The full force of lithium fire!
https://photos.app.goo.gl/NbNapEPgjj8dCBhS9
Lithium ion batteries and some other chemistries are very unstable if they experience out of spec situations. Other such as LiFePo4 are much more stable but less energy density. I can personally attest to the amount of energy that is released when shorted out, just don't ask details but a metal enclosure project for the bus battery is on the list. Based on what happened on a way smaller ebike pack, the bus would burn totally down if the house bank went off.
Quote from: dtcerrato on January 30, 2023, 06:41:11 PM
The full force of lithium fire!
https://photos.app.goo.gl/NbNapEPgjj8dCBhS9
Are you sure that's not a CNG-fueled bus whose roof-mounted gas cylinders are venting as intended to prevent a BLEVE?
John
Quote from: Iceni John on January 30, 2023, 10:46:55 PM
Are you sure that's not a CNG-fueled bus whose roof-mounted gas cylinders are venting as intended to prevent a BLEVE?
Joh
The fire is getting pressure from some source, like from tanks,it is defiantly under pressure blowing sideways.
Either way that is scary. I just hope everybody made it out of there in time. Unfortunately, these new alternate fuel and/or BEV vehicles are still in their infancy so who knows what sort of incidents may pop up.
Where was this?
You have fires on buses no matter what fuel source,the newer buses have a automatic fire suppression system in the engine compartment and the turbos still will burn one down ask Greyhound or tour operators. EGR diesel engines make a bunch of heat when regenerating enough to melt the piston in some cases. I worry about that on my ISX 15 when I see the turbo boost at 50 PSI trying to expel the heat from the EGR
It's electric and so are these!
https://youtu.be/T71cVhxG_v4
Quote from: dtcerrato on January 31, 2023, 06:10:58 AM
It's electric and so are these!
https://youtu.be/T71cVhxG_v4
You notice the fire going up in this video and not sideways like a torch.
Just all of the sudden and they all get destroyed. All the school bus builders offer a BEV version now. Very concerning indeed. Oh, 3 fire apparatus builders are offering more or less a plug in hybrid but the same thing could happen to them too.
I would guess the 1st video to be pressurized CNG but the link was sent to me by a friend and it was labeled "eco- electric" & couldn't find any details. If it was in fact electric, if the bats were in explosion proof metal cases, that would explain the pressure - fire escaping out of metal box penetrations? There is an explosion during burn the shows a structural panel being blown off the the side? Who knows, it's a bad day at any rate...
Eco and EV are very different in their definitions! Maybe the Eco is CNG?
Quote from: dtcerrato on January 31, 2023, 07:13:38 AM
Eco and EV are very different in their definitions! Maybe the Eco is CNG?
The EV buses I seen at Valley Metro the batteries are inside not on the roof .CNG tanks are on the roof for safety if something goes wrong like a leak the passengers are not gassed.
Not a Fire Bug but all I got one that first Vid is "Cool". ;D
The CNG MCI commuter buses used in SoCal park and fly type busses, cng tanks are mounted in the luggage bays. I had my 5A thereto do some work and the Service writer showed me the new buses with the CNG tanks, but I was surprised to see there weren't any walls between the bays, just the framework trusses..
are we descending into social media brain drool?
no references, no sources, no legitimacy.
are scantily clad empty head influencers next?
If so, let's get on with it.
happy coaching!
buswarrior
The Gillig CNG the tanks on top covered with fiber glass cover,the HVAC is under the cover too ,Valley Metro runs a lot Giiig buses,wirh the Cummins L9 O % emission CNG engines. They have 30 nice MCI's for the express routes with ISX 12 Cummins engines
https://www.carscoops.com/2022/04/cng-powered-bus-catches-fire-looks-like-a-scene-from-a-hollywood-movie/ (https://www.carscoops.com/2022/04/cng-powered-bus-catches-fire-looks-like-a-scene-from-a-hollywood-movie/)
So there you are! Same video, different text, simply amazing. No social media brain drool here BW. We don't do social media except to shop or in the interest of buses.
Quote from: dtcerrato on January 31, 2023, 12:02:04 PM
So there you are! Same video, different text, simply amazing. No social media brain drool here BW. We don't do social media except to shop or in the interest of buses.
If all the tanks went off at 1 time the bus would be orbit 8),I broke a valve off a oxygen bottle with 2200 psi and the heavy joker took off like a bottle rocket and those are probably 8,000 psi tanks
I know we have our heated ICE vs EV debates, but I think we can all agree we don't want ECE vehicles.
Looking at the video again, it appears to me that the flames are escaping from windows and a hole in the roof. As I have first hand experience watching a lithium ion pack go off, the fire just sends flames like you see. I suspect when the batteries lit up, the explosion and heat and pressure directed the escaping flames upward into the passenger area then it melted a window and started blowing out. You can see the seccond burst of flames on the back side escaping once the heat created a weak place to direct the heat.
It may be a design feature to shield the sides of the battery compartment and direct the heat up rather than sidewways. you can imagine how much damage would occur if those side flames burst out at 3ft.
Don you can see the CNG tanks on the roof there are no batteries in the 1st video.
Quote from: luvrbus on January 31, 2023, 12:47:57 PM
If all the tanks went off at 1 time the bus would be orbit 8),I broke a valve off a oxygen bottle with 2200 psi and the heavy joker took off like a bottle rocket and those are probably 8,000 psi tanks
I've witnessed a SCUBA tank turn torpedo! Scary and it didn't happen underwater thankfully...
Quote from: luvrbus on January 31, 2023, 03:34:50 PM
Don you can see the CNG tanks on the roof there are no batteries in the 1st video.
Clifford, You have more detail looks than I. Either way, it seems a gas tank in a car is the least explosive of the bunch. lol, once they got past the tanks behind the ford PU design.
CNG has a good safety record for fire ,the bus being in Italy we will never know what happened, here the NTSB would be all over it to find out what caused the fire.
Quote from: buswarrior on January 31, 2023, 09:02:59 AM
are scantily clad empty head influencers next?
buswarrior
Not pointing this to anyone, just thought it was funny, considering things I hear nowadays.
"If your brains were clothes, would you be decently dressed?" LOL!
TOM
Flammable compressed gas tanks generally come with a melt plug that prevents explosion by venting the gas if the internal pressure gets too high. In the case of a propane tank external combustion is probably better than internal combustion, but without oxygen how would you have internal combustion anyway? Guess you have to draw the line somewhere between very rapid expansion and combustion and explosion but with enough gas I can see where it might be hard to tell the difference.
Jim
I agree with others, that is a CNG fuel fire. Lithium batteries are generally mounted below the floor due to their weight.
I added a Protang fuel suppression tube system in my Generator compartment last summer and installed another tube in my Series 60 main engine compartment while in Quartzsite. It was installed by Aaron Jones, The Mobile RV Tech guy who advertises with us at the top of this page.
A lot of buses burn and many are started by engine fires as you can read in this article on our Blog by Ted Boothroyd https://www.busconversionmagazine.com/bcm-blogs/buses-really-burn-the-talk/
I had an engine fire last summer when leaving Denver climbing a hill when a coolant hose started coming off and blew coolant all over my turbo. I was able to extinguish it with a fire extinguisher, but I didn't even know it was on fire until I noticed the engine overheating and went back to look for the problem and noticed flames pouring off my turbo and exhaust pipes.
From now on, if/when my engine catches on firre, this fire tube will extinguish the fire without me having to even go back there. This will make me feel safer when traveling down the road in this old bus.
Quote from: Gary Hatt - Publisher BCM on February 01, 2023, 09:24:00 AM
I agree with others, that is a CNG fuel fire. Lithium batteries are generally mounted below the floor due to their weight.
I added a Protang fuel suppression tube system in my Generator compartment last summer and installed another tube in my Series 60 main engine compartment while in Quartzsite. It was installed by Aaron Jones, The Mobile RV Tech guy who advertises with us at the top of this page.
A lot of buses burn and many are started by engine fires as you can read in this article on our Blog by Ted Boothroyd https://www.busconversionmagazine.com/bcm-blogs/buses-really-burn-the-talk/
I had an engine fire last summer when leaving Denver climbing a hill when a coolant hose started coming off and blew coolant all over my turbo. I was able to extinguish it with a fire extinguisher, but I didn't even know it was on fire until I noticed the engine overheating and went back to look for the problem and noticed flames pouring off my turbo and exhaust pipes.
From now on, if/when my engine catches on firre, this fire tube will extinguish the fire without me having to even go back there. This will make me feel safer when traveling down the road in this old bus.
Antifreeze fires when they really get rolling can be hard to control, I tell people to fix a hose leak because antifreeze will burn, and they look at me like I am crazy.