Reason #204 why I prefer a Bus Conversion over a Stick-N-Staple motorhome. You basically have zero protection if you are in a serious accident.
I am not saying you would survive if the same thing happened in a Bus Conversion, but you would stand more of a chance as you at least have a metal cage surrounding you.
I totally agree with that. I was the totalling of our class C S&S that swung our decision to converting a commercial bus. :^
Quote from: dtcerrato on October 21, 2023, 06:38:07 AM
I totally agree with that. I was the totalling of our class C S&S that swung our decision to converting a commercial bus. :^
From the back behind the driver you stand a better chance but at the front you don't have much protection in a bus,that was my biggest fear owning a bus was a head on accident
Quote from: luvrbus on October 21, 2023, 07:13:29 AM
From the back behind the driver you stand a better chance but at the front you don't have much protection in a bus,that was my biggest fear owning a bus was a head on accident
That is exactly why I try to avoid head on accidents. ;D
If I see doom ahead, I plan to veer off to the side and roll it or do whatever I can to prevent a head on accident.
Quote from: Gary Hatt - Publisher BCM on October 21, 2023, 07:16:05 AM
That is exactly why I try to avoid head on accidents. ;D
If I see doom ahead, I plan to veer off to the side and roll it or do whatever I can to prevent a head on accident.
Sometimes there no way to avoid a head on,a VW can total a bus in a head-on accident seen it 2 many times, lol you need to photo a rv in wreck besides a entry level
Here is another example of a factory built motorhome ending up in splinters. Note: You may have to have a Facebook account to watch this one.
https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=313883747938478&extid=NS-UNK-UNK-UNK-AN_GK0T-GK1C&ref=sharing&mibextid=2Rb1fB
There are no regulations on a RV anyone who has credit or cash can buy one that has regular drivers license can drive a RV weighing 50,000 pounds ,they have never driven anything larger than Toyota,they know nothing about air brakes,diesel engines or anything else.When somebody mentions training or special drivers licensee needed I notice the bus owners are the 1st to say we are not commercial and don't need training.Saftey begins at the steering wheel that were the accidents happen,not all RV's are junk but there is more junk than anything else.I would make you a small bet if the bus conversion had to have the DOT inspections 2//3 of those would have a red sticker on the windshield at a inspection station 8)
Clifford,I absolutely agree that far worse than shoddy 15 ton stick and staples is the lack of driver qualification behind the wheel. I do believe there are some states that require more than a license to drive a Corolla but most I think don't regulate it thanks to the RV industry and lobby. Just think how many recent retirees are removed from the market as they can't qualify to drive a heavy vehicle.
Every time I get in the seat after a break, I go Whoa this doesn't stop turn accellerate or anything like a car. Takes some time to get in the groove, I mean literally staying between the lines too.
Yep the lobby for RV's is the DYI dream for converting buses too, all it takes is a bathroom, water, a little electrical if required in that sate and a cooking stove then you have a RV The toilet can be porta potty, water can be 5 gal jugs with a 10 dollar pump, the stove can be Coleman gasoline stove and electrical can be a battery. I get buses through the shop that shouldn't be allowed on a highway
It ain't only DIY units that should not be on the road. This is Cousin Eddies factory Built rig.
Quote from: luvrbus on October 24, 2023, 11:20:41 AM
Yep the lobby for RV's is the DYI dream for converting buses too, all it takes is a bathroom, water, a little electrical if required in that state and a cooking stove then you have a RV. The toilet can be porta potty, water can be 5 gal jugs with a 10 dollar pump, the stove can be Coleman gasoline stove and electrical can be a battery. I get buses through the shop that shouldn't be allowed on a highway, Gary Hatt knows that he has seen a few here, the worst by far was a 1981 Prevost it was so bad the tag axle fell off leaving the driveway
Thanks a good point. Gary is always giving crap to the S&S because they fall apart when they hit the ground. I'd take 3 year old S&S any day as far as basic mechanical safety than a 60 old bus conversion that who knows what works or not. Fortunately, there are so few of us actually wearing out rubber on the road that we rarely hear of fatal or bad accidents due to mechanical failures but they do happen.
Quote from: Gary Hatt - Publisher BCM on October 24, 2023, 11:27:32 AM
It ain't only DIY units that should not be on the road. This is Cousin Eddies factory Built rig.
That is probably not on the road Troppers would have in a hurry
Quote from: windtrader on October 24, 2023, 07:01:36 PM
Thanks a good point. Gary is always giving crap to the S&S because they fall apart when they hit the ground. I'd take 3 year old S&S any day as far as basic mechanical safety than a 60 old bus conversion that who knows what works or not. Fortunately, there are so few of us actually wearing out rubber on the road that we rarely hear of fatal or bad accidents due to mechanical failures but they do happen.
Lol right Gary has owned a 1/2 dozen S&S before he bought a bus and he is still around and I go from buses to S&S and S&S to buses and I am still standing ,it gets down to whatever flips your switch
If I had the choice of what I'd be in to lay it on it's side at 70 mph it would surely be a commercial bus over a S&S any day or night.
Quote from: dtcerrato on October 25, 2023, 07:44:23 AM
If I had the choice of what I'd be in to lay it on it's side at 70 mph it would surely be a commercial bus over a S&S any day or night.
Buses do good in a roll over they were designed for the passengers safety, head on there not much safety in one the poor driver is the 1st to go.On my CC with the double frame from front to rear with the framing for the generator and the generator up front and the cage for the driver and copilot front end I never worried about a head on anymore, the framing for the 4 slides you could roll it and nothing was going to happen
Quote from: luvrbus on October 25, 2023, 08:13:53 AM
Buses do good in a roll over they were designed for the passengers safety, head on there not much safety in one the poor driver is the 1st to go.On my CC with the double frame from front to rear with the framing for the generator and the generator up front and the cage for the driver and copilot front end I never worried about a head on anymore, the framing for the 4 slides you could roll it and nothing was going to happen
I understand the bus driver is the first on the scene and a chassis frame lends to the driver protection.
What appalls or concerns me (not directly because it doesn't effect me) is how shabby (not the best choice of word) buses have got through the years compared to the old vintage/antique monocoupe design. The driver's corner of our 4104 - that would be the sidewall and front half is laminated layers of aluminum skinning - at least on the very early models which in my mind puts the driver behind more protection then you'd find in newer buses - especially the ones with real low windshields.
While we're on that subject - a question? Are the new modern super buses like the large blue Greyhounds running still aluminum or stainless, monocoupe or frame chassis or have they changes to fiberglass or composites? Just wondering.
Buses have changed Prevost has been using fiberglass composites for years and the frame work on newer buses now is beefed up heavy from buses of the past lot have frames now, it is not really a true monoscope construction on buses it is called Integral Structure now, that changed with the 45 ft buses because of flexing most are using a truss construction above the bays now like the old Eagle buses.Eagle never used a monoscope type
Quote from: dtcerrato on October 25, 2023, 07:44:23 AM
If I had the choice of what I'd be in to lay it on it's side at 70 mph it would surely be a commercial bus over a S&S any day or night.
No disagreement Dan. My point is the odds favor major mechanical problems in a 60 year old bus vs a 3 year old new RV. Chance of a brake line failure, steering, tire, or any other issue is far greater than the typically (un)kept/maintained bus we drive; not all, just far more old ones with deferred maintenance.
Quote from: windtrader on October 25, 2023, 01:59:26 PM
No disagreement Dan. My point is the odds favor major mechanical problems in a 60 year old bus vs a 3 year old new RV. Chance of a brake line failure, steering, tire, or any other issue is far greater than the typically (un)kept/maintained bus we drive; not all, just far more old ones with deferred maintenance.
A lot of truth Don most S&S jobs are not a high mileage bus converted to a RV,the Cummins and Cat engines in the pushers are good for 700,000+ miles the running gear doesn't give any problem, most fall to pieces before needing engine work but people don't keep one that long anyways the ones that do deal with the minior troubles and rattles
Agree Clifford,
90% of the S&S body fall apart way before they get driven to wear out mechanical stuff. I love looking at a shiny new SS and say to my wife, in ten years ours will look the same, that thing will be all faded and all the plastic falling apart. LOL
Quote from: windtrader on October 26, 2023, 07:27:42 PM
Agree Clifford,
90% of the S&S body fall apart way before they get driven to wear out mechanical stuff. I love looking at a shiny new SS and say to my wife, in ten years ours will look the same, that thing will be all faded and all the plastic falling apart. LOL
LOL it may look the same but your wallet won't keeping it up,helping a friend that needs brakes on his MCI and the front axle rebuilt,6 American made Webb brake drums over $7000.00 the way he wants to do it is going to cost him close to $12,000.00 for parts only,prices are crazy in todays world, he is ok with it though cost him $43,000.00 for a rebuild on his seriess 60 at WW Williams last year
The high cost of maintaining the bus conversion is not new newsm, you know better than most. What I think has changed is parts are harder to get, cost more, and harder to get repaired due to fewer skilled mechanics. This whole thing is not for the faint of heart. For that matter one wonders if being addicted to crack is cheaper than owning a bus.
Crack is an hallucinogenic.
Bus is the real thing.