While this move over the next several years, I can't help but think that heavy duty engines will be next. Someone on here said those new DD5's weren't so good.
DAIMLER wants to move toward EV power only at some point and throw ICE's to CUMMINS. Time will tell how this goes.
https://www.truckinginfo.com/10137259/daimler-truck-to-hand-over-medium-duty-engine-production-to-cummins?utm_source=website&utm_medium=contentoffers&utm_campaign=052821
LOL our power grid is a little weak now what going to happen when we have a few million EV needing charges,I noticed Whole Food in Scottsdale had charging station.A buddy in Scottsdale that owns a towing service said times have never been so good since the EV lol he just purchased 2 new wreckers to keep up with the demand .
It's admirable that they want to do this because at some point the technology will improve. But we are nowhere near that goal yet. For now it's just symbolic. Yes I'm sure tow operators are loving these early versions.
battery vehicles will be great. no oil to change, no complex transmissions, or emission systems. will take thought on driving time, load weather as to how far one can get without a charge. Most people cant think enough to plan their trips or how driving speeds effect range. Highways will need very slow lanes for drivers that poor calculators.
how about long lines at charging stations, and large traffic jams at rush hour with temps in the 90s.
Brownouts and blackouts will be exciting.
Remember the blackouts last summer in CA due to forest fire issues?
The price of popcorn is going to soar. Better stock up now.lol
And don't forget about the sky falling...
When cars started replacing horses I'm sure there was an equally loud cry about all the coming problems. Here's one article comparing that time to now when RVs are replacing combustion engine vehicles.
https://robertmassaioli.medium.com/tesla-and-horses-what-did-people-actually-say-3c53169d9bc
Will there be growing pains? Sure.
Can we upgrade our grid and the technology to make it work? If we want to.
The question is whether or not we want to.
Like every thing in this great (broke) country it will be a long time coming unless the people in DC find away to buy power from China :( we are going to pay a price so will the kids and grandkids ,with all the high tech windmills and solar I have seen my power bills double in the past 10 years what is wrong with that picture
just raise everyones taxes for their agenda. Been doing it for decades.
The new tax forms are out ,,,"How much did you make.?? "send it in"..>>>Dan
Print more money
Quote from: Jim Blackwood on May 31, 2021, 06:09:30 AM
Print more money
Yep the ATM machines are dispensing $100.00 bills like $10.00 bills around here now
Wind and solar provide 2.8% of US energy. So me thinketh electric vehicles are still predominately indirectly propelled by dinosaur juice. My niece just purchased an EV and asked me what I thought. I told her I applaud her conviction but asked that she research where the "juice" comes from to their house when she plugs it into their garage at night. She is pretty sharp so I expect an arrow back about the large polluting 2cycle diesel I drive but don't need. She is a Hillary huggin' Biden voter, but we still love each other. We are cooking ourselves but I don't think the energy solution is yet discovered. For the sake of her generation and those to follow, we better giddy up and solve it.
Even if the electric plant burns Dino fuel, I'd suggest that there is still an efficiency of scale issue that makes it better than 1000s of tiny Dino burners running all over the roads.
Kind of like having 6 window units in a house vs. one central a/c system. Yes, they all run off the electric system but there is a huge efficiency gain from the one larger unit vs. all the smaller ones.
Until it goes down. At least you have 5 others to keep you cool.
Hydrogen is still the internal combustion engine fuel solution, still a ways away from full development, but useable...
The problem with hydrogen is that it is currently produced at a net loss. It's abundant, being in the top 10 elements on Earth, but with todays production methods you should consider it an energy store rather than a source.
Im sure there are many other issues with it thatll come out with increased interest. Remember in early years when nuclear energy was the golden child?
We should be 100% nuclear. Just because the Russians can't do it right does that mean we have to take lessons from them? Yes Yes, Three Mile Island. That was over 40 years ago so how long does it take?
Quote from: CrabbyMilton on June 01, 2021, 09:46:41 AM
We should be 100% nuclear. Just because the Russians can't do it right does that mean we have to take lessons from them? Yes Yes, Three Mile Island. That was over 40 years ago so how long does it take?
I don't worry about the nuke plant here in AZ their safety record is flawless
so was 3 mile island. About 100 miles from us. I still glow in the dark.🤪
must save on flashlight batteries when you glow in the dark
dave
Quote from: chessie4905 on June 01, 2021, 02:14:07 PM
so was 3 mile island. About 100 miles from us. I still glow in the dark.🤪
The US Navy is a prime example of nuke power and safety they haven't built a battle ship,submarine or carrier in years without nuclear power
I was just thinking about that too. Those things are sailing around all the time as well as being combat proven and virtually no problems with the nuclear problems that so many are fearful of.
I think the biggest obstacle with Nuclear power is what to do with the waste!
There are any number of square miles in the desert that are nowhere near any towns that can be blocked out for such a purpose.
Much of the nuclear fear is just ignorance. Many years ago I took a bus daytrip to Door County WI. Part of the trip included a stop at a nuclear power plant. It was very interesting and informative and quite enjoyed it. A couple years later I took the same trip but only this time the power plant stop was omitted. I asked our tour conductor whom I had on the last trip why this was. He said a lot of people stayed in the bus because they were afraid to go in.
Many years ago I attended a week long seminar at the Lawrence Radiation laboratory aimed at bolstering support for things nuclear. I still worry about the waste products.
Overall I'd have to say it was a successful endeavor as it is where I met my wife--fission at first sight! Jack :^
Good punchline.
The facilities that are nuclear power plants have a limited life span, due to the breakdown of the radiation and chemicals reactions of the radioactivity. So if you enjoy the electricity created by radioactive generated power, then the nuclear waste should stay where it was used, in the facility that is no longer usable for any other purpose than a burial ground for the spent radioactive residue...
The first town to be powered by nuclear in the US was Arco ID it's closed to public and was built in 1955,never understood a nuke plant in Idaho with all the water Idaho has, do nuclear power plants have a life span I thought they were licensed for 20 years then inspected and license renewed. I read where Turkey Creek in FL was licensed for 80 years a few years ago I think it was in FL.The waste is kept on site isn't it I saw the deep concrete wells being built before, the walls were 3 or 4 ft thick lined with steel,The medical field probably has more nuclear waste than the power plants being they only change the fuel rods about every 10 years I was told
Google:
Most nuclear power plants have operating life- times of between 20 and 40 years. Ageing is defined as a continuing time-dependent degradation of material due to service conditions, including normal operation and transient conditions.
If I remember correctly, water ways adjecent to nuclear power plant, were early requirements for runaway heat created by the rods, under extreme conditions. Rivers and oceans locations being the early builds, like 3 mile island...
Quote from: lvmci7070 on June 02, 2021, 01:12:13 PM
Google:
Most nuclear power plants have operating life- times of between 20 and 40 years. Ageing is defined as a continuing time-dependent degradation of material due to service conditions, including normal operation and transient conditions.
If I remember correctly, water ways adjecent to nuclear power plant, were early requirements for runaway heat created by the rods, under extreme conditions. Rivers and oceans locations being the early builds, like 3 mile island...
LOL Palo Verde sets in the desert what a change,no fresh water enters or leaves the plant,it cooled by the treated waste water from Phoenix and surrounding cities and is evaporated into the air kinda, neat no treated waste water dumped into the rivers around Phoenix,Palo Verde is 30 years old now and going strong it will be around for a long time since the license is good for 60 years Google may be wrong on the 30 to 40 years life span
There is a moratorium on coastal power plants due to the Fukashima catastrophy. San Onofre is permanently closed and had one of the worst safety records on the books. Bechtel installed one of the nuclear reactors backwards - scary huh? Oh it's just Los Angeles... Geeze. Crystal River 75mi west of us has been decommissioned but two coal fired plants are still active there. France leads the world in nuclear reactors.
Good luck with nuclear getting traction anymore. 3 mile island, Chernoble, Fukashima,etc plus the issue of dealing with spent fuel rods. very few are willing to burying them for years. Hard enough to find places to take our trash. Not going anywhere anymore in this country.
Quote from: dtcerrato on June 02, 2021, 04:42:51 PM
There is a moratorium on coastal power plants due to the Fukashima catastrophy. San Onofre is permanently closed and had one of the worst safety records on the books. Bechtel installed one of the nuclear reactors backwards - scary huh? Oh it's just Los Angeles... Geeze. Crystal River 75mi west of us has been decommissioned but two coal fired plants are still active there. France leads the world in nuclear reactors.
I believe we have more nuclear power plants than France not real sure though since I don't do google
USA has almost twice as many nuclear power plants than France but France leads the world in it's electric grid being powered in 2019 at over 70% by nuclear energy. In our construction years we put many a cooling towers in nuclear power plants. Sort of like the radiator in our buses...
France has had nuclear power plants since the 1960s, without any problems. It is the cleanest form of energy: zero emissions. There are improving ways to bury the waste, such as deep in the Canadian shield granite bed rock. If a container broke, it would take thousands of years to percolate back to the surface. The biggest obstacle is the public perception and fear of nuclear.
This is why Dan glows green! :^
The one in Elk Grove California was shut down years ago because of all the problems. It only ran at 30% most of the time. We all called it Rancho MistakO...instead of Rancho Seco....
Yep, and they are shutting down a perfectly good one at Diablo Canyon near San Luis Obispo, California in 2025. Supplies 10% of California's energy.
They have proposed a 400 square mile 3 gigabyte wind farm 17 to 40 miles off the coast of Morro Bay, CA. The largest in the USA. Supposedly have received the approval of all agencies involved, which is a miracle. I'm sure there will be appeals by someone/organization.
Quote from: usbusin on June 03, 2021, 08:56:40 AM
Yep, and they are shutting down a perfectly good one at Diablo Canyon near San Luis Obispo, California in 2025. Supplies 10% of California's energy.
They have proposed a 400 square mile 3 gigabyte wind farm 17 to 40 miles off the coast of Morro Bay, CA. The largest in the USA. Supposedly have received the approval of all agencies involved, which is a miracle. I'm sure there will be appeals by someone/organization.
60 % of the power generated here in AZ goes to CA ,if they shut down Hoover and other power supply from other states CA would be in deep trouble,CA does some dumb things like giving the Indians the water rights to the Colorado River and now paying for the water
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jun/03/bill-gates-warren-buffett-new-nuclear-reactor-wyoming-natrium
Clifford California actually doesn't need any power with alll the solar they have. Yes they buy 55.9% from Az but they also pay Az to take our surplus solar or it would overload their grid and cause blackouts. They are always shutting down some of the solar plants to try and figure out just how much they don't need and the feds will only allow them to use so much renewable power. they need to figure out when to shut down each unit to compensate for the overall electric usage like in Summer with the use of AC's as opposed to winter and not the call for the power that was needed. And as far as up North they have plenty of water even in a drought year it is from Fresno south that uses so much and has tried to get the rights to the northern water for years.
:^
Back in the 80's wifey & I are backpacking back country in Washington state. Two days in we come up to a reservoir with a razor wired top chain link fence around it. We were moving in closer to read signage on the fence. It said - "No trespassing property of Los Angeles CA water management". Well okay we looked at each other and said WTF!? :o
Quote from: dtcerrato on June 03, 2021, 11:51:26 AM
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jun/03/bill-gates-warren-buffett-new-nuclear-reactor-wyoming-natrium
The problem with nuclear which is left over from the cold war is that a typical plant only burns a few percent of the available fuel and then they store all of it away as waste.
The reactor they are advocating uses that waste (which we have mega boat load worth's) as the primary fuel source converting it into something that can't be used for weapons. It is also a walk away and ignore design.
Definitely something we should do ASAP!!!!
Nuclear is dead in CA. The direction is solar and all new homes built in CA must have solar panels installed, various sized systems are options. Just this past month, CA took an ax to natural gas. All new homes starting in 2023 will not have natural gas, only electricity.
Between the solar panel and all electric homes starting 2023, the die is cast for the rest of the century.
Quote from: windtrader on June 05, 2021, 07:31:10 PM
...Between the solar panel and all electric homes starting 2023, the die is cast for the rest of the century.
The die is never fully cast.
My parents moved us to Dallas in the 70s. All the new homes there were being built electric only. That didn't last long, and natural gas returned to the scene.
California might be the outlier, but that will depend on a reliable source of electricity.
Quote from: windtrader on June 05, 2021, 07:31:10 PM
Nuclear is dead in CA. The direction is solar and all new homes built in CA must have solar panels installed, various sized systems are options. Just this past month, CA took an ax to natural gas. All new homes starting in 2023 will not have natural gas, only electricity.
Between the solar panel and all electric homes starting 2023, the die is cast for the rest of the century.
LOL I bet that pissed off the HOA's in CA,they need water more than electric generated by solar they have another drought now and will expect someone to bail the state out again.hay haulers here are running 24 hours a day to CA dairy products prices there are going to rise paying $300.00 a ton for hay,beef must already be exspensive in CA,they buy it by the pickup load here and take it back to CA
@Richard - CA is always the outlier. Being at the head of the pack often means running alone until the rest follow and catch up. You know the old say. As CA goes, so goes the country.
In the case of solar, that of course is far more variable as there are very sunny places and some not so sunny places. So places have consistent winds, some not so much.
@Clifford - prices for lots of stuff going up, not just beef. I don't know shiiite about cows but a few days ago I returned from the ranch up north near the Oregon border and there are lots of cows grazing in the pastures. So, at least some places they're eating cheap for now.
Drought is going to be terrible. Shasta Lake is the largest freshwater store and it is looking like the end of summer. They are even saying some reservoirs may get so low generators may go idle.
Fires are already breaking records this season. Going to be a very bad year for CA.
Wind mills and solar I don't get it then CA has one of the highest per kilowatts price in the nation
High demand high prices. Compared to the NE - CA shines when it comes to a general absence of toll ways... IMO
Quote from: dtcerrato on June 06, 2021, 07:27:34 AM
High demand high prices. Compared to the NE - CA shines when it comes to a general absence of toll ways... IMO
They don't have any land to build toll roads on but it is coming I heard it is nothing to see traffic backed up for 5 miles on CA freeways
The worse thing about CA I remember was the commute, if you asked me to meet you at the coffee shop around the corner from the job for breakfast, no matter what time you got there, I'd be there between 3:30 & 4AM sipping my coffee and trying to relax after working my way through all the traffic! Lol :^
LOL you guys are talking about Los Angeles area because that's what you see on TV. up north is a completely different state.....
There is plenty of land to build on up north and water at times generally every 6 years goes into drought because California relies on the snow pack melting into our lakes and it was pretty low these last couple of years. A certain amount has to be let out to keep the salt water from the ocean from coming into the rivers or it would change the ecosystem for the bad. And farmers need some of it to keep the crops going also.
At least California has trees and not just wind, sand, and a million Side by Sides running all over the landscape dust flying everywhere and the worst water in the world? LOL
lol Dave your funny CA is like Az only the northern part has trees and good water Ca has more desert and wind than Az the largest county in the US (San Bernardino) is nothing but a dust bowl and it gets just as HOT lol Needles was part of CA the last I checked.Five years ago on I 5 we were in stop and go traffic from Weed to Shasta for 75 miles on labor day weekend and it took 15 hours so don't try and tell me traffic is not bad up north
ya ... lets put all our eggs in 1 basket ( all electric power ) all might be good until its not . Not for me I like to have options and lots of them . This way there is always a back up plan .
dave
Quote from: luvrbus on June 06, 2021, 01:12:57 PM
Five years ago on I 5 we were in stop and go traffic from Weed to Shasta for 75 miles on labor day weekend and it took 15 hours so don't try and tell me traffic is not bad up north
Think you asked me once, told you to stay away from that Weed ;D
Weed to Shasta - I'm on that section a couple times a month now and there is nothing inherent to create any sort of backup like that on a regular basis. I think both towns total 20k people on a 4 lane interstate.
There are large freeway projects that do reduce lanes for long periods of time. The current one is one lane heading into Oregon going north on the 5. Remember, this area gets lots of snow and bad weather so the construction activity is done during the three seasons.
Tolls are a reality in CA, both north and south. What the Bay Area has going starting maybe 7 years ago is demand based tolls.
The more busy the roads are and the more people want to get from point A to point B faster, you get into the HOV/toll number 1 lane and go. Look up at the board and pay what is posted, keep looking as it changes when it figures out lots of folks want to go faster, cost more. The fewer cars the lower the charge.
There are no dedicated toll lanes like LA where entire sections of highway are toll only and 24/7.
Dave is right about the north though. It is still possible to make unplanned trips after 7pm and before 4:30am. All other times you need to consider traffic. But is better than LA where traffic jams are aplenty at 3am
that will get fixed. Theyll outlaw cattle raising soon. Too much methane interfering with their clean air plans.
Quote from: luvrbus on June 06, 2021, 01:12:57 PM
lol Dave your funny CA is like Az only the northern part has trees and good water Ca has more desert and wind than Az the largest county in the US (San Bernardino) is nothing but a dust bowl and it gets just as HOT lol Needles was part of CA the last I checked.Five years ago on I 5 we were in stop and go traffic from Weed to Shasta for 75 miles on labor day weekend and it took 15 hours so don't try and tell me traffic is not bad up north
Well it was Labor day you said and the holidays are always packed why because all the people that don't live there like Arizonians and out of towners come up to the mountain to breath or smoke the WEED, and yes Lower California which up in Northern California don't consider part of the actual state is somewhat barren but they have something AZ doesn't have and that my friend is an ocean. Which you may soon have if and when they have the big one. LOL