First the good news....After having ripped out the steering wheel, drivers seat, shift tower with parking brake support, the whole front steps and finally the flooring......I managed to piece everything back together and start the bus. However, not until I figured out that if your step/chime light ain't happy....ain't nobody happy. (I disconnected this little jewel when I took out the steps ...... Don't think you're accomplishing anything by ignoring the light and merely twisting those two wires back together. ......No sir.... Sure, the bus will now start, but every 3 minuets your control panel will make some strange blip-squack noise that sounds like someone stepping on a duck.) And don't forget that harmless looking rectangle box screwed to the bottom of the panel down by your left heel....If you don't satisfy that little beast ....all you get is a click, way back there in the dark recesses of the bus somewhere.
Anyway, now the bad news.... I made the mistake of taking a toothbrush and trying to clean around the parking break release valve and discovered that the dirt was acting like a gasket. When it started hissing on the top I took the whole thing off, cleaned it, put it back and it started hissing from both ends. I then took it to a parts house and ordered a new one (no, they didn't have a rebuild kit) and on the way home decided to take it apart and see what made it tick.....I discovered that all it was, was a couple of o-rings....I then visited the hardware store, bought what I needed and fixed the leak. You may be thinking that the bad news is that I have two perfectly good release valves, but that ain't it. The bad news is that ever since I tore up the floor and pressure washed everything... my parking brakes won't release. They make a sound like they want to.... but they just won't let go. When you put it in gear, it bares down like it wants to go...... but it can't. (my wife will suggest prune juice >:()
What should I check?
Thanks.
Chazwood
Hi Chazwood ; I'll give u the usual thing first--make sure the air is 120 psi push release valve then give a full brake application! may have to bring it up to 120 psi 2 or 3 times to release, these are not a typical spring brake system these are a different animal called DD3
good luck
Les R
I tried that.
Will try again. :P
Nope, Just came back in...tried that three more times.... still locked up tighter than hung chow at a chinese buffet.
Next?
Is your parking brake indictor light staying on or turning off at some point after releasing the park brake? If it turns off, then first guess is moisture got in during pressure washing and there is a stuck shoe. If that is the case do a forum search on the keywords brake won't release. That should bring up some threads with good advise on getting them unstuck.
If the indicator stays on and you're sure the release valve is working (listen carefully for the air), then maybe there was a brake system interlock with another system that got disconnected during your cleaning work. For example on my RTS, there is an interlock with the door controls.
light goes out, and he belches, moans and farts like he's trying to let go ....but alas....nothing. (door lock still works) come to think of it there is a stray yellow plastic air hose that looks like it was part of the windshield wiper motors that is just dangling...(thought it was like a pressure release for the wiper motor.)
I guess I could turn it into a storage shed. Anyone want to buy a motor? :D
Hi Chazwood,
It's a faulty SPITZOR VALVE, yea, it's always the problem..... ;D or, you lost all the brake fluid when you disassembeled the valve.... ;D
just kidding....I think!
Hummmm..... It sounds like maybe one can is hanging up.
Nick-
Try reaching down and pull up on the brake pedal. Don't ask how I know this!
Art
Chazwood...after air up 120 psi with the park button in...push brake pedal down to release the locking cam ring within the DD3 can. If it still doesn't move after release brake pedal...then retry again but push brake pedal harder until it release the locking ring.
FWIW
Sojourn for Christ, Jerry
I have been tromping and stomping .......with no luck
One thing I do remember...... as I passed down the side of the bus with the pressure washer (the one I rented would blast like old faithful if you pulled the trigger , but would choke down if you went to long without releasing pressure, so you were always looking for something to hit) I stuck the nozzle around the back axles and wiggled it around some. I couldn't really see much so I passed on to the engine compartment. Since the parking brake only grips the back axles, maybe I shot something back there and it ain't happy about it?
Quote from: HighTechRedneck on March 12, 2008, 07:03:06 PM
Is your parking brake indictor light staying on or turning off at some point after releasing the park brake? If it turns off, then first guess is moisture got in during pressure washing and there is a stuck shoe. If that is the case do a forum search on the keywords brake won't release. That should bring up some threads with good advise on getting them unstuck.
If the indicator stays on and you're sure the release valve is working (listen carefully for the air), then maybe there was a brake system interlock with another system that got disconnected during your cleaning work. For example on my RTS, there is an interlock with the door controls.
Well, those keywords didn't get it but the keywords stuck brakes did:
http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=4020.msg36437#msg36437 (http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=4020.msg36437#msg36437)
http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=6672.msg64275#msg64275 (http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=6672.msg64275#msg64275)
http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=4442.msg40573#msg40573 (http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=4442.msg40573#msg40573)
hth
This probably won't apply to you, but I thought I had a stuck brake last summer. I 'tried' to release the brakes, put it in gear, and let the clutch out. The bus strained like it wanted to go (where's that prune juice?), but didn't. For me, the answers are almost always the simple things. Here's a hint to my problem: we have sandy soil here (close to the beach). The friend who was going to be directing me out the drive way walked around back and then came up to the driver's window and asked 'why are you spinning your tires like that'. Yep, I had sunk down just a bit into the ground. It wasn't really noticeable visually, but it turned out to be about 1.5-2". I did the old boards under the tires trick and got it moving. My brakes were never stuck, but my tires sure were! Good luck with it.
David
Ding!!Ding!!Ding!! ....We have a winner! And the winner of the "what has Chazwood done now" Contest is......Art! (the prize is, you have to call the guy I sold the engine to and tell him that I moved ;D) Just pulled up on the brake, like Art told me to, and the bus jumped like a scalded cat. Kinda scared me, because I was standing up (haven't put my seat back in.) So then I stomped the brake and almost went through the windshield. (Well, you can't go through the windshield at 2 mph... but you can scare yourself.)
Now here is the strange part. I noticed that when I put the brake/gas pedal assembly back down the brake part that goes through the floor was rubbing on the metal plate that the plywood rests on. When I put down the new plywood I cut out the round hole and had to make my hole bigger than the hole in the metal and the brake still rubbed. This was strange because the two mounting bolt holes in the metal plate forced you to go back with the assembly exactly like it was before, which leads me to believe that it was rubbing and hanging up slightly before I replaced the floor. It did seem reluctant to release the brake before But I just thought that was par for the course. Just reaching down, grabbing the lever and pulling up a little overcomes the friction and releases the brake ( Now I'm going to have to learn to drive all over again)
The sad part is maybe I've been driving around with my brakes slightly engaged and that's why this bus feels like a basset hound instead of a greyhound. I will report back.
Yeaaaa!
OK now Chaz, in my past experiences when ya gotta pull up on the brake pedal it means that the brake valve below the floor is getting worn out/weak and needs to be replaced or rebuilt! Um seems to me I saw in a recent thread that someone else just had to replace one! I don't remeber who it was, but I do think I remeber Nick's name being mentioned. Maybe he can remember the valve "name or number". FWIW ;D BK ;D
I got a kick outta the standing up part by the way! Sounds like something I would do! LOL! ;D
Part of the brake pedal was rubbing against the metal hole in the floor kinda like this was an after market pedal and didn't quite fit . When I took a metal file and ground away a 1/16 inch so the pedal no longer touches and it works fine. Looking at the metal tells me that it has been rubbing since it was put in. In fact, I took the dog out for a quick round the block and it feels like a different bus....more like a greyhound than a basset hound. It could very well be that until now the parking breaks or regular brakes weren't completely disengaging and so it was making the bus sluggish. (maybe that explains the 2 mpg >:()
oh geez...
I hope you haven't fried your brake linings...
happy coaching!
buswarrior
Damn, Chaz... that's even worse that my being stuck in sand! ;) Like I was told long ago "It's the little things that'll get ya'."
come on! fried my brake linings?!!! I only drove 500 miles. >:( (guess that might do it.)
I think it was mostly just when taking off. Sometimes it felt zippy....sometimes it felt a little sluggish. Like I say, it was just rubbing enough to barely keep the pedal from returning all the way back up every time. I will check the linings. Just my luck. :P
While looking at the linings for wear, also inspect the drums for possible heat damage (i.e. cracks).
And this, gentlemen, is the very best reason in the whole wide wonderful world to add a dual reading air pressure gauge. one to read pressure from the rear brakes and one to read pressure from the front brakes.
Dallas
I have one question about the brakes staying on due to the pedal being stuck. Wouldn't the dash light for the brakes still come on? Every time I put the brakes on slow down or stop that light illuminates.
David
Hey David that was a great lead in to a question that I have. ;D If I make a light brake application my dash light or brake lights do not light. If I make a little harder application they do light. I would like them to come on sooner. Does this mean that the switch that senses the air to provide 12 volts to the lights is bad? Do they loose sensitivity over time?
Thanks,
Tom Hamrick
Quote from: DavidInWilmNC on March 13, 2008, 01:01:12 PM
I have one question about the brakes staying on due to the pedal being stuck. Wouldn't the dash light for the brakes still come on? Every time I put the brakes on slow down or stop that light illuminates.
David
funny thing about that little light......mine has stayed on so long, it has fried the plastic lens in the dash. I thought that green light was suppose to stay on to tell you that you HAD brakes. (Obviously, the po thought the same thing.) Now that I fixed it, the light only lights when I hit the brakes. ::)
Quote from: chazwood on March 13, 2008, 02:05:33 PM
funny thing about that little light......mine has stayed on so long, it has fried the plastic lens in the dash. I thought that green light was suppose to stay on to tell you that you HAD brakes. (Obviously, the po thought the same thing.) Now that I fixed it, the light only lights when I hit the brakes. ::)
That little factoid makes it even more imperitive to check the linings and drums for excessive wear/heat damage.
Quote from: HighTechRedneck on March 13, 2008, 02:28:41 PM
Quote from: chazwood on March 13, 2008, 02:05:33 PM
funny thing about that little light......mine has stayed on so long, it has fried the plastic lens in the dash. I thought that green light was suppose to stay on to tell you that you HAD brakes. (Obviously, the po thought the same thing.) Now that I fixed it, the light only lights when I hit the brakes. ::)
That little factoid makes it even more imperitive to check the linings and drums for excessive wear/heat damage.
quite true..... I'm off to buy my king kong lug wrench and do some investigating.
My brake pedal return spring was a little weak and my brakes were staying slightly applied for a while until I lubricated the mechanism and replaced the spring.
83 MC9 ...
Now as to the brake pressure switch.. I recall it is a 5-psi switch, I had to replace mine because the old one kept failing on and then off.
Also as it turns out pressure washing the inside of the bus and up under the spare tire bay too agressively is just asking for things electrical and mechanical to start acting badly or oddly....
Not that anyone has noticed yet, But Chaz is dangerous and has way too much energy at times. Them must be some pretty big blinders he is wearing...
( all in FUN Chaz.. Don't let it bother you, Many of us may be a bit jealous of your energy...) ::) ::)
Chaz,
And anyone else who wants to know! The cheapest place by far I have found to get those brake light pressure switches, is @ C & J Bus Repair in Bloomington, MN. Tell JD that Busted Knuckle and the rest of the Busnuts from the MAK board (especially Gumpy & the Brians, and whoever else is up there local) told ya to call! I'm not at my desk right now (im in a motel in Nashville next to the Prevost dealership!), so I can't give ya the #. But it's easy to get from Google! FWIW ;D BK ;D
author=DrDave-Reloaded link=topic=7656.msg75118#msg75118 date=1205449377]
Not that anyone has noticed yet, But Chaz is dangerous and has way too much energy at times. Them must be some pretty big blinders he is wearing...
( all in FUN Chaz.. Don't let it bother you, Many of us may be a bit jealous of your energy...) ::) ::)
[/quote]
you must be talking with my wife ;D
But that's the weird thing about this whole fiasco....the knucklehead that put in the pedal assembly didn't even bother to make sure it fit.....then drove around with the brake light burning long enough to melt a hole in the lens so you couldn't even read what it said..... and never wondered what the deal was. I didn't even know what that light said until I got my manual. And all it took was a few strokes with a file and the whole thing works fine. (assuming I still have shoes and drums)
My wife will arrive soon with my King Kong impact wrench and we will git to the bottom of this, don't ya know. Yes sirree, by crackie.[quote
Quote from: Busted Knuckle on March 13, 2008, 04:20:28 PM
Chaz,
And anyone else who wants to know! The cheapest place by far I have found to get those brake light pressure switches, is @ C & J Bus Repair in Bloomington, MN. Tell JD that Busted Knuckle and the rest of the Busnuts from the MAK board (especially Gumpy & the Brians, and whoever else is up there local) told ya to call! I'm not at my desk right now (im in a motel in Nashville next to the Prevost dealership!), so I can't give ya the #. But it's easy to get from Google! FWIW ;D BK ;D
Sweet. ;D
Now for a little update. My wife just came back with my King Kong 1 in. industrial impact wrench.
Tip: For those of you who might be in the need... Harbor freight is selling one right now, for $79. (regularly $149) However, if you go...bring a friend. (To help you carry it) Better yet, bring two friends. (One to help you carry it, and one to carry the socket set.)
While you're there, pick up an air hose. (Look for one about the size of a garden hose....or as they say in the deep south, a "hose pipe") .....That puny little air hose you've been using all your life, to run every air tool you've ever owned.... ain't near big enough.
Next, go take a good look at your compressor....if it don't have pistons the size of minnow buckets, your probably wasting your time.
Remember to read the list of cautions and make sure you go to the dentist to check your fillings....cuz if any are loose....there commin' out.
Also, if there are any females in the area, try to look like you're not straining just to hold it up, (kinda ruins the whole image thing ) because, in their eyes.... you're a "Manly Man". 8)
Chazwood,
I don't really care if you get anything done on your coach. ;D ;D
The time you spend writing your posts are priceless. ;)
You really need to become an author in the Bus Conversion Magazine. You might become famous! A little humor is good for the soul. Thanks.
Paul
Quote from: chazwood on March 13, 2008, 06:49:13 PM
Also, if there are any females in the area, try to look like you're not straining just to hold it up, (kinda ruins the whole image thing ) because, in their eyes.... you're a "Manly Man". 8)
And one more tip for using that monster, if you weigh less than 275 pounds:
- if on grass or dirt, wear cleats.
- if on cement, wedge your toes under something heavy.
Otherwise, it just might, as the song says, "spin you right round" and that might negatively effect the "Manly Man" status.
j/k
Someone needs to make a video of him trying to manually break lugs loose with just a regular breaker bar...
That ought to be funny... I say that taking into consideration all of his antics so far...
Where's the darned camera to catch all this???? ::) ::) ::)
Chazwood,
With all the tools you are acquiring, just remember the words of Red Green "If the women don't find you handsome, they will find you handy!" Jack
Quote from: DrDave-Reloaded on March 13, 2008, 08:15:55 PM
Someone needs to make a video of him trying to manually break lugs loose with just a regular breaker bar...
That ought to be funny... I say that taking into consideration all of his antics so far...
Where's the darned camera to catch all this???? ::) ::) ::)
I did that once....the first time and the last time.
First of all, right after I bought the bus, I found this solid tube of steel with some holes in it, laying in it's own little spot, over my batteries...... couldn't figure out what it was. (couldn't hardly pick it up to examine it, it was so heavy) Looked like the longest deep reach socket I had ever seen.... then, I found this solid round bar (about 3 ft long) in the bay, and put two and two together. Giant lug wrench. Both of these pieces together weighed more than I cared to heft and they were thinking I'm supposed to give this thing a twirl and bust loose some lug nuts the size of toilet seats? Yeah right.
However, be that as it may, I foolishly thought.... if some bus driver can do this..... it can't be that hard. So... I mounted up on the nearest nut and gave her a mighty twist.
A few hours later.....after my visit to the chiropractor......(not really, but almost) I decided that what I needed was leverage. So I found the longest, most substantial piece of iron pipe I could and slipped it over the solid rod and proceeded to do pull ups and play see-saw, until my wife came out and asked me if I knew what the heck I was doing. I swear those nuts were put on by someone who was mad at their life. (or maybe they had their own King-Kong- industrial-1inch-impact-Manly-Man-wrench.) Those toilet seat lug nuts were so tight, I bent the solid bar every time I did my pull-ups....but.... no problem, all I had to do was turn it over on the next nut, and bent it the other way. This little event was the whole reason I decided to buy the King Kong impact wrench in the first place. Little did I know what THAT would involve. >:(
You know you have it bad when you buy an impact wrench
that is the same size as and looks like an air starter...
Just to turn some nuts...( which ones are your choice. )
That limp will eventually go away when the pain pills start working.....
Those $75 sockets also cause sever limping and a tilt to the left
due to the wallet being lighter....
Chaz, Are you sure that big bar was a lug wrench or was it the hand starter
crank?
Dave....
I had my "Manly Man" lug wrench laying on a table in my shop when a much lesser man walked in and couldn't even identify it. (a "Manly Man" would have known in an instant ;D)
He thought it was a replica of some kind of military cannon you mounted on a tank, or on the back of a hummer. Obviously, He's never seen a toilet seat lug nut. ::)
Quote from: DrDave-Reloaded on March 14, 2008, 07:31:16 PM
Chaz, Are you sure that big bar was a lug wrench or was it the hand starter
crank?
Dave....
I think you might be right....... I'll go try it and see....
Hey Chaz..
What's the item # on that 1" gun for $79? I can't find it. ???
Thanks, Mitch
I will go to my shop in the morning and see if I can find that for you. Never mind, I found it...here it is - $10 more online.
ITEM 92622-8VGA
THX Chaz. M
Does the socket set come with it for that price is it extra?
extra.....'bout $50
The Chaz,
Those compliments about your being entertaining weren't idle. I branded you the "Mark Twain" of the MAK BB. Keep on keeping on.
thanks,
John
If the wheel fasteners are installed correctly...on studs that haven't been stretched....
You won't be busting anything to remove them moving forward, because you won't be putting them ON with the air tool, and leaving them on there for years at a time.
You'll be taking them off annually for inspection and preventive maintenance.
Don't put wheel fasteners on with a gun without a torque limiter.
500 ft/lbs is all you usually need.
Your weight, out the right distance on the pipe extension and you're there.
happy coaching!
buswarrior
No matter how you put those nuts on, you owe yourself and all the rest of us a walk around inspection that includes a visual of each nut on each wheel at least once a day everyday you drive your coach. I do a walk around everytime I stop if I"m rolling a lot of miles.
I think the HFT gun is poor. The IngersolRand is the only way to go. It will work everytime, It is very light weight and it is very efficient with air useage. The IR will work fine off your bus/truck air tanks, it needs so little air.