high pitched squeal. Traced it to the coach, and knew immediately what it was. The Nighthawk CO detector I had plugged inside was screaming. It was at 69, and had peaked at 70. The heater has not been on for about 2 weeks. No combustion of any kind going on, except for the 10 minutes the Detroit ran to drive around the neighborhood. I'm thinking now that my house batteries are producing hydrogen when on bulk charge, and this is being detected by the CO detector. This has been a problem on and off for some time. I'm going to restart the charger now that it's on float again, and see if it does the same thing when it goes back to bulk charge.

craig

jackhartjr · April 26, 2009, 06:10:58 AM

Gumpy, when the battery in our S&S gets low that CO2 alarm screams too.
I now keep it hooked up all of the time to keep it charged.
Check to be sure the battery(ies) that the CO2 alarm is hooked to are charged.
Jack
PS...the battery does not have to be too far discharged before that alarm goes off.

gumpy · April 26, 2009, 06:15:58 AM

Quote from: jackhartjr on April 26, 2009, 06:10:58 AM
Gumpy, when the battery in our S&S gets low that CO2 alarm screams too.
I now keep it hooked up all of the time to keep it charged.
Check to be sure the battery(ies) that the CO2 alarm is hooked to are charged.
Jack
PS...the battery does not have to be too far discharged before that alarm goes off.

The CO detector is 120 volts, and the bus is plugged into shore power. The inverter (Trace SW4024) charger is bulk charging. The batteries were previous on float for weeks, so all charged.

Blacksheep · April 26, 2009, 06:16:16 AM

There isn't a breaker of any kind on the charger. Simply plug it in and the light shows it to b e charging which was on when I initially plugged it up. After it charges it goes into a float mode. I thought it did but as I said my battery switches were on unbeknownst to me. Checked again this morning and each battery has 2.? Volts. I am now charging each one seperately and see where that takes me!
Ace

Blacksheep · April 26, 2009, 04:30:42 PM

2 batteries re-charged and found out in the mean time that the charger needs battery current to be activated! 2 should do it. So tomorrow morning all should be good to go!

Ace

mikelutestanski · April 26, 2009, 04:39:24 PM

Hello ACE :
Was the problem with the charger ? or a phantom load?
Regards and happy bussin. mike

Blacksheep · April 26, 2009, 06:49:54 PM

Mike, not exactly sure but I'm leaning towards the phantom load being the problem since the switches were left on and every other time when they were off, the charger worked flawlessly! Everything seems to be workins as it should but will know more tomorrow after the charger cycles thru its course!
Thanks...
Ace

pvcces · April 26, 2009, 09:22:56 PM

Gumpy, we noticed that some CO detectors come with a wall wart, like yours, possibly. I took one apart that said that it was 9 volt AC output and found out that it just used a bridge rectifier in the detector.

That meant that the voltage level in the detector would be more or less normal if the wall wart was disconnected and the lead connected directly to a 12 volt DC source. Because of the bridge, it doesn't make any difference which way it is connected.

This means that the CO detector doesn't need any AC, so no inverter is required while boondocking.

For what it's worth.

Tom Caffrey

Blacksheep · April 27, 2009, 12:41:45 PM

Update:

Charger went thru it's cycle of charging and then float mode until it cut itself off this morning while I was gone. I checked the volatage in the batteries and all are back to normal voltage.

I guess I can't leave the battery switches ON and the charger ON for any length (if any) of time! I always unplug the charger before heading out because if I don't the batteries will get overcharged sending the dash lights into a frenzy! Once the charger is unplugged, al lights go out and good to go!

I would have thought though that IF there was and there probably is, a phantom drain from somewhere, and the charger is plugged in and charging, why wouldn't the charger keep the batteries up to par even with the drain? It appears that the drain is happening while the charger is in float mode and not actual during charge mode (I think)!

Anyway, all is normal and we're good to go...

Next trip, Myrtle Beach!

Hope I can keep up with the other guys!

Ace

gumpy · April 27, 2009, 12:51:10 PM

Quote from: pvcces on April 26, 2009, 09:22:56 PM
Gumpy, we noticed that some CO detectors come with a wall wart, like yours, possibly. I took one apart that said that it was 9 volt AC output and found out that it just used a bridge rectifier in the detector.

That meant that the voltage level in the detector would be more or less normal if the wall wart was disconnected and the lead connected directly to a 12 volt DC source. Because of the bridge, it doesn't make any difference which way it is connected.

This means that the CO detector doesn't need any AC, so no inverter is required while boondocking.

For what it's worth.

Tom Caffrey

That's good information, but the unit I have in there is a house unit I had. it's self contained, one box with prongs on the back, no wort. I actually have a 12v RV unit in there, too, but had to disconnect it for similar reasons. It was going off at all hours of the night when boondocking. I suspected outgassing from the polyiso insulation, or possibly a small freon leak. Definitely wasn't CO as nothing was running.