Prices are through the roof on parts for the 2 stroke engines,I need a 2 heads for a 8v71 and 2 years ago a loaded after market head was less than $1250.00 ea now a loaded head new valves,valve springs ,seats and guides are $4300.ea without shipping.The heads are off shore and not the greatest by far,it is unreal the price of parts now.LOL I wanted a set of 8v92 heads for stock but not a $6500.00 ea
Your observation makes me afraid to start my forty two year old 6V92. When I shut it off 4 weeks ago, it was working great. Why mess with that?
Kansas. What about the place in Kansas with all the parts? Forget the offshore stuff. When the snow quits, I'll meet you there with my F-150 and my neighbors box trailer. I really will.
I'm also not afraid to think out of the box. If my DD has a major ka boom, remembering my bus is only 96 wide, what would you charge me to put a new Cat or Cummins in the back? Can't be much worse than trying to get parts from what you are seeing.
Seriously, I hope you can continue to find what you need. It is a dwindling art with dwindling parts.
8v71- 2 valve https://www.ebay.com/itm/254599714910?hash=item3b4753585e:g:Z~MAAOSwjXVewXsF
8v71 4 valve https://www.ebay.com/itm/165153260809?hash=item2673e6c509:g:Z1kAAOSwkIFheLcf
8v92 Says USA made- https://www.ebay.com/itm/262033079127?epid=1517829754&hash=item3d02637b57:g:LnAAAOSwd0BV6HAi
Unbranded- 8v92 https://www.ebay.com/itm/255146101245?_trkparms=ispr%3D1&hash=item3b67e489fd:g:kWIAAOSwqDheaTVK&amdata=enc%3AAQAGAAACkPYe5NmHp%252B2JMhMi7yxGiTJkPrKr5t53CooMSQt2orsSg3Ye8yTWgOW7pmE1t838dorSMnwOQJeAFbjcgBjW5OYFQB6T9PBHUn3K4k%252F9AEdzbqdmapmLD%252B7dw6AtMlPsU4GNjzl20g%252FJVaeNey1DPtaET%252B28mBAqKCFBhNUQ1Y8aYAMOeLeEPuEn0ZOMoEaMs01v8lZFPI5AoKWFi2nCmdmBTPu3w4zMlad%252F0PpZcmuLPvVq1c360lng2GnkMlYVKsM98ILQhmL4PO9PFREgHE0zoz6e9KhOaQxjh822z5WIFRDO2g39z3esW4mL2YvkbYoM%252Bi4dfsSeKhEs0fv%252Fq40lUGzdgsf%252FF1dxWrm89axtDRURDR4f0BvNWaCX2rug%252FgQ4n7ZYdCDCdMAWYAO4l7oo%252FaPe4F1t%252FRjjk92pN%252B8SL5%252FYgtzXGDfRG%252FcxNxCrpfILjnSxkF%252Bs2nd0YJyFmgI%252F2%252Fk335xOJNUw9vso8H6DQsGLO1tUUhWZ2XRn8GXPWSd%252BcA8wAeMkXWbmIPQrHoKedjKFuac%252FYFOBa0YFJzdsjevjtoURMJSzi1V%252BesX2D8GvcFU5DcVhXnPwu5pGgUGsms8GWCJFstyxMrWM4K1EGiqTjjHoIQeKTke%252BI2DbwaqRjf36Rwwt4XcJij%252BxpHT2iIBFnrT451hHcsn1%252FIXHiJshGqoNVJdfHlvRNdUWtGm4Ifh7jma6WTH%252FjOLWlhm%252BnpvBQzpmam8Ihv9wPEeF3Yi1PDPzii8AYHI2mrvL1zqkXvIdVR7YcNH%252FdSCiaNhxUpHNdt6xUpOztd1mzws%252B4gu7jIJY6VCUfF%252BF4KvWlISOULdGbJ7jIR7DiwSdVVytHXHongKBifZDKFCU8kH4%7Cclp%3A2334524%7Ctkp%3ABFBMiO-k58pf
Quote from: tr206 on January 13, 2022, 06:45:46 PM
8v71- 2 valve https://www.ebay.com/itm/254599714910?hash=item3b4753585e:g:Z~MAAOSwjXVewXsF
8v71 4 valve https://www.ebay.com/itm/165153260809?hash=item2673e6c509:g:Z1kAAOSwkIFheLcf
8v92 Says USA made- https://www.ebay.com/itm/262033079127?epid=1517829754&hash=item3d02637b57:g:LnAAAOSwd0BV6HAi
Unbranded- 8v92 https://www.ebay.com/itm/255146101245?_trkparms=ispr%3D1&hash=item3b67e489fd:g:kWIAAOSwqDheaTVK&amdata=enc%3AAQAGAAACkPYe5NmHp%252B2JMhMi7yxGiTJkPrKr5t53CooMSQt2orsSg3Ye8yTWgOW7pmE1t838dorSMnwOQJeAFbjcgBjW5OYFQB6T9PBHUn3K4k%252F9AEdzbqdmapmLD%252B7dw6AtMlPsU4GNjzl20g%252FJVaeNey1DPtaET%252B28mBAqKCFBhNUQ1Y8aYAMOeLeEPuEn0ZOMoEaMs01v8lZFPI5AoKWFi2nCmdmBTPu3w4zMlad%252F0PpZcmuLPvVq1c360lng2GnkMlYVKsM98ILQhmL4PO9PFREgHE0zoz6e9KhOaQxjh822z5WIFRDO2g39z3esW4mL2YvkbYoM%252Bi4dfsSeKhEs0fv%252Fq40lUGzdgsf%252FF1dxWrm89axtDRURDR4f0BvNWaCX2rug%252FgQ4n7ZYdCDCdMAWYAO4l7oo%252FaPe4F1t%252FRjjk92pN%252B8SL5%252FYgtzXGDfRG%252FcxNxCrpfILjnSxkF%252Bs2nd0YJyFmgI%252F2%252Fk335xOJNUw9vso8H6DQsGLO1tUUhWZ2XRn8GXPWSd%252BcA8wAeMkXWbmIPQrHoKedjKFuac%252FYFOBa0YFJzdsjevjtoURMJSzi1V%252BesX2D8GvcFU5DcVhXnPwu5pGgUGsms8GWCJFstyxMrWM4K1EGiqTjjHoIQeKTke%252BI2DbwaqRjf36Rwwt4XcJij%252BxpHT2iIBFnrT451hHcsn1%252FIXHiJshGqoNVJdfHlvRNdUWtGm4Ifh7jma6WTH%252FjOLWlhm%252BnpvBQzpmam8Ihv9wPEeF3Yi1PDPzii8AYHI2mrvL1zqkXvIdVR7YcNH%252FdSCiaNhxUpHNdt6xUpOztd1mzws%252B4gu7jIJY6VCUfF%252BF4KvWlISOULdGbJ7jIR7DiwSdVVytHXHongKBifZDKFCU8kH4%7Cclp%3A2334524%7Ctkp%3ABFBMiO-k58pf
You never know what you buying on Ebay I look at some like in the ad said they were reman "NEW" and there is a huge difference in reman and new and loaded and bare heads
I know Cliff just throwing out there buyer beware. I bought a Timken wheel bearing (from Rockauto) for my car and the holes didn't match so I called Timken to let them know and they said Rockauto is not there distributor and it is a fake even came in a beautiful orange and black Timken box. lesson learned even when you try to buy quality you can get screwed. Made it fit but I could have paid 3/4's less for the same junk quality probably the same part in a different box.
Inflation effects prices across the board on everything... Not just two strokes. IMO
Quote from: dtcerrato on January 14, 2022, 04:57:11 AM
Inflation effects prices across the board on everything... Not just two strokes. IMO
It sure does but I have never saw this before on DD parts aftermarket or OEM .If MTU doesn't change their minds this is the year all support stops for the 2 strokes lol like it has been all that great in the last few years
We have only 13,000 miles on our rebuild. I don't plan on doing it again in my life and would retire the bus as a tiny home if it quits in the right place. Lol
This latest set of economic changes makes it even easier to justify buying a very solid running bus, strip out the motor and all other major parts and simply store them just in case. You'll be way ahead having spares on hand and being protected from any more prices increases.
Just for the cost of a couple parts Clifford cited, you can get a whole running bus.
Quote from: windtrader on January 14, 2022, 10:16:23 AM
This latest set of economic changes makes it even easier to justify buying a very solid running bus, strip out the motor and all other major parts and simply store them just in case. You'll be way ahead having spares on hand and being protected from any more prices increases.
Just for the cost of a couple parts Clifford cited, you can get a whole running bus.
Yep with a modern design 4 stroke engine and transmission
well, I'm good to go then. Spare engine and spare set of heads, air compressor, alternator, and a spare 4905.
Two somewhat unrelated issues, converging in time...
I guess it matters not to the wild american psyche, blame will be attributed wherever it is popular to lay it?
There are supply chain issues, and peeps taking advantage of those.
The 2 stroke is ranging towards the end of support, with accompanying price gouging.
The timeless issue... anyone who buys a bus that needs an engine, is nuts.
Totally upside down right from the start.
Now, if work is being done on "old faithful" with many years of previous service, and many years of future service to come, hunting for a good used take-out is way more important than it was in the past...
Friends don't let friends buy buses that don't have engine life left in them...
Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
Waste of breath usually unfortunately. People fall in love with a conversion or shell and ask for advice, but never take it.
So I didn't click on this thread because I didn't know what "infaltion" was.
Turns out it's not a technical bus thingy after all.
Quote from: epretot on January 14, 2022, 06:22:19 PM
So I didn't click on this thread because I didn't know what "infaltion" was.
Turns out it's not a technical bus thingy after all.
Lol I waited 2 days for some one to catch the auto fill that miss spelled inflation
Quote from: luvrbus on January 14, 2022, 06:56:02 PM
Lol I waited 2 days for some one to catch the auto fill that miss spelled inflation
Don't you hate that? Now it will remain for eternity on the internet.
And here I thought he was talking about ED. lol
Quote from: chessie4905 on January 15, 2022, 04:54:25 AM
And here I thought he was talking about ED. lol
You should read the words when I am trying to post talking to this thing when Buddy the standard poodle hits me and spills hot coffee in my lap
Quote from: luvrbus on January 15, 2022, 06:04:40 AM
You should read the words when I am trying to post talking to this thing when Buddy the standard poodle hits me and spills hot coffee in my lap
Lol! Is that what we just heard? ;D
Well, when the spelling challenged 2 Stroke Bus Guru starts driving a 4 Stroke Motorcoach you know something is in the air. ;D
Too funny epretot! (And I had to look at your name twice to make sure I spelled THAT right.)
Maybe the sudden parts doubling is a conspiracy to get us off the road? Or they hate us because we can't spell! For example, we all think DEF means we can't hear. They hate us since we don't need to fill up with DEF. They can't make us park our buses, so to get rid of us, parts get too expensive. Like raising the price on ammo since the second amendment is pretty hard to change.
Chessie is right. I think we get ga ga and just buy one. I love my little bus. I can't help it. Fortunately it is running great right now and I maintain fluids and all that important stuff, but I will stop helping the nieces with college and re-power my bus before I give up on it. Brian Santin repowered his Flxible with something newer, better and way too fast. (I hear he just had to order wheely bars). In the 18 months we have owned "debt", we have redone the interior (mostly done by us) a new fridge by the Amish which works great, a new inverter and, and , and. We are not made of money, but when valve covers cost more than a 330 Cat and 5 speed Allison....I'm going in.
Well, at least we GM guys can get a new v903 for repower. Don't know if a LH one is still available, but that can't be insurmountable.
Quote from: chessie4905 on January 15, 2022, 10:24:19 AM
Well, at least we GM guys can get a new v903 for repower. Don't know if a LH one is still available, but that can't be insurmountable.
A later model bus with the series 60 would be a cheaper route,with oil closing at $84.00 a barrel yesterday headed for a $100.00 a barrel, people won't be driving their bus much anyways
Quote from: luvrbus on January 15, 2022, 10:38:34 AM
A later model bus with the series 60 would be a cheaper route,with oil closing at $84.00 a barrel yesterday headed for a $100.00 a barrel, people won't be driving their bus much anyways
Lots of naysaying going on...
Not the first time oil prices were high, not the last time. People thought all the buses would be parked the last time oil prices got over $100 yet here we all are.
Long after the next price hike, and long after EVs become the norm and gas/diesel vehicles are the rarity, people will still enjoy vintage vehicles.
Quote from: richard5933 on January 15, 2022, 10:52:54 AM
Lots of naysaying going on...
Not the first time oil prices were high, not the last time. People thought all the buses would be parked the last time oil prices got over $100 yet here we all are.
Long after the next price hike, and long after EVs become the norm and gas/diesel vehicles are the rarity, people will still enjoy vintage vehicles.
A lot of buses were sold and parked in 2007 lol so we are not all still here
Be interesting to see a listing of how many bus conversions were on the road in 2007 vs. now.
My guess is that the two main reasons most left the road are owners aging out and the vehicles having an issue which was beyond the financial ability of the owners to deal with. And of the two, the biggest reason is owners aging out and loosing the ability and/or desire to carry on with the bus. Combined with this are owners who passed on and their families were left with a bus they knew nothing about which either fell into disrepair or simply rotted into the earth.
Fuel prices? That might have pushed some off the road in 2007/8, but prices have dropped considerably since then. If anyone's sole reason for taking their bus off the road was fuel prices, they should have recovered from that. Any taken off the road because their owners got hit by the economic downturn would be a separate issue as things like that affected all RVs, not just bus conversions.
There are at least half a dozen guys doing active searches right now looking for their first bus. New people are still joining the ranks, many looking for vintage buses.
why start at 2007?? how about 1990 ??..>>>D
I follow some of the new people of F/B seems like the buses that get finished are all school buses,the ones that buy the vintage buses always seem to pop up for sale again. We would go to rallies like Bus'n USA there would be 150 converted buses now you see less than 50 buses at rallies on a good turn out 30 is about the norm for rallies now
Quote from: luvrbus on January 15, 2022, 12:28:07 PM
I follow some of the new people of F/B seems like the buses that get finished are all school buses,the ones that buy the vintage buses always seem to pop up for sale again. We would go to rallies like Bus'n USA there would be 150 converted buses now you see less than 50 buses at rallies on a good turn out 30 is about the norm for rallies now
That's true for other RV and motorhome rallies as well. We were surprised how small the crowd was at the FMCA rally we attended, and that was before the pandemic.
I don't think you can judge anything by rally numbers. People aren't joiners any more, not even for local clubs and such. Everyone wants to do his own thing and connect with others through a tiny screen. I don't get that.
FMCA with the cost of their rallies caused a lot people to pass when you start paying 50 bucks a day for power it sucks we stopped going to FMCA rallies 10 years ago,FMCA is trying to hang on even with admitting travel trailers it doesn't look good for FMCA,I hate to see it happen I been a member for years and it was fun for a long time
I read FMCA cover to cover each month after I read BCM a few times. I read FMCA mostly because I still like a regular paper magazine, and thanks to my father in law, it is free! My Father in law became a life member back when FMCA let you do that and he still gets the magazine. He is 91 now. I'm betting they did not think they would have to send him a magazine this long. lol.
When he was in FMCA, mostly in the northeast, they met pretty often, but usually in some farmers field. I listen to him pretty often about those days when we pull out his photo albums. His group had 2 scenic cruisers, 3 Flxibles, a fishbowl bus, 2 silversides, and a number of GM buses like his 4106. Almost all were stripped by them and built back with some pretty odd stuff. The guys (some of them bus mechanics) would often work on a bus at the meet. Sometimes just so it could get home! The kids played all day because they had to. No cell phones, no 5th wheel with 4 televisions. At night out came the guitars at the campfire and significant beer lubricated the singing. Usually songs about train wrecks and maritime disasters. A different time. Wish I could have been to one of those.
But I refuse to despair. Unless Covid just shuts us all down again, this year we plan ACA in Hershey, over to see the spoiled nieces in Jersey, stop in to see Luke at US Coach in Vineland. Later to The Flx parade in Loudonville, and maybe SE Busnuts in Florida. And hope there is something in Evansville or Blytheville since they are only a half day drive.
I don't know what fuel will be but we are not letting that keep us in the driveway. Fire them up guys! That is why we have them!
Quote from: Tedsoldbus on January 15, 2022, 06:26:20 PM
I read FMCA cover to cover each month after I read BCM a few times. I read FMCA mostly because I still like a regular paper magazine, and thanks to my father in law, it is free! My Father in law became a life member back when FMCA let you do that and he still gets the magazine. He is 91 now. I'm betting they did not think they would have to send him a magazine this long. lol.
When he was in FMCA, mostly in the northeast, they met pretty often, but usually in some farmers field. I listen to him pretty often about those days when we pull out his photo albums. His group had 2 scenic cruisers, 3 Flxibles, a fishbowl bus, 2 silversides, and a number of GM buses like his 4106. Almost all were stripped by them and built back with some pretty odd stuff. The guys (some of them bus mechanics) would often work on a bus at the meet. Sometimes just so it could get home! The kids played all day because they had to. No cell phones, no 5th wheel with 4 televisions. At night out came the guitars at the campfire and significant beer lubricated the singing. Usually songs about train wrecks and maritime disasters. A different time. Wish I could have been to one of those.
But I refuse to despair. Unless Covid just shuts us all down again, this year we plan ACA in Hershey, over to see the spoiled nieces in Jersey, stop in to see Luke at US Coach in Vineland. Later to The Flx parade in Loudonville, and maybe SE Busnuts in Florida. And hope there is something in Evansville or Blytheville since they are only a half day drive.
I don't know what fuel will be but we are not letting that keep us in the driveway. Fire them up guys! That is why we have them!
:^ Amen amen I say to you! :^
Hopefully Alaska 2022 here we come and if I can't afford to drive it back - I'll just winter up there... :o
Noticed I said I cause wifey won't have it - AK winter that is... ;)
Like a friend of mine a long time 4106 owner says if you drive a vintage bus buy a GM or Eagle they have 40,000 aluminum cans you can always sell and get home,where he came up with 40,000 is anybody's guess,lol knowing him he spent some time counting cans
This might be the year that I put tags on the DL3. If, if, if. No way to say for sure but at least it's a possibility. Several of us are doing one of those. There's kind of a sweet spot still between 2 strokes and multiplexed wiring that has pretty well bottomed out on price. That makes an attractive purchase. If I wanted to bail at any time I could easily sell the 60 series engine for more than I presently have in the entire rig and that's a comfortable place to be.
Jim
They just auction off 2000 models DL3 with series 60 and the B500 that went from $4500.00 to $6000.00 in California last week, those should be rust free,2 of the buses were day coach conversions for hauling politicans and other big wheels around
Quote from: luvrbus on January 16, 2022, 07:59:14 AM
They just auction off 2000 models DL3 with series 60 and the B500 that went from $4500.00 to $6000.00 in California last week, those should be rust free,2 of the buses were day coach conversions for hauling politicans and other big wheels around
Is the used bus market that soft? That's some pretty cheap drive train parts. Were do you find auctions like that to watch?
You need to go different sites like Bar None,Govt Deals,Iron Planet,Public Surplus,TNT and so on, there are 100's out there just register and they will send you notice
Quote from: rancher on January 16, 2022, 08:24:48 AM
Is the used bus market that soft? That's some pretty cheap drive train parts. Were do you find auctions like that to watch?
Yes, beyond soft, non-existant. Covid has blown the top, middle and bottom ends out of the bus industry.
Nobody to buy those buses, no work. Many fleets gone, never to return.
Very much not...
Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
It would be crazy to buy a two stroke shell anymore, no matter how cheap. Used coaches are so cheap now, you can get into a 60, Cummins, etc. Find one from salt free area and or one only used locally. Nice thing, your fuel mileage will be better too. Also forget any thing with a manual transmission. Electronic ones will be fine, as long as it wasn't a problematic one that owner wants to unload. Spend the money for all the manuals or download and print. Learn how to work with electronics.
Quote from: chessie4905 on January 16, 2022, 12:40:03 PM
It would be crazy to buy a two stroke shell anymore, no matter how cheap. Used coaches are so cheap now, you can get into a 60, Cummins, etc. Find one from salt free area and or one only used locally. Nice thing, your fuel mileage will be better too. Also forget any thing with a manual transmission. Electronic ones will be fine, as long as it wasn't a problematic one that owner wants to unload. Spend the money for all the manuals or download and print. Learn how to work with electronics.
I agree wholeheartedly. If someone's goal is a reliable bus at a good price then you are spot on.
But if someone is after a vintage bus or maybe has a hankering for a GM, then not so much.
Not everyone has the same goals here. Some prioritize reliability and low cost, others are specifically interested in a vintage bus, because it's a vintage bus and with all that brings.
For me, if reliability and cost were the issues, I would go after a truck conversion over a bus because it brings the added safety factor. But those weren't my reasons for choosing a bus - I was drawn to buses because of the styling of the old ones.
Tedsold, the busnut getogethers are still like that.
If you go to one with luvrbus or Buswarrior or the like, you will see on the spot bus repairs, with a lot of busnut heads looking around Clifford to see what he's doing...
Vintage buses are neat but you never get your invested money back, gone are those days when you could make few bucks on buying and selling,some real nice GM,Eagles and MCI buses on the market now for under 15k with newer generators not the old Perkins diesel power generator or gasoline Onan
Quote from: luvrbus on January 16, 2022, 06:20:47 PM
Vintage buses are neat but you never get your invested money back, gone are those days when you could make few bucks on buying and selling,some real nice GM,Eagles and MCI buses on the market now for under 15k with newer generators not the old Perkins diesel power generator or gasoline Onan
I think that most who have a vintage vehicle of any kind realize this. Hobbies rarely make money - you do it because you like doing it. There are also some old ones bringing much more, but you won't see the sale price listed online ever. I know of at least a few that brought much more than that.
It was the all-alloy riveted shell and vintage aircraft like wiring of the GMs that blew my mind. The traverse engine layout was really over the top. I do find a four speed in a 20000 vehicle nearly insane however.
Is there a place the newer buses faults and features are compared for us less bus literate types?
Quote from: richard5933 on January 16, 2022, 06:34:27 PM
I think that most who have a vintage vehicle of any kind realize this. Hobbies rarely make money - you do it because you like doing it. There are also some old ones bringing much more, but you won't see the sale price listed online ever. I know of at least a few that brought much more than that.
All you see online is the asking price never the selling price.I have always been a Eagle lover lol and spent a ton of money converting and rebuilding one, sometimes I miss my Eagle and think about buying another Eagle then common sense clicks on a light,I still love those beautiful Eagles more than any bus
Quote from: luvrbus on January 16, 2022, 07:09:48 PM
I still love those beautiful Eagles more than any bus
I have a similar opinion, and they are the only buses I will ever own, but I have lusted over some GM's and Flxible's. The quality of the Torsilastic suspension is the big difference.
I guess I am an odd one. In October of 2020 we were bringing our coach home after several grand worth of upgrades and lost a lower radiator and cracked the head on our 671.
Took it to a shop that specializes in 2 strokes and hade them work their magic. Found out the block had previously been damaged. We thought it over and had a rebuilt made for us. It was not an option to scrap the bus.
Now we are ready to travel with our new engine.
I couldn't buy and convert a modern coach for the same money. Besides I like our little 4104.
Siberyd
It is heartbreaking to see so many buses now being parted out to keep others on the road now,owners seem to think they are worth more for parts.I don't what I will do with it. not even liking GM buses I bought a nice 4106 with a 6v92 and V730 the owner passed away and kids were selling it to a scrap yard so I paid her 500 bucks more to save it,I have the tires to install and plan on driving it to Scottsdale.I am going to Ca to look at a Eagle that is to nice to be setting for 10 years the owner passed away before he ever made a trip in it after taking years to finish
This kind of thing happens to all sorts of collectibles and antiques. The owner dies and to the kids it's just old junk that they don't value. They want it gone and to be rid of what they see as a hassle.
If someone loves their bus enough hopefully a plan is put in place before it ends up like this.
As I am looking around trying to figure out what to buy to do some traveling in. I look at the older coach's with the two strokes and I like the idea until I read a post like olebusman posted being broke down on the road with his fan hub issues and no parts. I can do my own work at the house and wait for a part but if your thousand miles from home and no parts and you need a shop and no one wants to work on a two stroke. Then what do you do. The cost of hauling it home is out of reach. I like older equipment but sometimes having them isn't a good idea. If I find the right conversion I might take a chance.
Buses were never setup for the individual to maintain,I been in Greyhound,Trailways and tour operators shops where they had up to 10 engines complete with transmissions, fan and starter even with oil, in four hours they would roll out the door back in service, the individual doesn't have that luxury
When my bus was built in 1980 I was at Quantico because all new Lieutenants have to go to Basic Course. About 1/3 of us were headed to Pensacola after the 6 month course, and treated with some distain by the others. One day we were just getting released from class when 2 Marine F-4s flew over the school and were doing a few laps nearby. Everyone ran out of the building to see them!
Within minutes one of not going to Pensacola guys said " I don't see what is the big deal".
A Pensacola guy replied " Yeah.... well I never saw people run out of a building to watch a grunt go by". Kind of mean I suppose but us fly guys thought it funny.
I did not purchase my bus to show off. (But it is shiny metal thing that makes a roar). When I saw it I liked it for it! To my surprise (and I am sure most of you have experienced this) every time I stop for fuel, stop at a rest area, pull into a campground - I get approached with 20 questions. As described above I do travel with subdued anticipation ever time I take it more than an hour from home.
Did I remember extra belts, hoses, straight 40 oil, fuses they won't have at the next truck stop...???
But I love to drive it. I love when cars pull along side with kids trying to get me to do the air horn. It is just a wonderful thing.
And nobody ever ran out of a building to watch a Winnebago go by......
Quote from: rancher on January 17, 2022, 06:14:43 AM
As I am looking around trying to figure out what to buy to do some traveling in. I look at the older coach's with the two strokes and I like the idea until I read a post like olebusman posted being broke down on the road with his fan hub issues and no parts. I can do my own work at the house and wait for a part but if your thousand miles from home and no parts and you need a shop and no one wants to work on a two stroke. Then what do you do. The cost of hauling it home is out of reach. I like older equipment but sometimes having them isn't a good idea. If I find the right conversion I might take a chance.
A lot of wisdom right there.
Old rigging is fine if you never go far from home but if you travel a lot and end up broke down 20 miles from the east end of nowhere its not so much fun. Contrary to what my signature says I find myself looking from time to time but if we take the plunge again it will absolutely be with a 4 stroke.
As some would say, it's part of the adventure. Pretty much the same with any vintage vehicle - you might get stuck somewhere. Of course the repercussions are more expensive in a bus.
Most of the weak points are well documented, such as fan hubs. They should be inspected regularly and if not up to snuff it would't be a good idea to go far from your home shop. Or do like some and carry a spare.
All depends on a person's priorities and budget.
A broken fan hub has a fix, it all depends on where you are and if the parts you need are available nearby. A friend lost his fan hub on a 4104. A trip to town and he came back with a couple of electric radiator fans. He removed the broken fan hub. Zipped the new fans in place and continued his journey. When he got to his destination, he permanently installed the fans. That bus is still on the road 10 years later.
LOL now you spend more money for tires and batteries than you paid for the bus,All the road side assist except CoachNet is dropping towing for a converted buses,if needed that tow bill cause you the big one,Van knocked a hole in transmission pan and AAA plus refused to tow his bus he told me
Quote from: luvrbus on January 17, 2022, 07:25:16 AM
All the road side assist except CoachNet is dropping towing for a converted buses,if needed that tow bill cause you the big one,Van knocked a hole in transmission pan and AAA plus refused to tow his bus he told me
Yes it's true! We carried Goid Sam, AAA along with Progressive w/Roadside assist. When we started hearing GS started refusing service to others we kicked them to the curb. Now AAA after all the years we had them they too have been cut. Progressive has always been our go to for tows but now they seem to be weakening. Make no mistake when I have trouble on the road the last thing I need is an RV TECH for repairs, (we are well equipted to do our own repairs) I need a tow! Coachnet is the only one I will be able to count on to help get that done and get us off the road.
Tues was evidence of that as we dragged the top of a fuel stations filler cap and ripped a nice hole in our transmission pan leaving us dead in the water at the diesel pumps. Fortunatly after all the drama with our service providers I managed to make a temp repair refill 7 gallons of fluid and self recover back to a fellow Busnut's shop where we could make a permenant repair and continue on to Cliffs place.
Our 1953 4104-129 has been all over most of the 48 states from 1979 thru 2015 & we love mountain driving. Since 2016 we've done two round trips between FL & AK and hope for another this year. 1st round trip was over $8000 in break downs & repairs incl. cylinder head replacement (in IN) and afterwards a blower disintegration (in AK) among multiple other failures.Never used roadside assistance and always performed repairs on the side of the road or in a yard somewhere. The 2nd trip put the coveralls on once to adjust slack adjusters in AK before the return trip. Like sibeyrd said: "I guess I'm the odd one" & "Besides I like our little 4104"
Well - your not the only odd one! Me too! & we love our 4104... Just saying :^
Van Glad you got back up going without needing a tow. Getting towing insurance will weight in on what we end up buying to do some traveling in. Some states get pretty touchy about giving you very much time to get going when you are broke down on the side of the road. I would hate to get forced into a tow and end up with a monster tow bill.
In the great white western north you can homestead on the side of the road w/o issue. Sometimes you wish police would stop when you're trying to get their attention. Lol
Quote from: dtcerrato on January 18, 2022, 07:08:48 AM
In the great white western north you can homestead on the side of the road w/o issue. Sometimes you wish police would stop when you're trying to get their attention. Lol
There 2 buses down close to me now a MCI and a GM and I cannot help the people out as bad as I wish I could
Quote from: dtcerrato on January 18, 2022, 07:08:48 AM
In the great white western north you can homestead on the side of the road w/o issue. Sometimes you wish police would stop when you're trying to get their attention. Lol
That is FUNNY. Hey, you pull a GC with the 671 ??
-Tom P.
Quote from: fortyniner on January 18, 2022, 03:56:40 PM
That is FUNNY. Hey, you pull a GC with the 671 ??
-Tom P.
10-4 on the GC at 4600 lbs. It's predecessor was a Sierra quadrasteer PU with a camper shell loaded close to 7000 lbs. And still not as heavy as it's original OH luggage racks & 43 seats with passengers! And bottom compartments loaded... ;)
Quote from: luvrbus on January 18, 2022, 08:42:05 AM
There 2 buses down close to me now a MCI and a GM and I cannot help the people out as bad as I wish I could
When I read post like this it's sure making think twice about looking at older buses and buses in general to do some traveling in. Sure don't want to get stuck thousand or fifteen hundred miles from home with no parts and no shop that will work on it. Would hate to leave a bus full of your stuff and have to take the toad home.
Quote from: rancher on January 19, 2022, 09:38:22 AM
When I read post like this it's sure making think twice about looking at older buses and buses in general to do some traveling in. Sure don't want to get stuck thousand or fifteen hundred miles from home with no parts and no shop that will work on it. Would hate to leave a bus full of your stuff and have to take the toad home.
It happens more than you read about for sure
A bit like going to sea!
And the more you know the scarier it gets! Which btw is why I rarely ride amusement park rides.
For peace of mind I have to replace rear airbags and check bearings soon.
Imagine how the JamesWebb telescope people feel ;)
Especially if your Bus is your home!...
Owning a bus is a roll of the dice some times it is 6/1 other times you get 6/6,buses are not for everyone as neat as they are.The new crowd most have never driven anything but a 4 banger car and it is over their heads.plus some don't listen either
Well at least they have driven something. Plenty of people have no interest in driving at all these days.
So, even though the new kids are often in over their heads they are out there getting their hands dirty and get kudos for that. And they do bring new ideas to the table like lithium power banks and inverter/charger systems.
I've nothing more to add since I've been absent from the forum for a bit. That said, I loved reading everyone's experiences. Growing up in the 70's I lusted over the 2 stroke buses. Learned to dabble and not fear anything mechanical. When I was 12, watching the A-team was an inspiration as Mr. T would fix anything (fictional of course) but his one line he said never left me. "If man can put it together, man can take it apart and fix it"
Wish I could hang around some of you guys. Turned 52 last week. I know all about the buses that get worked on and built with dreams to hit the road only to find the owners pass on. There's a beautiful Silver Eagle I wanted to buy a mile from my house. Interior was garbage but bus was solid and looked good on the outside. The family selling it is stuck at no less than 30k. I have since bought a '93 Newell 44' with the 8v92. My dream came to fruition but in a more lux state. Even still, I began semi-gutting it as it was dated. Thankfully I have flooring/tile/wallpaper/counter top people willing to do work on it.
If anyone is in the East Mesa AZ area I'd be happy to show them my little project. Hope to be road going by June. Newell rallies are full for the year but we will still take a cruise somewhere...
Hey Rancher,
Don't let us scare you away from adventure. I have only had my bus 18 months but we love it. It is solid and fun to drive. I've had an engine run relay fail at 65 mph, fried my inverter, and had to replace my refrigerator. And I do have to take parts and fluids, but we still love the bus!
In 2005 I retired and we took a 2 year old Allegro bus all over the country for a year. But guess what. Two years old. TWO! and (drum roll please)
Three times the slide would not come in. The hot water heater blew up, levelers would not come up. Only one would come up a month later after Allegro "fixed" it. Tail lights went out at night on I-10 due to wire harness rubbing on the frame. Took a week to find that. At Allegro!
Watch some of the U-Tube stuff with these 5th wheels. Yikes. We saw a wrecked one on our last trip. At least I think it was a 5th wheel. Stuff strewn over 50 yards of highway. Buses don't strewn.
I guess I am just saying you pays your money and takes your chances. Since we had a year on the road we developed itchy feet, so we are going to get back out there. In a 1980 bus. That has a 42 year old engine (rebuilt once). And when it breaks, I call some of these guys. They taught me how to bypass my run relay so I could get to a repair shop. It is wires and things you can see and maybe fix. A printed circuit board behind the dash of an Allegro Bus dashboard? I couldn't fix that.
Geez guys. What happened to the saying these old buses run a million miles - no big deal?
Reality is just like an old car. How far you dare to take a road trip is highly dependent on how strongly you feel the major systems are up to the job. Bus is not much different. After a bit, you pretty much develop confidence is what is solid and what needs some attention. Flat out total surprises are not all that common. Usually, it is something you know might be a problem someday, it's just we all want that someday to be down the road so to speak.
They do, but when we get them, they already did their million miles.
Quote from: fortyniner on January 20, 2022, 10:47:52 AM
Well at least they have driven something. Plenty of people have no interest in driving at all these days.
So, even though the new kids are often in over their heads they are out there getting their hands dirty and get kudos for that. And they do bring new ideas to the table like lithium power banks and inverter/charger systems.
Don't read it wrong I am not bashing the younger group,my door has been open for many years to younger people that want to learn,and it doesn't cost them a dime, it is when they develop a crappy attitude then we have a problem.That happens with the older crowd too some of those really get a attitude.We have fun and laugh alot around here,I let Gary Hatt get good and frustrated before I offer to help,LOL Gary will give out but he never gives up :^
Quote from: luvrbus on January 20, 2022, 06:35:39 PM
Don't read it wrong I am not bashing the younger group,my door has been open for many years to younger people that want to learn,and it doesn't cost them a dime, it is when they develop a crappy attitude then we have a problem.That happens with the older crowd too some of those really get a attitude.We have fun and laugh alot around here,I let Gary Hatt get good and frustrated before I offer to help,LOL Gary will give out but he never gives up :^
My Hat's off off to those that (for whatever reason) don't give up. :^
Quote from: luvrbus on January 20, 2022, 06:35:39 PM
Don't read it wrong I am not bashing the younger group,my door has been open for many years to younger people that want to learn,and it doesn't cost them a dime, it is when they develop a crappy attitude then we have a problem.That happens with the older crowd too some of those really get a attitude.We have fun and laugh alot around here,I let Gary Hatt get good and frustrated before I offer to help,LOL Gary will give out but he never gives up :^
Gees you guys. Y'all are spreading fear and terror on social media. 🥺
Yikes 😬
Quote from: Tedsoldbus on January 20, 2022, 02:24:45 PM
Hey Rancher,
Don't let us scare you away from adventure. I have only had my bus 18 months but we love it. It is solid and fun to drive. I've had an engine run relay fail at 65 mph, fried my inverter, and had to replace my refrigerator. And I do have to take parts and fluids, but we still love the bus!
In 2005 I retired and we took a 2 year old Allegro bus all over the country for a year. But guess what. Two years old. TWO! and (drum roll please)
Three times the slide would not come in. The hot water heater blew up, levelers would not come up. Only one would come up a month later after Allegro "fixed" it. Tail lights went out at night on I-10 due to wire harness rubbing on the frame. Took a week to find that. At Allegro!
Watch some of the U-Tube stuff with these 5th wheels. Yikes. We saw a wrecked one on our last trip. At least I think it was a 5th wheel. Stuff strewn over 50 yards of highway. Buses don't strewn.
I guess I am just saying you pays your money and takes your chances. Since we had a year on the road we developed itchy feet, so we are going to get back out there. In a 1980 bus. That has a 42 year old engine (rebuilt once). And when it breaks, I call some of these guys. They taught me how to bypass my run relay so I could get to a repair shop. It is wires and things you can see and maybe fix. A printed circuit board behind the dash of an Allegro Bus dashboard? I couldn't fix that.
No you aren't scaring me off. I understand newer stuff can have issues also. Been working on all types of equipment since I was a kid growing up in a smaller truck stop that my folks owned and my folks had trucks also. I am just trying not to purchase something that I will regret buying. Keep all the ideas coming I am listening and alwaying learning.
Sourcing parts is the biggest draw back to a older bus,MCI is not that bad but they come at a hella of a price for the parts,lol as said before repairing a old bus can become a restoration project in a hurry
I do worry about parts and who will work on it, but I found two "will work on it" guys within 90 minutes of here.
But it is worth it! The bus is so solid. No fiberglass or particle board. It is just cool every time I see it. We never had a bit of love for the Allegro bus. It got us around. A bit faster than the bus and Rita found it easier to drive, but she too ( having been raised in a 4106) loves the bus.
This debate can go on for hours, but sure of one thing....
Once you ride on air bags, it is hard to go back.
A lot of class A motor homes have air bags I ride on 10 of the jello bags in my Country Coach,lol the Eagle bus was the best ride out there and they didn't have air bags
Eagle?? What's that?😉
Hi guys, going back to the original topic, I am in the process of rebuilding a Mechanical 8V92 for our bus, the local Detroit dealer doesn't support them, but there are plenty of places that do (new, rebuilt and used parts). There are still a LOT of marine units racking up thousands of miles and business ready to support them. The only issue I had getting parts was some delays in shipping and remember almost everything on an old 2 stroke can be rebuilt and doesn't often need to be replaced. Just rebuilt the water pump this afternoon with an $85 seal kit (bearings and impeller were like new), and did the blower, turbo and a bunch of small parts over the last couple of weeks, just freshening everything before I put all the pieces back together. I do have a couple of spare motors so I can pull parts off those, if needed. Our bus has 2.3M miles and still got a lot more left in her. When I get her back on the road (hopefully this summer) it will have a rebuilt motor, fresh HT750 trans, all new brakes, bearings, bushings, so there isn't much else that may go wrong, but I'm sure we will find something :-). Finding and fixing problems is part of the adventure, even if they have to be done at the side of the road, but wouldn't trade our old girl for any newer bus.
Quote from: yeeolde48 on January 21, 2022, 02:29:42 PM
Hi guys, going back to the original topic, I am in the process of rebuilding a Mechanical 8V92 for our bus, the local Detroit dealer doesn't support them, but there are plenty of places that do (new, rebuilt and used parts). There are still a LOT of marine units racking up thousands of miles and business ready to support them. The only issue I had getting parts was some delays in shipping and remember almost everything on an old 2 stroke can be rebuilt and doesn't often need to be replaced. Just rebuilt the water pump this afternoon with an $85 seal kit (bearings and impeller were like new), and did the blower, turbo and a bunch of small parts over the last couple of weeks, just freshening everything before I put all the pieces back together. I do have a couple of spare motors so I can pull parts off those, if needed. Our bus has 2.3M miles and still got a lot more left in her. When I get her back on the road (hopefully this summer) it will have a rebuilt motor, fresh HT750 trans, all new brakes, bearings, bushings, so there isn't much else that may go wrong, but I'm sure we will find something :-). Finding and fixing problems is part of the adventure, even if they have to be done at the side of the road, but wouldn't trade our old girl for any newer bus.
There is a bunch of aftermarket parts for the 2 strokes some are ok some are junk,and you cannot get some parts from the aftermarket circle it is best to have engines to rob from,I prefer OEM but they are imposable to obtain sometimes
Maybe this?
https://www.google.com/search?q=image+of+amc+eagle&sxsrf=AOaemvIE_cDisPKyVI-_nk0IpMExVAQ9vw%3A1642812781063&source=hp&ei=bVXrYYYcnInK0w-HlqfoAg&oq=&gs_lcp=ChFtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1ocBABGAAyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwguEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyDQguEMcBEKMCEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECdQAFgAYJsIaAFwAHgAgAEAiAEAkgEAmAEAsAEP&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-hp#imgrc=EPWpnmyJne1JDM
Quote from: chessie4905 on January 21, 2022, 04:54:43 PM
Maybe this?
https://www.google.com/search?q=image+of+amc+eagle&sxsrf=AOaemvIE_cDisPKyVI-_nk0IpMExVAQ9vw%3A1642812781063&source=hp&ei=bVXrYYYcnInK0w-HlqfoAg&oq=&gs_lcp=ChFtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1ocBABGAAyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwguEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyDQguEMcBEKMCEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECcyBwgjEOoCECdQAFgAYJsIaAFwAHgAgAEAiAEAkgEAmAEAsAEP&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-hp#imgrc=EPWpnmyJne1JDM
This?
Quote from: luvrbus on January 21, 2022, 02:53:07 PM
There is a bunch of aftermarket parts for the 2 strokes some are ok some are junk,and you cannot get some parts from the aftermarket circle it is best to have engines to rob from,I prefer OEM but they are imposable to obtain sometimes
Now that is very worrying. How the heck to you know whats what?
Quote from: fortyniner on January 23, 2022, 06:40:36 AM
Now that is very worrying. How the heck to you know whats what?
It's not really different than working on any vehicle that is decades out of production. Nearly all the parts out there for any vintage muscle car are going to be aftermarket, with the same issues regarding questionable quality on some parts.
Best thing I know to do is seek out a reputable parts supplier who as skin in the game and buy from them. This extra layer adds a middle man but it also adds someone that is looking at the parts and doing at least a preliminary investigation regarding quality before sending them out.
Buying aftermarket parts direct from unknown sellers online is a recipe for getting bad parts.
An example would be buying from someone like Luke. True, on occasion even he has had to deal with bad parts. But when that happens he stops sending them out and seeks out a better source, if one is available. He knows what we need and tries to screen out the junk before we ever see it.
As a purveyor of vintage Buick engines I quite agree. Find the right source and always be alert for new ones. Keep a stock of spares. Some things just won't be available any other way. Of course keeping a spare bus or three around may pose some issues...
Jim
Quote from: richard5933 on January 23, 2022, 07:36:52 AM
It's not really different than working on any vehicle that is decades out of production. Nearly all the parts out there for any vintage muscle car are going to be aftermarket, with the same issues regarding questionable quality on some parts.
Best thing I know to do is seek out a reputable parts supplier who as skin in the game and buy from them. This extra layer adds a middle man but it also adds someone that is looking at the parts and doing at least a preliminary investigation regarding quality before sending them out.
Buying aftermarket parts direct from unknown sellers online is a recipe for getting bad parts.
An example would be buying from someone like Luke. True, on occasion even he has had to deal with bad parts. But when that happens he stops sending them out and seeks out a better source, if one is available. He knows what we need and tries to screen out the junk before we ever see it.
Good points on the difference between OEM and aftermarket parts and those involved in the aftermarket supply chain.
Quote from: buswarrior on January 16, 2022, 12:10:15 PM
Yes, beyond soft, non-existant. Covid has blown the top, middle and bottom ends out of the bus industry.
Nobody to buy those buses, no work. Many fleets gone, never to return.
A local shop here in Minneapolis that works pretty much only on coach buses was booked solid last summer. I usually have them grease the bus and inspect everything, but I called six or eight weeks before my big trip in late September and they couldn't get me in.
The summer of 2020 I had no issue getting my bus into the shop. The service advisor stated they had even worked on some motorhomes to stay busy.
I've noticed that many businesses here are slowing down. My tile guy was always 8 months out. Now he is 2 weeks out. He did the bus shower and is now doing the LVP today. I went to Home Depot to order carpet for the bedroom thinking I would be doing it myself. I know that many places will not do any motorhome carpet. Not only did HD tell me for the $50 they'd send a guy to measure but they are sending him out tomorrow! Although this is great, it makes me nervous as to what's up the road in terms of this economy. Signs of slowing it seems.
Economies are cyclical. The shop that works on my bus has been through periods of being extremely busy and quite slow during the past year and a half. They don't seem to be struggling overall, just having a wider swing.
Most businesses I've been frequenting recently are seeing a return towards normal, and restaurants are quite crowded.
I'm not sure that there is any need for panic.
You would think Wal-Mart, Sams Club and Costco with their buying power could keep the stores well stocked not the case in most of their stores now.What is in stock is costing 20% or more
Quote from: luvrbus on January 29, 2022, 06:34:16 PM
You would think Wal-Mart, Sams Club and Costco with their buying power could keep the stores well stocked not the case in most of their stores now.What is in stock is costing 20% or more
It would be a great time for companies to bring manufacturing back to the US. I've seen recent stories about production still being shut down in many areas of China as they go through their rolling lockdowns to deal with the spread of Covid. As they near the Olympics it looks like they'll lock down an entire city if one case is found. Combine that with the backup in shipping and it's not surprising to see things out of stock at the stores.
Doesn't much matter how big the buying power of Walmart is if they can't even get their inspectors and company reps into China to check on production.
Not saying it's the sole cause of the shortages we're seeing in stores, but it isn't helping. I'm not saying this as a direct dig against China either, as much as against the concept of outsourcing such a large chunk of production to one foreign country which we have little to no control over.
It's stupid a nation like the US depending on other nations for our food supply,people. are hurting sad when you see the seniors on fixed income with a basket full of the cheap packages of noodle soup in the checkout
Ramen noodles and Cup of Soup is major staple for the students in this college town.I like them too, btw. Beats eating a tin of cat food.lol
I tried a cup of noodles once,the cup if you ate it would have more food value I think
Cliff! You gotta add water first!🙄
Yeah. I like them. Linda won't touch them.
As part of my winter boredom abatement plan for this year I learned how to make noodles from scratch. Nothing in them but flour, water, and maybe eggs. Not difficult to make. In the end, the taste was only marginally better.
Then I learned to make my own broth - and that made all the difference.
Boredom is a cruel taskmaster.
How long till the salt's off the roads and we can start traveling in the bus again??
I remember that. About 30 years ago, I made homemade noodles. Good bit of work. No rolling machine like they have now. They almost were the same as store bought. Never made them since.