Another Toad Question

[Lin]

I do not like either of our two present cars for towing ( a Camry and a Volvo) and want to get something else that is towable 4-down without alteration.  That would include many standard transmission vehicles and a number of 4x4's.  Since we live on a dirt road and sometimes need to haul stuff, I figured that a 4x4 pickup would solve several problems.  I have been looking for a small one like an old Toyota or Nissan since my 8v71/Spicer team already tends to chew hills rather slowly.  I notice though from others posts that some people pull bigger trucks.  How does that work out and what would you say the max weight of a toad should be?  At what weight point does an auxiliary brake become mandatory?

[PP]

FWIW-I have a Jeep Liberty that weighs almost 4500# without aux. braking. The old girl seems to stop us just fine, even though I've had many people say otherwise and that I'm foolish. I am fully aware of the fact that in an emergency it will take longer and more distance than if I had aux. braking on the toad, but I am a very defensive driver and realize my limitations LOL (so does my wife  LOL). BTW, Liberties are heavy for their size due to having a full frame underneath. But we like the laydown rear seat and hatch for hauling supplies. The Liberty is also one of the very few vehicles that was designed for towing 4-down. It won't affect the warrenty. I will be watching this post though, because I am really curious what others will have to say, Will

[usbusin]

Here is a great site for braking requirements of towed cars, towed trailers, weight limits, etc., etc.http://www.towingworld.com/articles/TowingLaws.htm

[Lin]

According to that site. it looks like the gross trailer weight requiring brakes would be 1500#.  Am I reading that right?  That would mean that virtually anything you towed would require aux brakes.

[usbusin]

I read it as "Brake Laws Towed Cars".  And, it varies by state/province.

[luvrbus]

there are only 12 states and Canada that require braking for a toad  www.hotrodparts.com  good luck

[Nick Badame Refrig/ACC]

Hi Lin,

You can pull just about anything 4 down that you bus can tow safely. As far as supplimental breaking, you should have something

no matter what you pull.. If you were in an accident of some sort "god forbid' , insurance company's would have a feild day with you.

A number of things could happen with the tow bar, your hitch, or even the toad vehicle.

I tow an 8500# H2 Hummer and I have the Even brake from Roadmaster. It works.. There has been a couple occasions that I had to

just about lock em up and the even brake stopes the hummer just fine. If you ever snoop over at the rv.net board, you would see that

those guys have "toad hazzards" quite frequently.

Play safe!
Nick-

[Ed Hackenbruch]

We have an old jeep wagoneer ( same as the Cherokee, just a little nicer interior)  4X4 with auto tranny.  It weighs about 3800# and we have a brake system for it.  We can tow 4 down with no problem.  No brake system on your toad?  get in a wreck, your fault or not and the lawyers will be drooling.   Well worth the cost.  First day we had ours  it kept us from having a head on with a car that was passing a UPS truck with double trailers in a no passing zone. Probably would have killed the 2 in the car and the 3 cars behind the truck would have been involved as they were all tailgating.  After our pulse rate went back down i told my wife that i thought the brake system had just paid for itself.

[Sojourner]

And if the tow car broke loose....what keep it from rolling wild onto whatever such as head-on and totally wreck both cars plus someone is either killed or paralyze to sue to tilt.

No thanks, not me going on the road with tow car without brake system because I am not perfect to determine when, where and how it going to happen.

Maybe tomorrow...it will be too late.

We care for yours and others safety.

FWIW

Sojourn for Christ, Gerald

BTW...be glad that you posted and hopeful it help you.

[Lin]

Thanks for all the input.  The toad I am looking to use is between 2700 and 2800 pounds.  I am currently weighing in at about 27000 pounds, which puts me 5000 pounds below GVW.  If adequate braking were the only issue, it would seem that I would not need anything extra.  According to the chart, just about all the states that require aux brakes set the rule for 3000 pounds or above, so the strict legality is not a problem.  However, it seems that most feel that liability is a major consideration here.

[JackConrad]

    Although our coach & toad are right at the vehicle GWV (buses do not have a CGVW), I feel much better when driving knowing that I have more stopping power than I would have without the toad braking system (M&G system) for those sudden stops when someone pulls out in front of you or that light does a quick yellow, then red as you approach a busy intersection, etc.  I also would not want to know that my toad broke loose and killed or severely injured someone. 
    Used braking system $350, additional parts to install $35, peace of mind when driving PRICELESS    Jack

[kyle4501]

What does the tow bar manufacturer have to say about toad brakes?

Seems to me the resultant forces in the tow bar can be quite substantial. 

I watched Dad drive over a speed hump & I was surprised at the vertical travel of the rear of his coach. The tow bars briefly hit ~45 degrees! (they are level on flat ground at rest)

If the toad has no brakes, during a hard stop, the rear of the bus rises and the toad keeps on pushing. The resultant downward forces on the toad's mounting brackets will be significant, not to mention the lifting forces on the coach side of the mount. THAT is where I see the biggest potential for a bad day to get worse.


I ask this question to anyone considering towing without brakes on the toad, how much damage can be caused by a ~2500# car traveling unattended at 55 mph?

YMMV

[Lin]

I guess this is part two of the question.  What aux brake system do you use and are you happy with it?

[Dallas]

All this is great conjecture about toads breaking loose, but.. if you really want liability, I pose this question... where in the H E double Toothpicks were you when you learned to hook up the safety chains?

Safety chains are there for a reason, and there is also a reason that they are doubled.

I personally would rather trash a toad against my nice straight bumper than let it fly out into traffic on it's own.
My method of safety chains is also a little heavier than standard.. I use 5/16" transport grade chains.

By the way, I use to drive a wrecker, and had to pick up a toad that broke loose from it's tow vehicle once. It had a safety brake system, which did work.... it locked up the brakes, the steering wheel went left, and the jeep rolled numerous times.
I hauled most of it to the yard on a dolly, the rest was put in a dumpster.

Sorry to burst any bubbles, but I have felt for a long time that lock up brake systems were more dangerous than most people realize.

Dallas

[buswarrior]

In our litigious society, the lack of an aux brake seems to be a greater problem than what that aux brake actually does if it does "deploy"

Best to have an aux brake, and make sure that the rest of your tow rig ensures it never gets called upon to do its job?

happy coaching!
buswarrior