new thread for this topic.
another New Player
Stallion Bus Industries www.stallionbus.com with the Sunliner
also alot of other small share operations are getting into the seated Highway coach market
Side note, Blue Bird sells their seated coach division to Coachworks/Wanderlodge
Good to see new entrants shaking up the market - competition improves the breed, and domestic competition now will help towards the fight against foreign competition later.
I see Stallion are using what they describe as a strengthened motorhome chassis for their highway coach, which doesn't exactly inspire confidence - perhaps in time Freighliner and all the others will start producing dedicated coach chassis' for bodybuilders to build bodies onto - that is of course how the European market has always been, which is why we have such a variety of manufacturers competiting with each other (and, dare I say it, better buses and coaches).
Jeremy
true Stallion as well as several others entering the Seated Coach market or already in it use "truck chassis"
Similarly alot of the High End Sticks and staples......even the ones touting themselves as buses are also on Frame rails
the Stallion is being marketed as a step up from the cutaway bus body tacked onto a van or truck cab
unknown on cost but the high end of the cutaways are into the 200k range for something that has a 1st run usable life of 200k miles
I've seen these buses in our Freightliner dealer and they look really great. Would be nice if they were offered in a conversion shell version. Good Luck, TomC
I'll tell you what BCI is looking really good to me right now! I just got home from a very "crappy day!" I was get'n on down the road today when I looked in my mirror and saw what at first looked like smoke rolling out from under the bus! Second look made it obvious that it was coolant! Turned out to be another one of those special order molded funnel hoses small on one end and big at the other! Luckily I had ordered spares last time this happened! Well I spent 2 hrs on the side of the road and we got it fixed. I called the customer that had already been notified of the blown hose issue, that I was back underway! At first they were OK with it, then 30 min later they called back & cannceled the bus saying they'd found one that'd get them to the camp closer to when They'd planned on it! Oh well that is life and I had broke down! So I lost that trip too, & the one I'd paid someone else to do for me, so I could be do the one that canceled!
Sorry to hear about that BK, there's not a lot you can do in that situation, hopefully it was a costumer who knows your company's good reputation and will be calling back in the future.
WVaNative
Quote from: wvanative on October 06, 2007, 03:31:21 AM
Sorry to hear about that BK, there's not a lot you can do in that situation, hopefully it was a costumer who knows your company's good reputation and will be calling back in the future.
WVaNative
Thanks WVaN,
But I sorta doubt it, it was a church we'd never done anything for B4, and it was a flaky deal from the start! They called Weds. looking for a bus on Fri. and were telling me they'd been dropped by another company. I told 'm I'd see what I could do. And they were 215 miles away from me, down in Murfreesboro so I ca;;ed a friend down there and asked if she had a bus to help out. Well come to find out she already had them booked for one of her school buses (they have coaches and twinkies, as they have a contract with the local school district), and that they'd decided a couple days B4 the trip that it was still too hot out, too far to go in a schoolie with no bathroom! But she didn't have a coach available, so as far as she knew they were still gonna take the "Twinkie" since they hadn't cancelled it! So I told her I was sorry, and not trying to step on her toes or anything. She told me hey no problem they called you! So if you can work something out with them that's fine, & I'll deal with them about waiting til the last second to cancel my bus separately!
Anyway I found someone to do my Fri. Night football team and quoted them a price! They agreed and then after that is when I broke down! Well they were coming to a camp up here in our neck of the woods, about 20 mins. from where the football team was playing. And since I needed to pay the other company for hauling them anyway. I swung by there & picked him up, & we went to a little down home cook'n restaurant right next to the rd leading into the camp. We took our time eating & talking and curiously watching out the window to see who/what they showed up in. Well it was way past the time they'd wanted to be there (6:30) and we'd finished eating and were about to drown in coffee so we headed back to the game thinking we'd missed them! But about 10 mins down the rd at 8:15 we were turning left onto a different HWY, when they turned right onto the one we'd just come off of! Well we had a good laff watching them get to the camp about the same time I'd have gotten them there, in the "Twinkie!" with about 4-6 P/U & loaded with luggage & kids following them! So who knows, I'm gonna call today and offer them a discounted ride home in a real coach, and even if they don't take me up on it I'll offer them a discount on a future trip! It still bites though, the $2,400.00's I "lost" yesterday would've almost made a payment on one of those Falcon 45's! Oh well Sorry to hijack the thread, and guess who I'll be calling to ask about a Falcon 45 come Mon! LOL! ;D BK ;D
I noticed, while looking at the spec page for the chassis, that Freighshaker uses "Neway air suspension".
If that Neway is anything like the Neway used on the Gillig Phantoms we had at the transit agency I worked for, then be prepared to deal with back injuries.
I've never ridden/driven a bus that bucked the driver around more than these, even Eagles with bad shocks weren't as bad.
90% of the back injuries claimed by operators came from Phantoms with Neway air suspensions on them - and these were all 40-foot coaches. Put it on a 30 or 35 foot unit, and you'd better make sure your health insurance premiums are paid up, and that you've got an EMT squad on board.
Seriously. BTDT.
Has to do with the design - the rear axle becomes a pivot point for a teeter-totter, basically.
Your choice. . .
;)
I've had Neway Airride on Freightliners, Macks and IH. All of them rode better than the Peterbilt Air ride. It even rode better than the old KW Torsionbar suspension which is pretty much the same thing as the Eagle Torsilastic. I'd like to know the difference in engineering between those and the Gilligs.
I was even considering changing out the rear springs on my PD4103 to a modified Neway Airride suspension from an FLD120.
Dallas
Dallas -
Were all those tractors tandem rears? That makes a difference, plus the fact that a tractor has it's major weight up front when deadheading, not hung out 10 feet behind the back axle. I don't have any experience with 18-wheelers, so cannot comment on ride quality, or deadheading vs loaded trailer. Perhaps TomC can chime in here with some additional info.
Gillig's Neway had trailing arms attached to the frame rails ahead of the rear axle, with a single large air bellow mounted behind the duals. Shocks were also mounted behind the axle centerline. As I mentioned in my previous post, this caused the rear axle to become a fulcrum point for the rest of the chassis to rotate around.
The front of the bus would go over something, causing the front of the bus to rise, compressing the rear air bellows as the chassis pivoted on the duals. Then, just as the front of the coach came down and the bellows was beginning to unload, the rear axle would go over the same bump, compressing the bellows even more, and pushing the powertrain up. The rear of the coach would come up, the bellow would unload totally, then the rear would come back down, recompressing the bellows and forcing the front end up again as the back end pivoted around the rear axle.
Imagine being subjected to that eight hours per day!
Later model Gilligs were not the problem that the first few orders were. Gillig started offering a different rear suspension, one that used four air bellows per axle, just like GMC's RTS. They use a similar system - two air bellows up front, four on the rear. Not as good as four bellows per axle like GM originally designed the suspension system, but a fair compromise, plus it eliminated the teeter-totter effect.
Buses with air suspension that use four bellows per axle (ignoring the tag axle for the time being, except for the Scenicruisers), have a unique ride, compared to other air suspended coaches that use less than eight - and BK can attest to this, because I'm sure he's noticed that the MCIs in his fleet ride (and handle) differently than the Setras. Not being critical here, just pointing out the differences.
Crown built some of their last production pusher skoolies with steel spring front axle and Neway air suspension rear axles. That combination produced a very interesting, somewhat choppy, ride. . . not something you'd enjoy in an RV setting, but perfectly adequate for puttering around town. Feels like you go up when the front hits a bump, then get pushed in the back when the rear hits a second later - an odd feeling as a driver. Kinda like those "horsey rides" that were outside the front door to the grocery store we used to ride on as kids, if you can remember those.
Doug -
Sorry to hijack your thread!!
FWIW & HTH. . .
;)
Can't wait to change a windshield on a Stallion....lol.
I'm not much of a fan of the smiley face on the front... Other than that it might be a good bus.
just imagine the cool bug paint job you could put on it with the atenae mirrors and a pair of eyes.
tekebird, got to look at one of the BCI buses Thursday at Cashman Cat in Vegas it had a problem with water in the oil on the C13 Cat engine.Its not a bad looking bus little rough in a few areas but it should be a good bus built on a Scania chassis and yes the chassis is built in Mexico and Brazil and Scania has always used off the self parts.The body is built by Wuxi Anyuan Automobile of China and the seats are made in Spain.Couldn't find any American made parts as the C13 is made in Brazil the same with the Eaton transmission.I don't know if i would like the CAN interface system i prefer a wire to each component i know this system has been around but i would hate to find a problem in the wiring with this setup.It is a Australian Corp
The Scania chassis is a top class bit of kit - in fact the Scania Irizar is my favourite coach. Scania make their own engines, but obviously are happy to also sell a rolling chassis as well. I don't know that the parts are 'off the shelf' (ie. non-propreitory) as such, but clearly they are trying to rationalise the number of parts, as indicated by thos quote about their coach chassis taken from the Scania website:
A high degree of component standardisation allows us to reduce the number of parts used by 60%, while at the same time increasing the number of combinations available to the customer. Standard components from our trucks are used to a large extent. This assures rational production and simplified parts supply, while standstill times are cut for service and maintenance.
Jeremy
Quote from: Sammy on October 08, 2007, 12:58:57 PM
Can't wait to change a windshield on a Stallion....lol.
Try changing the winsdcreen on one of these - it's not even symmetrical!:
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ftrucks.autoreview.ru%2Fnew_site%2Ftrucks%2Farchives%2F2003%2Fn07%2Fkonkurs%2F800%2F07.jpg&hash=d777427eb922dfbed996e11e1eb494d3277a47f9)
Jeremy
Quote from: Jeremy on October 13, 2007, 02:00:58 AM
The Scania chassis is a top class bit of kit - in fact the Scania Irizar is my favourite coach. Scania make their own engines, but obviously are happy to also sell a rolling chassis as well. I don't know that the parts are 'off the shelf' (ie. non-propreitory) as such, but clearly they are trying to rationalise the number of parts, as indicated by thos quote about their coach chassis taken from the Scania website:
I wonder if the Scania Irizar is the same as the Irizars sold here? The Irizars area really cheap and look exceptionally modern, but I've heard the electronics are a nightmare and no parts. The Irizars are marked with Metrotrans, but I think Metrotrans just imported them. Metrotrans mostly made the small shuttle buses like rental car places use.
This is the Irizar I am talking about:
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.irizar.com%2Fimages%2F03fotpbgal15g.jpg&hash=4baaa370185b47c5265569db4307bea0071a4b11)
You see quite a few of them around in the UK, and for some reason I have always really liked them. I remember the first one I ever saw was metallic gold in colour, and looked absolutely awesome (and absolutely huge) on a bright and sunny day. They have some pretty nice interiors too:
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.irizar.com%2Fimages%2F03fotpbgal20g.jpg&hash=a2f947ea0b0f2ab25fb56be6fe554f5aefe2291b)
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.irizar.com%2Fimages%2F03fotpbgal16g.jpg&hash=408b74f45d59b7f5ded81560149fce1d3b9e56dd)
Irizar is a Spanish bodybuilder, but they seem to do a lot of work with Scania, and Scania usually feature Irizar bodies in their literature etc. I'd be interested to know if the same bus as sold in the US - kind of hard to imagine it being 'really cheap' anywhere!
Jeremy
Quote from: JeremyI remember the first one I ever saw was metallic gold in colour, and looked absolutely awesome (and absolutely huge) on a bright and sunny day. They have some pretty nice interiors too:
I'd be interested to know if the same bus as sold in the US - kind of hard to imagine it being 'really cheap' anywhere!
Jeremy
Jeremy,
First off I also remember the first one I saw, it was awesome too! But then I talked to an ex-owner of one, he said don't walk away from it RUN BK RUN away from it! He said getting parts/service was a nightmare! Electrical systems were notorious for complications causing months of down time at a time! I too think the interiors are awesome, but again when buying a coach for revenue service ya gotta look at the "big picture" or as dad says "the whole package"! Not exactly the same as sold here but still attractive! And if no one will buy it, the price keeps dropping lower & lower! FWIW MHO! ;D BK ;D
the Irizars here in the US are Brazilian Units. and yes they are a run away from unit.