Jeeeeez, if these Morons in Washington are going to let the Life blodd of this country get over $5.00 a gallon.. How the hell are we going to Afford FOOD, let alone Fuel...
and, is that going to Effect the price of Vasoline :-\
Bend over Amireeeka.. Your getting a Huge Dry **** !!!!!!
YUP!,
The mighty Dollar is is almost not worth the paper it's printed on.... Hope they don't make us start using the Euro!
If you work for someone, you will have to ask for a raise. Im my case, I have now added a $4 fuel surcharge to every service call along with all the equipment
increases I have recieved in the past few months forced me to raise prices again... As a busisness owner, I'm have to pass the savings onto the customer!
Nick-
And now our morons in DC want to tack on .40 cents per gallon to fuel so that they can repair the bridges. This is actually being kicked around in La-La land. They got game! ;)
JR
Quote from: NJT5047 on March 16, 2008, 06:37:33 PM
And now our morons in DC want to tack on .40 cents per gallon to fuel so that they can repair the bridges. This is actually being kicked around in La-La land. They got game! ;)
JR
Too bad voters don't vote with vengeance enough. The perfect way to get a control on taxation would be to not reelect any politician that votes for
ANY tax or fee increase. :o :'( One round of that and they would figure it out real quick. Oh, you mean NO new taxes, now I get it. 8)
everybody should get on the fair tax band wagon. it gets rid of the irs and gives the control back to the people. http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer
I'm sure it's no consolation, but I heard an interesting piece on the radio the other day that explained that the current increases in the price of fuel are effectively 'paper' increases caused by the current weakness of the dollar, as opposed to real changes in the supply & demand for oil.
Because of all the naughty American banks that have been lending money out irresponsibly there is this worldwide so called 'credit crunch', which means that the inter-bank lending market has slowed right down. To try to get it going again the Fed keeps reducing interest rates (another 1% drop tomorrow apparently), which makes the holding dollars a very poor investment (low interest rates mean low income). Accordingly no-one want dollars, so the dollar exchange rate becomes very weak against other currencies. For historical reasons many commodities such as oil are priced in dollars, so you now need more dollars to buy the same amount of oil, so the 'price' of oil goes up on paper. If oil were prices in UK Pounds, Euros, Yen or any other currency then fuel would actually be getting cheaper now.
Because the world oil market uses dollars the effect is of course worldwide, although it is perhaps hurting more in the US because fuel has historically been so cheap - even at $5.00 a gallon fuel in America would be 40% cheaper than current British prices for example.
Obviously economics is a very complex thing and the exchange rate issue is only one factor, but it does sound like at least some of your blame should be directed at the actions of greedy / badly managed / poorly regulated American banks over the last few years.
Jeremy
wait untill the oil producing countrys dump the dollar and go to euros. also china is bypassing the newyork exchange and cutting deal staight with the oil producing countrys so in effect there cutting us out of the loop!
Superpickle - things will stabilize once again. The only thing we don't know is how many miles of bad economic road we have to pass over before that happens. The high price of fuel may drive a favorable buying market for you if you do not yet own a bus.
For us, we have looked at the trips we are planning and sometimes the nature of the trip pencils out OK for the bus and sometimes it doesn't. If we are running a long distance from home but not staying long, the car and a hotel may be the right answer for us (or air travel); other trips where there are more nights spent away from home, the bus still comes out as a good choice.
If you have more time to spend at a location, the bus really starts to pay off.
We all know that this is not a dress rehearsal, this is our shot at life, so if travel around the country is what you want to experience, stick with it and find a way to reshape things so that it works / makes sense for you.
Good luck and pleasant journeys!
Craig - MC7 Oregon
Another big issue with the run up in oil prices is investors putting money into oil since they aren't making any money in the stock market. The price will keep going up as long as investors are willing to keep putting money into oil.
Supply and demand is no longer driving the oil market for the moment.
Quote from: belfert on March 17, 2008, 08:40:17 AM
Another big issue with the run up in oil prices is investors putting money into oil since they aren't making any money in the stock market. The price will keep going up as long as investors are willing to keep putting money into oil.
Supply and demand is no longer driving the oil market for the moment.
That's the simplest and most logical explanation of what's going on that I have seen. If that's it, the Chinese have it right, buy direct.
Quote from: 4106-123 on March 17, 2008, 05:54:38 AM
wait untill the oil producing countrys dump the dollar and go to euros. also china is bypassing the newyork exchange and cutting deal staight with the oil producing countrys so in effect there cutting us out of the loop!
I think they alreay are making that move. I read another story on the relationship between oil and gold. It seems the cost for a barrel of oil, if bought in ounces of gold, hasn't changed since 1945! They have not changed a penny..It is the dollar that is worth less.
http://www.kitco.com/ind/Turk/turk_mar142008.html
The fuel prices are affecting everything...
The owner of the restaurant/bar for one of our regular summer gigs was talking about cutting the amount he can pay for live entertainment.
At the same time we (the band) are needing to raise our prices to help cover the higher fuel costs.
We settled on a price he could live with and only booked a few Sundays but we cut the band down to just Ed on acoustic with the occasional musician sitting in with him.
I'm just glad warmer weather is on its way so I can ride my motorcyle to my day job more often.
.
Quote from: ceieio on March 17, 2008, 07:54:56 AM
The high price of fuel may drive a favorable buying market for you if you do not yet own a bus.
That's a very nice point, and a good way of looking positively at the situation. Now is also probably a very good time to buy a house, or for someone like me to buy an American vehicle and import it to the UK. I wish I could afford to do either!
By all accounts the Chinese have effectively taken over the running of some cash-poor but oil-rich African states - but remember that China is fundamentally in an extremely poor strategic position in terms of natural resources - apart from coal and cheap labour they have practically nothing of their own, and have to import almost all their energy and raw materials from abroad - which actually means they are in a very weak long-term position. India and Russia will make the economic running over the next 30 years - India because they have a large workforce that is extremely well educated compared to China and even some western countries, and Russia because they have limitless supplies of energy and materials
Jeremy
I wonder what would happen to the price of oil, or anything else for that matter, if the entire world lived as we do in America. I wonder if mother earth could even sustain that kind of consumption for very long.
Len
Quote from: Len Silva on March 17, 2008, 10:28:07 AM
I wonder what would happen to the price of oil, or anything else for that matter, if the entire world lived as we do in America. I wonder if mother earth could even sustain that kind of consumption for very long.
Len
No, it definitely would not. The U.S. has only 4.5% of the Earth's population. If the other 95.5% lived as we do, it would be a disaster. But the other side of that question is, what should we do about it, reduce ourselves to a third world lifestyle?
Jeremy, you have not been keeping with the news, OPEC has been dumping the dollar for over a year, the first was Kuwait, (our friends) they went to a "basket" currency over a year ago and the rest of OPEC is following the lead. I also think the
US has made its own problems by printing dollars like it was coming out of a fire hose
with no value behind it to support this stupid war.>>>Dan
Interesting take on it.
If you own the country, you own the oil.
Is this "stupid war" really that stupid?
If we suck the life blood out of the country we have "liberated" will it drop oil prices? Probably not. The main reason is that the PTB's have a hold on the scrotum of the world. The scrotum of the world is OIL, just like it was for China in the 1920's and 1930's, and was for Japan in the 1930's until now.
If you really think a free market economy is going to solve your problems... think again.
The same fellas that had the power during the crash of 1929 will still have the power of 2009/8/10/11/12.
History repeats itself, before the "Black Friday" of '29, the US was the most powerful economic force in the world. Is it any different now?
At this point, we have almost decided to keep our GMC PD4103... fuel mileage is twice what it would be with an MC9 plus even if we pulled a 16' box trailer, we could count on losing maybe 1-2mpg in fuel mileage...still way above what our 9 could deliver.
Quote from: Utahclaimjumper on March 17, 2008, 12:19:37 PM
Jeremy, you have not been keeping with the news, OPEC has been dumping the dollar for over a year, the first was Kuwait, (our friends) they went to a "basket" currency over a year ago and the rest of OPEC is following the lead. I also think the
US has made its own problems by printing dollars like it was coming out of a fire hose
with no value behind it to support this stupid war.>>>Dan
ANSWER.
WAR...KILL People, let people starve..etc etc..allow plagues.....it is all how nature works, Europe was much better off post plague than just prior to it.
problem is as with most natural issues....people are doing not natural things.
if we as americans would keep only our own interests in mind rather than sending shitloads of moiney to third world nations that don;t offer us anything we would be better off.
as for price......it's only going to go up.....no doubt about it.
maybe it will go up enough people will stop taliing about showhorninbg big motors in buses not designed to have big motors....LOL
Quote from: tekebird on March 17, 2008, 12:53:48 PM
maybe it will go up enough people will stop taliing about showhorninbg big motors in buses not designed to have big motors....LOL
Naw, they just keep telling themselves that their driving habits won't change and so their mileage won't change. Except their whole reason for wanting more power is to keep up speed on hills, get up to speed faster and humiliate an occasional competitor. But wait, they forget, those are the driving habits that will drink more fuel.
Back in the day, I hated the 55 speed limit. I even sported one of those "Can't Drive 55" logos on my 'vette. But now that I have sufficiently run the teenager out of my toe, I have to concede, there are big savings to be had at 55. The difference between 55 and 70 in many vehicles can be 25% or more. So, before giving up on a bus, try slowing down, accelerate slower and decelerate slowly in advance of stopping.
The point is that many parts of the world (China, India, Japan, South Korea etc.) are using so much more of the earth's resources than they were even a few years ago and growing exponentially. Other nations may only be a few years behind. I think the world is looking at a major readjustment and it's going to happen fairly soon. Maybe not in my lifetime but certainly the kids and grandkids are looking at a different world.
Len
Quote from: Len Silva on March 17, 2008, 02:17:21 PM
The point is that many parts of the world (China, India, Japan, South Korea etc.) are using so much more of the earth's resources than they were even a few years ago and growing exponentially. Other nations may only be a few years behind. I think the world is looking at a major readjustment and it's going to happen fairly soon. Maybe not in my lifetime but certainly the kids and grandkids are looking at a different world.
Len
I agree. This is just the tip of the iceburg. When the third world countries come fully into their own, no fuel based energy source will be sustainable, or even practical. I tend to think the only sustainable energy solution is going to be electricity from solar and geothermal sources, supplemented by wind and tidal generators. But in order for that to work, there are going to have to be exponential increases in the efficiency of both the solar panels and energy storage.
We're going through an energy revolution which is every bit as confusing and distressing as the Digital Revolution and the Industrial Revolution before that.
To get back on topic, "No, you shouldn't give up your dream" As far as I can tell (reports from the other side being inconclusive) we need to make the most of our one trip around on this earth. If your dream is a bus then make it happen. I'm sitting here looking at the mountains to the west of me and horse pasture to the north, in my bus at 50 years of age. Two years ago I had a bunch of staff, non-stop headaches, a banker looking over my shoulder and shareholders bitching every which way from Sunday. I didn't sell out for any pot of gold - a better description would be "I got out before the bank got me".
At the same time my wife's entire department was eliminated. She made it work and I made it work and we're living the dream that we have had for more than 12 years now. Was it easy? NO. Was it worthwhile? Definitely. We don't know how long we'll do it - none of us know whether we'll wake up tomorrow morning. So get on with it - if its important.
I wish we could use more nukes to generate electricity. That would free up a ton of oil for transportation fuels. I haven't seen any numbers on this concept yet ...its just my gut feeling. The rub is where to put the radioactive waste.
Enter the environmentalists. They have single handed prevented new refineries, electric generating power plants of all types ( dams, coal, natural gas, oil, nuclear, ) drilling for oil everywhere in the USA. Given the opportunity, our new technologies can produce cleaner power from these natural resources all the while severing our ties with foreign oil and its associated strings.
Agreed, solar makes lots of sense. While it would be good for our government to provide grants or tax incentives to improve the technology I am a firm believer for less government and let the market sort this out.
Hydrogen fuel cells show potential but lack the infrastructure to implement a large scale rollout. California is working on this concept but veeery slowly.
I am just circling the drain....
I will be long gone before the oil is....
Or maybe even this thread... ::) ::)
Quote from: DrDave-Reloaded on March 17, 2008, 05:43:42 PM
I am just circling the drain....
I will be long gone before the oil is....
Or maybe even this thread... ::) ::)
Clockwise or counter clockwise? ;D
Quote from: Hobie on March 17, 2008, 03:25:21 PM
Hydrogen fuel cells show potential but lack the infrastructure to implement a large scale rollout. California is working on this concept but veeery slowly.
Agreed, but I'm concerned there too. There are already problems with having adequate supplies of fresh water for civilization. What happens if fuel cells are fully implemented in vehicles and SoCal has 17 million cars each using several gallons per day? And heaven forbid, Atlanta. Georgia is already trying to redefine their border with Tennessee to get more water.
I just don't think the future will be sustainable using any consumable fuel, not even water. Sure they can desalinate ocean water, but that takes a lot of power too. Right now there are still billions of people who don't even have access to modern conveniences. 1-1.5 billion people using consumable resources has brought us to this precipice. What happens if 3 billion more Asian/Indian people are brought into the modern age over the next few years? Then there is much of Africa. Assuming continued population growth and industrialization, within another 50 years there could easily be 10 billion people using the resources that have been heavily drained by less than 2 billion people.
I am definitely not an environmentalist or other extremist. And I do believe in the superiority of a free market economy over socialism and big government. So perhaps all these investors that are looking for where to put their money, could do the world a service, and make a fortune in the process, by investing in development of high efficiency solar panels and energy storage technologies.
Just my opinion.
Quote from: HighTechRedneck on March 17, 2008, 06:57:53 PM
So perhaps all these investors that are looking for where to put their money, could do the world a service, and make a fortune in the process, by investing in development of high efficiency solar panels and energy storage technologies.
The problem with many investors is the timeframe. They are not looking to get into 10+ year investments. They are looking for 3-5 year investments, maybe as much as 7 but rarely true.
I agree with Bob most recently, and others on this point. If you want to do something, figure out what you need to do to achieve it. Will it mean some sacrifices? Yep. Will those sacrifices be hard or difficult ones? Maybe, it depends on your definition of hard and difficult. Will they be worth it? Only you can answer that, and probably not right now. In 5, 10, or 20 years or more from now you'll look back and be able to tell us.
By asking us the question you already know in your heart what you want to do. You are looking for us to justify your decision one way or the other. Justification I can't provide, but advice I can. Search your heart for there is where your answer lies.
I moved to North Carolina from New Hampshire in late 2000 intent on marrying the woman to whom I was engaged at the time. I moved because it was easier for me than for her and her son. I moved because I had a dream of starting a family (or inheriting one as the case may be). Shortly after I moved here we both decided that it would not work out if we married, so we called the whole deal off. I was pretty bummed out, and thought about returning north (I could hear the true southerners rejoicing!) but decided to stay in North Carolina and continue pursuing my dream. I met her (a born 'n bred southern girl), married her (4 years ago this past February), and we are now pursuing new dreams together. They happen to include many cars and an older bus.
We've been told we're nuts, and people look at us funny. So what! It's our dream and we're doing what we want, and so what if it takes us a lot of years to achieve. What else should we be doing? Chasing after someone else's dream? Ummm, I don't think so.
As the "Happy Man" in Pretty Woman said, "Welcome to Hollywood! What's your dream? Everybody comes here; this is Hollywood, land of dreams. Some dreams come true, some don't; but keep on dreamin' - this is Hollywood. Always time to dream, so keep on dreamin'."
- John
on Non Road Energy.
just saw a bit on Wave generators. Thats a generator that produces enrgy with the motion of ocean wave action.
one field already in plac e off the coast of Portugal I think it was. and is currently producing elec.
Supposedly a 240sq mile field of these things would supply all of Englands Electrical needs in perpetuity.....only bad side is the loss of 240 square miles of navigable water
Dallas, while the use of water to make hydrogen might be involve quite a bit of it, there is no net loss of water to the earth because the hydrogen and oxygen produced turn back into water, the same amount as was originally used.
The difference would be in how much water would be tied up in tanks before it was used. I don't have any idea what those numbers might look like.
FWIW
Tom Caffrey
Quote from: pvcces on March 17, 2008, 10:27:43 PM
Dallas, while the use of water to make hydrogen might be involve quite a bit of it, there is no net loss of water to the earth because the hydrogen and oxygen produced turn back into water, the same amount as was originally used.
The difference would be in how much water would be tied up in tanks before it was used. I don't have any idea what those numbers might look like.
FWIW
Tom Caffrey
Tom, actually it was me that had the water concern. I was incorrect in stating fuel cells, I was actually thinking of hydrogen/oxygen combustion systems, something I've been hearing about lately. It requires fresh water. Still no net loss of water to the eco system, but does require availability of fresh water, something that is already an issue.
Most fuel cells intake Hydrogen and Oxygen and output electricity, heat and water (assuming clean hydrogen is used). The current method typically used for the production of hydrogen is from natural gas reforming, so it is still reliant on consumption of a fuel. If it is produced from water by electrolysis, the electricity still has to be produced to do that.
Either of these technologies would probably be ok with today's consumer base size. However, my point remains that with growing modernization of the worlds real population centers, sustainability cannot be achieved with consumable based energy sources. Just too many people.
The US will be dependent on foreign oil for many years because the majority of citizens belong to the NIMBY (not in my backyard) group. When a company proposes any kind of energy development, they first have to jump through multiple levels of government department approvals and then the lawsuits start by the protesters. Only companies the size of Exxon-Mobil have the financial resources to follow this to the end and even then almost all never get built.
The environmental groups each have their own agenda. While one group wants wind power, another group opposes wind power because it kills birds, is visual pollution and makes objectionable noise. The same holds true for every kind of new energy source, not to mention all the old ones (nuclear, hydro, clean coal etc).
If you are a company in the energy business, all you can do is take the path of least resistance and pass the cost on to the customer. I don't suppose any of you have noticed the increase in electrical rates to cover the $$$ spent to update power plants or the cost of natural gas that is being imported in refrigerated tankers.
Re: Well, Should i give up the dream of a Bus..
If you are willing to give up that easily, then yes, you probably should. :o
Personally, I don't care what the fuel costs, it's just part of the total cost & it too is taken into consideration when planning trips.
Europeans have been paying in excess of $5 per gallon for years . . . You HAD to have seen this coming!
The investors are soon to see their bubble burst & they will again, move onto something else to 'invest' in only to distort it's market value also. I wonder if they are the same idiots that bought 'investment' houses only to realize they paid way, way too much when that bubble burst?
Speaking of NIMBY... Ted Kennedy has opposed a wind farm offshore from Nantucket for years "because he does not want to disturb the pristine environment." Of course, that rings just a bit hollow when he is caught dumping diesel fuel in the same area...
http://www.capecodtoday.com/blogs/index.php/2008/03/13/kennedy_dumping_oil_itno_nantucket_sound?blog=53 (http://www.capecodtoday.com/blogs/index.php/2008/03/13/kennedy_dumping_oil_itno_nantucket_sound?blog=53)
Quote from: kyle4501 on March 18, 2008, 10:36:40 AM
Europeans have been paying in excess of $5 per gallon for years . . . You HAD to have seen this coming!
No, I did not see this coming. Diesel was just under $3 a gallon around Oct 1st of last year. Now, most stations are at $4. That is a 1/3 increase in just over 6 months. Certainly, I knew we would hit $4 eventually, but I was expecting it to take maybe two years, not 6 months.
Comparing USA pump prices to Europe is comparing apples to oranges. Now, if we stripped the tax off on both sides that would be a fair comparision. I suspect we would find the prices to be fairly close.
Some good news for a change. Oil is down to $105 a barrel, but who knows if that will stick for long.
I did notice that gas prices locally went down about 10 cents, but diesel just keeps going up and up. All my vehicles are diesel so I am really hurting. My father's minivan gets 22 MPG and my 33 MPG diesel car costs only about 1 cent less per mile for fuel than the minivan. I've seriously considered getting a high MPG gas car instead, but I suppose gas prices would spike as soon as I did that.
Just heard an interview on an overnight trucking show hosted by Steve Somers on WLW 700 AM in Cincinnati. He interviewed a gentleman by the name of Lindsey Williams who spoke volumes on the price of oil and where it is headed. Can you envsion $150 a barrel. Well, two years ago I couldn't either. But, now... He mentionend an oil reserve called Gull Island which was discovered by Atlantic Richfield, whose executives said the field has tremendous reserves butwould not be exploited until they got their price. ($150 a barrel?) Is this all a late-night "Art Bell" conspiracy theory? Who knows. But it was two years ago on the Art Bell show that a guest said dump dollars and buy gold. I said "whatever", turned over and went back to sleep. Who Knew.
As far as getting rid of the bus. No, oil would have to go a lot higher and at those prioces no one would buy it. However, I wouldn't buy a second. But if someone gave me free a Scenicruiser....
Sorry, I still think that if you didn't see the $4+ per gallon coming sooner rather than later, I don't think you were paying attention to what is going on in the world around you.
The way I see it is if Europeans are paying in excess of $5 per gallon, then it is no small stretch to realize that is what people will pay. It ain't apples & oranges to me. It is people paying what is charged. You want to blame it on taxes ? ? ? Blame it on whatever you like! Cost to manufacture has very little impact on actual selling price (if it cost more to manufacture than it will sell for, then it ain't made, simple as that- unless the gubberment subsidizes it - like they did with ethanol. Do you think Bill Gates made his $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ by selling at a small profit margin? Heck NO! He charged what the market would bear & used clever marketing to con us into forming lines to pay too much). If sufficient demand is present, the asking price will be met. Everyone wants a deal. If there is no competition, the seller sets the price that moves the amount of product they want to sell. If competition moves in, the price has to drop if they want to continue that volume of sales.
Proof of that is even with the recent rapid increase in price, there has been no significant decrease in traffic!
When the price reaches the point where people stop buying it (or at the very least, make significant reductions in how much they buy), then that will be the threshold of 'excessive pricing'.
We, as a whole, got complacent with the low price. Now that it's going up, some are whining about it.
As for me, I enjoyed it as long as it lasted. And, I have changed some of my habits. I'm not driving out for lunch, I consolidate errands to coincide with other trips. I sit in the car reading back issues of Bus Conversion for an hour while waiting on the kids - vs driving home & then driving back. Still hard to find someone to carpool with as most don't think the hassle is worth the bother . . . yet.
Just my opinion . . . . ::)
Kyle.....Germans, Brits and many others have been paying $3.50 plus since I was stationed there in the mid 50s. Most walked or rode bicycles. They also paid $5.00 + per pound for Coffee......far as I know, they "make do" and are not, probably, as into keeping up with the Jonses as are we. Not many "slums" in Europa.
Doubt seriously they trade in a car every year or two,especially stilll owing a whole bunch on it... and from my experience with them (I married a German) would almost NEVER spend beyond means. Exceptions, of course, but the average person on the street knows a lot more about how to keep their lifestyle in order than do we......in short, credit card debt, foreclosure due to "overbuying", repossession, etc.
Note, it didn't take Mercedes Benz long to get rid of the mistake they made a few years ago. Back to basics, I suppose.
FWIW :)
RCB
I guess we in our house shouldn't complain, we own all of our vehicles and toys outright and when so many others around us were selling their homes and moving up into McMansions we opted to stay in our modest little home which has tripled in value in 13 years. There are only two of us plus the critters anyway but I would love to have more garage and living space. Notice I put the garage first? :D
Aside from student loans and misc credit cards we don't really owe too much but I just don't understand the fuel prices and that's what ticks me off. I mean, I'm ok with raising the prices if you must but at least tell me the truth as to why, nobody likes being played for a fool which is what everyone thinks is happening. Yeah, I've been expecting a jump for years now but not so much nor so quickly and especially not right after I buy a hulking diesel guzzling bus!!
I guess it's about priorities, we probably will not take the boat out much this year but I definitely hope to take the bus!!
I have been quiet on this but after all the responses I guess my weird perspective just may fit in.
What we need a troupe of lawyers like the kind that went after big tobacco ( now remember they will get paid and we will get nothing ) to sue the sierra club -- greenpeace -- and all the other organizations that have prevented the development of good energy infrastructure and energy development.
By effectively bankrupting those organizations that hinder economic development and growth they may get out of the way and let us do what it is americans do. Build stuff and make things.
HEY Damn it over seven years later and the WTC is still just another dream we can't build a runway for an airport because of some mouse --- we are effectively paralyzed by an incompetent bureaucracy and are incapable of accomplishment.
The bigger half of the problem is that the government is going along with the losers that want us to move back to the farm and milk goats and live in dirt huts.
Everyone gets one vote and a chance to complain the day after -- It's the american way
I just keep swimming up stream and hope the current doesn't pick up too much.
YMMV
Melbo
Quote from: rcbishop on March 19, 2008, 05:48:43 PM
Not many "slums" in Europa.
RCB
"Europa" has life?? Cool. Sorry...couldn't help myself. ::) Whatever, wherever there's life there's slums. Even on Europa. ;)
RCB, regarding slums in Europe, how long since you've visited France or Denmark? They've got slums that ring most major cities. The Arabs have created huge slums...essentially with their own customs, language and laws. Polize won't enter the Shia' areas.
Germany has done a better job of 'melding' their immigrants into society. The rest of western Euro and UK have a major 'immigrant' problem brewing within their slums...or impacted areas.
Regarding the price of fuel in western Europe...what they charge isn't directly comparable to what fuel costs in the USA. They are paying for all sorts of gov perks that are not available to us. Health care, education, transit, holidays, etc. Some part of fuel taxes go to those subsidies.
We are actually importing fuel for about $70 bucks a barrel. We are, unfortunately doing with our "Peso" dollars. American dollars are not worth much in the world market. We are overspent, and undercapitalized...for now. This has happened before, and it'll fix itself, and we'll go on to find another greed induced financial crisis in the future.
The overvalued Euro is almost as much a burden for them as is our almost worthless dollar to us.
Americans must learn to live within their means. Not me of course...everyone else! And especially our government.
I'm not convinced that the dollar devaluation isn't a scheme cooked up by the feds to adjust our national debt. They've reduced it by one third without paying a dime on the principle. We are paying a penalty for energy, but??? Do we have any busnut economists? I tend to the creative side of economic theory. ;)
It'll work out. We live in a creative, rich country. It's just been mismanaged for too many years.
JR
Quote from: Melbo on March 19, 2008, 06:33:10 PM
I have been quiet on this but after all the responses I guess my weird perspective just may fit in.
By effectively bankrupting those organizations that hinder economic development and growth they may get out of the way and let us do what it is americans do. Build stuff and make things.
HEY Damn it over seven years later and the WTC is still just another dream we can't build a runway for an airport because of some mouse --- we are effectively paralyzed by an incompetent bureaucracy and are incapable of accomplishment.
The bigger half of the problem is that the government is going along with the losers that want us to move back to the farm and milk goats and live in dirt huts.
Melbo
MELBO FOR PRESIDENT!!!!!
Quote from: NJT5047 on March 19, 2008, 06:40:19 PM
Quote from: Melbo on March 19, 2008, 06:33:10 PM
I have been quiet on this but after all the responses I guess my weird perspective just may fit in.
By effectively bankrupting those organizations that hinder economic development and growth they may get out of the way and let us do what it is americans do. Build stuff and make things.
HEY Damn it over seven years later and the WTC is still just another dream we can't build a runway for an airport because of some mouse --- we are effectively paralyzed by an incompetent bureaucracy and are incapable of accomplishment.
The bigger half of the problem is that the government is going along with the losers that want us to move back to the farm and milk goats and live in dirt huts.
Melbo
MELBO FOR PRESIDENT!!!!!
I second that motion.
ME TOO!!! ;D
Thank You BUT
I only have a few friends now if I was president I wouldn't have any
Melbo
Interesting article on who is really making money off the price of fuel...
http://money.cnn.com/2008/03/13/news/economy/gas_gallon/index.htm?eref=rss_topstories (http://money.cnn.com/2008/03/13/news/economy/gas_gallon/index.htm?eref=rss_topstories)
"While Exxon made $40 billion in 2007, a 60% increase from 2004, it paid $100 billion in taxes and royalties."