Hi there.
I have an '84 MCI Mc9. She runs ok but I feel like there might be some e gine power issues. I'd like to bring her somewhere for a once over... 8v71. Any recommendations for bus friendly mechanics in Florida, Georgia, even Alabama? Say 5-6 hour radius of Gainesville.
Thanks.
What kind of power issues. Someone here might be able to help or give good advice etc. :)
You can try Lewis Bus Line in Augusta Ga. If they can't get to it get the phone number for Toe Jo in Augusta.
Jack
Make sure all air and fuel filters are clean, this can rob the engine of serious power. I gained 10mph going up hills because of a dirty fuel/water separator. Check all filters first, it will blow your mind how much of a power difference it can make.
After a lot of asking around on this forum and other research...the current theory is that the mechanical governor might be getting intermittently stuck. Removing the air filter totally (and temprarily) didn't have an immediate effect. I have the rare Fortune of having 2 totally separate fuel systems (Diesel and vegetable oil) so I can eliminate most fuel related issues up to the pump...which was replaced 20k ago.
Other theories that have been discussed are a leak in the air box which I believe someone on this forum told me would cause smoke...which doesn't seem to be happening. Another thing I have been told, by the original owner, was that due to the vegetable oil I would need to occasionally have 'the injector screens cleaned'. I'm pretty handy but I think getting in to the injectors and/or messing with the governor may be a bit outside of my skill level.
That being said...I'm more than happy to do any kind of recommended tests or procedures to try and diagnose or fix it.
I need to take the bus access the South to California in a month which I'm not to worried about because it's mostly flat. Real issue is on hills.
I suspect that your problem has been caused by using vegetable oil. It works, but it leaves deposits. It may end up that you did not save any money after all. :o
Well. I paid $8k for the bus with the veg system already installed and have saved about $20k in Diesel so...
That being said. If it was deposits from vegetable oil...
A) Couldn't the injectors be replaced/cleaned.
B) Would the problem be intermittent? Ie...sometimes the power seems to be fine. It comes and goes...and not gradually. Sometimes I'm doing 50 up hills...sometimes it's 20 up a similar grade. It's all or nothing.
Are injector screens a real thing? And are they easily accessible to inspect?
Your fuel filters should be keeping the fluid clean enough for the injectors, I would change them often. I don't know about injector screens, but I doubt they would be finer than the secondary filter. Does your loss of power occur when the temperatures are cooler, and happen less when it is warmer? The last trucking company I worked for forbade us from using bio-diesel because of problems. Using straight cooking oil has got to be more trouble, but if you managed to save a lot of money, and you are not in a hurry, it works out. Are you able to switch from one fuel type to the other while moving? Maybe that way you get up the mountains on diesel, and then switch. Diesel or cooking oil, if the filters are clogged, you lose a lot of power. ;)
Saw an ad for Draine's Diesel in Scottsboro Alabama Ph. 256-337-4171. Don't know anything about them, don't know how far they are from you.
Try at a large marina. Lots of Detroits around yet in larger boats. They should have useful contacts.
I has a vegetable oil/WVO conversion done on my Ford PowerStroke which is now marketed as a conversion kit name VegiStroke.
The basics to running waste vegetable oil is that when you heat it to above 160 degrees it is the same viscosity of diesel at zero.
The design philosophy behind the VegiStroke system is to never run WVO on a cold engine and purge it from the engine before shutdown. Something about the coking tendency to more happen if the engine is cold.
In the design they used check valves and two different pressure regulators. The WVO system was at a higher pressure, so if anything went wrong with the WVO system it would automatically revert to diesel. (Electric fuel pumps were required.)
I did the conversion as an attempt at being a bit green/environmental thing as the truck was my daily driver, shortly after the conversion we moved our office and it was now only three miles away. So the truck didn't have much time that it could run WVO.
It does tend to make the exhaust smell like an overheated french fryer at stop lights(grin).
It produces a bit less horse power, so you put your foot a bit more into the throttle.
I then brought a Tesla, so the truck never makes long trips anymore, just runs to the dump.
The sourcing side was a bit problematic to find reliable sources that are not already being serviced by the biodiesel producers.
I did make a 2400 mile trip once on $22.00 of WVO once...
If you are collecting it you need to heat it first and then run it through a 5 micron filter.
The best oil came from Chinese restaurants, though I never tried to collect while on the road.
That is really good information. I have several powerstroke pickups, but I had always heard that the original International V-8 6.9L & 7.3L IDI engines where better at handling cooking oils. Heating and filtering the oil makes sense, but that adds to the cost of using it, and since there is some demand for it, it might not be free anymore. I still wonder if it is a good idea for bigger engines like a Series 60.
Starting about 4 years ago Disney tested some of there buses on biodiesel. For the past 2 years all of the buses over 400 have been on biodiesel. I was told it was made from chicken fat ( don't know if this was correct) but for sure they only use biodiesel.
Todays engines will only support about 20% Bio Fuel,it is highly processed with alcohol not the mom and pop version,These new high pressure fuel systems 20 to 30,000 psi can do more bio fuel than the old 65 psi like on the 2 strokes my ISX Cummins says no more than 20% Bio fuel fwiw
I looked at making biodiesel https://www.utahbiodieselsupply.com/makeyourownfuel.php (https://www.utahbiodieselsupply.com/makeyourownfuel.php) and you have to do a bunch more steps using methanol plus lye and then you have to separate the waste glycerin out.
So at the time concluded just burn it directly.
I haven't looked into it recently, however do hear that the supply is much tighter out there.
https://www.livesmallridefree.com/blog/the-end-of-wvo-for-us (https://www.livesmallridefree.com/blog/the-end-of-wvo-for-us)
Quote from: freds on February 23, 2020, 08:05:51 AM
I looked at making biodiesel https://www.utahbiodieselsupply.com/makeyourownfuel.php (https://www.utahbiodieselsupply.com/makeyourownfuel.php) and you have to do a bunch more steps using methanol plus lye and then you have to separate the waste glycerin out.
So at the time concluded just burn it directly.
I haven't looked into it recently, however do hear that the supply is much tighter out there.
https://www.livesmallridefree.com/blog/the-end-of-wvo-for-us (https://www.livesmallridefree.com/blog/the-end-of-wvo-for-us)
PS. Just checked craigslist and a local guy is giving away 900 gallons and one state away someone else is selling virgin oil for $1.50 a gallon.
We sell our waste oil from the restaurants here in the Phoenix area they supply the tamper proof tanks and steam clean the area after pickup each time.They have a processing plant where it is processed to Western Refinery specs before Western buys it, quite the operation to meet all the state. EPA and county environmental laws.I have seen tanker loads of alcohol hauled in for the process the ratio I have no idea what it is
Quote from: freds on February 23, 2020, 08:18:16 AM
PS. Just checked craigslist and a local guy is giving away 900 gallons and one state away someone else is selling virgin oil for $1.50 a gallon.
Where are you located?
FredS,
I ran Straight Vegetable Oil (SVO) in my 1998 VW Jetta TDI for several years, until 1) my commute dropped to only 22 miles each way, and 2) SVO got a lot harder to find after the GOV mandated that all diesel had to contain Biodiesel. SVO went from being a waste that restaurant owners had to pay to have removed to a income stream that Biodesel manufacturers were paying for!
I don't think I could find enough free, and or low priced enough today to make economic sense.
The keys to successful use are 1) filtration of the SVO down to the under 5 micron level, 2) using heated oil after the engine is warm, and 3) purging the lines back to the SVO tank with diesel about 5 minutes prior to shutdown to clean everything out.
My Jetta ran great on it for about 3 years @ 105 miles per day/ 5 days/week.
I have a pretty regular supply. It's works great for me and I save a ton. I was just curious where you live because if there is someone with 900 gallons free I'd like to stock up.
I'm a food vendor at music festivals...all of the other vendors gladdly give me their oil at the end of the weekend. It's only 3 days old and I'm getting it immediately after being 350 degrees....so there is not water.
Unfortunately...that source and my whole job has dried up for the time being...but I don't have to travel so I don't really need any 😆
But if I can hit a gold mine everyone in a while it wakes the beginning of the season a lot easier...whenever that will be.
With old DDs you only have to filter to 10mic ...the system was professionally installed years ago...but that's what the guy told me. It's got prob 250k of veg miles on it.
The veg in my system is actually heated at 5 different places. The system was designed from the ground up to be used in any weather/conditions. I've run veg in 20 below...just took a little longer for the veg in the tank to actually melt :)
WVO sure makes a mess of the fuel tank on buses they are nasty from the return if tied into the tank
The veg and diesel tanks have separate send and return lines with separate controls. They branch off about a foot before and after the engine. I should probably wait a few seconds before switching the return lines when going from veg to diesel but I do not.
So, when I switch to diesel, the amount of vegetable oil from the fuel pump to the other other side of the engine, that isn't used by the engine could go in to the diesel tank. Maybe somebody could venture to estimate how much volume that is...but it's already filtered...and getting dissolved into 20-100 gallons of diesel fuel. I also only do that switch once or twice per day of driving. Do you think it would make that much of a mess? I've been in there with an endoscope...and it looks pretty clean in there. Now the inside/outside of the veg tank and that whole luggage compartment...that's a whole 'nother story...holy crap is that a big sticky polymerized mess :)
Quote from: TheHeavenlyChillbillies on March 22, 2020, 05:13:06 PM
I have a pretty regular supply. It's works great for me and I save a ton. I was just curious where you live because if there is someone with 900 gallons free I'd like to stock up.
I'm a food vendor at music festivals...all of the other vendors gladdly give me their oil at the end of the weekend. It's only 3 days old and I'm getting it immediately after being 350 degrees....so there is not water.
Unfortunately...that source and my whole job has dried up for the time being...but I don't have to travel so I don't really need any 😆
But if I can hit a gold mine everyone in a while it wakes the beginning of the season a lot easier...whenever that will be.
With old DDs you only have to filter to 10mic ...the system was professionally installed years ago...but that's what the guy told me. It's got prob 250k of veg miles on it.
The filters inside the injector filter at 5 micron's and veggie fuel takes a toll on those over time
So do you think cleaning or replacing the injectors may help with power issues?
How hard of a task is that is that on a 8v71...I've replaced injectors on a Ford IDI in the past.