Any one heard if the RV with a 2 stroke engine is still going to be exempt with CARBS new rulings BS ,only answer I can get from the dumba** I spoke with is anything over 14,000 has to be CARB compliance
I've not heard any change to the smog exeptions for already exempt, titled, and registered old bus conversions.
https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/?1dmy&urile=wcm:path:/dmv_content_en/dmv/vr/smogfaq (https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/?1dmy&urile=wcm:path:/dmv_content_en/dmv/vr/smogfaq)
Does my vehicle qualify for a smog exemption?Smog inspections are required unless your vehicle is:Gasoline powered 1975 year model or older
- Diesel powered 1997 year model and older or with a Gross Vehicle Weight rating (GVWR) of more than 14,000 lbs
- Electric
- Natural gas powered with a GVWR rating of more than 14,000 lbs.
- Motorcycle
There is this reference that might be related to your question
https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/onrdiesel/onrdiesel.htm
I believe diesel motorhome/bus conversion registrations list the GVW as all 0000's, which makes them exempt.
AX and unladen weight values are blank on my CA title for the MCI bus conversion. Type is MH
My friend in Needles just got the new regulations Wednesday by mail he has a 1999 KW toy hauler with RV plates and they are telling him his plates will not be renewed if he doesn't meet the CARB compliance by Jan 2020
A "toy hauler"? That would be like a pick up truck, only oversized. I am guessing your friend is not getting the same exceptions that a single unit motorhome gets. It just keeps him from stopping at the scales, but smog is the same as for a truck.
Looks like Commiefornia sees KW.
And stops there.
Cliff,
Maybe your friend can copy and send the sections of code that raises concern. Sort of seems like it would not affect our bus conversions.
It's not going to belong before CARB gets the 2 strokes in a RV the noose is already around their neck ,farmers cannot have one to pump water with,construction equipment is a no,no generators the same,and no 2 strokes in marine use around the docks ::) RV's are next or they will have a huge fee to run one.Texas is getting to be a PITA also with the DD 2 strokes
What about all those old smoke belching Macks?
According to carb, all 2004 and older deisels in the state of California 14,000 lbs to 26,000lbs including busses must be repowered by 2020 to be elegible for dmv registration. Anything over 26,000lbs its 2000 and older needs a repower. There is a low mile exemption for vehicles driven less than 1k miles annualy. Already exempt vehicles remain exempt. My bus is registered as a "house car" and has no weight listed. Hopefully there are so few of us we remain exepmt, they are currently going after commercial operators.
Matt
It is not just California who go by these laws, read below, LOL
The states that have adopted the California standards are: Colorado, Connecticut, Delaware, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New Mexico (2011 model year and later), New York, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, Vermont, and Washington, as well as the District of Columbia.
Current carb letter
If it's registered as a motorhome, do they still consider it a bus or truck? If so, soubds like lots of class A motorhomes built on Freightliner chassis will be getting a letter.
RVs are not registered by GVWR and are currently exempt. Us bus owners can also resister it as an Historical Vehicle which would also currently exempt us.
Matt
You don't need to be an MIT grad to see all states listed are BLUE states.>>>Dan ( And they follow Calmexfornia like lemmings)
I hear Cedar City is a great place for future displaced Califonia converted coach owners.
Quote from: Beluga Bus on May 25, 2019, 11:58:46 AM
RVs are not registered by GVWR and are currently exempt. Us bus owners can also resister it as an Historical Vehicle which would also currently exempt us.
Matt
Doesn't CA limit the miles driven with a vehicle with Historical Plates ? some states don't give much wiggle room for mileage with Historical or Antique plates
You could do much worse Matt.>>>Dan ( Oh wait you already have!) ::)
Historical plates are limited to travel to historical exibitions, parades, and historical club meets, no milage limit. I could show all my travels fall into one of these catagories, seems like where ever I park my bus it's a historical exibition, lol.
Matt
Are any of the RV groups still watching this closely and advocating appropriately?
One of the only reasons left to belong, is to support their advocacy.
You can believe there is a civil servant desperate to change one little word to capture everything.
The vigilance is in keeping tabs on those sneaky attempts to ruin everything for us.
Those who operate under an exemption which they do not understand are sitting ducks.
Get smart and get your words right. We do not operate buses.
happy coaching!
buswarrior
Quote from: Utahclaimjumper on May 25, 2019, 01:55:29 PM
You could do much worse Matt.>>>Dan ( Oh wait you already have!) ::)
Thats my neighbor, :) was that you using politics to make some kind of point?
Hey Dan thats a personal attach isn't it. Something in the rules on that. :o
I don't "attack" my friends Dave. But I will jab them occasionaly..>>>Dan ;D
Dan re read what I wrote, I was teasing you's too...
"Hey Dan that's a personal attach"
That's one of the many problems with the written word,, it can be interpeted many ways. But I do love your logo.>>>D ( Is'nt that political??)
Nice to have friends and neighbors here, but putting politics aside we are all sitting ducks in California.
I lived in the state for 28 years,, the problem is the sitting part....No group or party should be in total control.>>>Dan
Quote from: Utahclaimjumper on May 25, 2019, 08:24:30 PM
But I do love your logo.>>>D ( Is'nt that political??)
Nope just for Information for both sides. Wouldn't it stop a lot of today's nonsense and maybe people would vote appropriately.
To quote California-"Diesel powered 1997 year model and older or with a GVW of more than 14,000lbs are exempt."
Quote from: buswarrior on May 25, 2019, 05:00:11 PM
Are any of the RV groups still watching this closely and advocating appropriately?
One of the only reasons left to belong, is to support their advocacy.
You can believe there is a civil servant desperate to change one little word to capture everything.
The vigilance is in keeping tabs on those sneaky attempts to ruin everything for us.
Those who operate under an exemption which they do not understand are sitting ducks.
Get smart and get your words right. We do not operate buses.
happy coaching!
buswarrior
BW - That's a great idea/ The key task would be to find out the special interest that was behind getting CA CARB to exempt the 2 stroke bus conversions that are currently in effect in Calif.
Just a guess but being FMCA started in Maine many many years a go and originally was only Bus Conversions
And many Bus Clubs as the Northwest Busnuts and Western GM's, Southwest and southeast Busnuts are all sanctioned by them as well as Coach.net also asks you to have an affiliate with one being FMCA. And they get into heavy lobbying for RV parks, Rallys, RV equipment, as well as Conversions be it Truck or Buses. There are over 3600+ Bus Conversions across the country and who knows how many trucks as well as Tiny Homes etc and of course Sticks and staples. IMHO ;)
Dave,, I believe FMCA started in 1963 at Hincley, Maine by 26 attendee's of a "house Car" gathering.>>>D
Yep I remember Dan in reading the story but could not remember the details. Thanks. That is why there is still a Bus on their Logo too. :D
Quote from: Dave5Cs on May 27, 2019, 04:18:28 PM
Yep I remember Dan in reading the story but could not remember the details. Thanks. That is why there is still a Bus on their Logo too. :D
Money changed that lol I hear tents are next,FWIW the first FMCA number issued the guy didn't own any type bus or RV coach but there was a lot of motor homes in that first gathering looking at the photos
No different than any other organization that gets top heavy and needs more income to survive
Double post
Didn't some of the guys at the original Custom coach have something to do with things?
There are no Custom Coach owners listed in the original gathering in the first numbers issued there ,but there is a CCC a MCI 2 and the CCC doesn't represent Custom Coach in the book,they are listed by makes lot of Fords and Flx's
Kirwan Elmers, son of Miles Elmers, was there. "His 1963 35-foot Marmon-Herrington demo was the only commercially built motorhome there", according to the History of Custom Coach. I almost bought a coach from Kirwan in 1996, but he wanted too much for it, in relation to my budget. It was a solid MCI coach with lead sheets and cork panels sandwiched into the floor, but it turned out I liked Eagles more. :D
So, there's no FMCA members present who know if the organization stays ahead of the legislative goings on of California with regard to emissions exemptions for recreational vehicles?
Advocacy requires being at the table before and during... not after the deed is done.
And having a membership roll large enough that the legislators pay attention...
So, I need to renew my lapsed membership... conditional that they still pay close attention to all matters political about RV rights... how many of the rest of us need to hold our noses and pay them to advocate?
Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
Quote from: DoubleEagle on May 27, 2019, 06:50:43 PM
Kirwan Elmers, son of Miles Elmers, was there. "His 1963 35-foot Marmon-Herrington demo was the only commercially built motorhome there", according to the History of Custom Coach....
I knew that someone from CC was involved, just couldn't remember his name.
Quote from: buswarrior on May 27, 2019, 07:16:44 PM
So, there's no FMCA members present who know if the organization stays ahead of the legislative goings on of California with regard to emissions exemptions for recreational vehicles?...
Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
Theoretically FMCA still does lobby on behalf of the industry and on behalf of RV owners. I have not been involved in leadership or paid much attention to that segment of the game though, so I can't tell you how much this is done now. Last year the membership voted to accept all RV owners to the group, not just those with self-powered motor homes, so any lobbying efforts will be watered down to accommodate an even wider membership base.
Since the vast majority of FMCA members have fairly modern motor homes with only a handful of bus conversions still in use, I'd be surprised if lobbying on behalf of owners of 2-stroke powered rigs takes priority at all.
Now days FMCA lobbies for nothing Insurance is their gig now with overpriced conventions ,yea I belong to FMCA
Don't forget tire discounts!😏
It is always so funny how not many of you are from California who complain all the time, but seem to know all the negatives (in your views) about it and how it is so evil. So most don't care because of the weather the beaches, the diversity etc.
Come visit and see what you are missing. If nothing else maybe your blood pressures will go down, LOL :)
LOL your blood pressure is not going down driving on the 405 or any other 5 in the LA area or 10 ,it is a beautiful state
Since the vast majority of FMCA members have fairly modern motor homes with only a handful of bus conversions still in use, I'd be surprised if lobbying on behalf of owners of 2-stroke powered rigs takes priority at all.
The most likely outcome from any pending regulations that affect old diesel powered bus conversions is simply lack of awareness of this tiny community that benefits from the CA exemption. Not knowing when the discussions were going on during the "diesel is evil campaigns" but estimate twenty years ago or so placing it during the peak of the baby boomer let's convert a bus heyday.
Currently it's fair to say there is far less of that movement today, far fewer buses being converted, or bus conversions spending time on the road. It seems probable that whatever happens to us with CARB is going to be whim of the pen rather than any concerted effort, discussions, or informed decision making. We're like a leaf blowing in the wind.
Piggybacking on the current "tiny home" doesn't seem a fit as the reality is they are not self powered and that's the core consideration for us.
That said, it would still be worthwhile to track down and understand the current state of any CARB rulemaking that affects us.
Don again it is not only California as was said before. It all comes down to there is not enough of us for them to care. They don't make older cars even the ones that are rebuilt with the old engines be CARB compliant. So CARB says it is all about cleaner air. But if that was really the case it would be cheap solar for everyone and electric cars everywhere.
It makes politicians likable to some( Not me) and some people think they really care about the air etc. As far as our Buses they don't care and as long as they are RV's and not commercial where they can charge huge taxes both for the trucking companies to change out engines or whole fleets of equipment. It makes money for the dealers, jobs for the builders on the engines tranny etc. as well as local and state with all new registrations, parts manufacturers, tire manufacturers even Junk yards..
Look at our roads in California they have to be close to the worst as in I 10 in Arizona. Money from taxes years ago was suppose to go to fixing them and instead they transferred the money to general funds so they could fund their little programs so they get voted into office in their districts.
So why worry about it. It won't change anything and just enjoy our coaches and if and when it happens we park them and take them to the scrapper when the price of metal goes up.
Life goes on and Clifford will always bring up something he doesn't like about California just to piss you and me off and make you spend hours copying and paste all the facts you can find. LOL :)
So take your bus on a trip and try to stay on the road this time, LOL. ;D
And Clifford The 405 is that other state and our Bus doesn't like to go that way. From a Northerner. 8)
LOL CARB has you by the balls Dave they just haven't squeezed yet,their emission rules are drifting into AZ slowly on pleasure boats here on the river, New CARB rules now are the 2 strokes emission sticker for the year it was manufactured is required at the DMV in CA if you bring a bus or RV into the state those have been gone for years on the engine valve cover lol I sell a lot of valve covers now if they have the sticker
Been 35 years since I lived in L.A. Definitely some nice things about it, traffic wasn't one. Went back to San Diego on vacation a year or two ago, that was nice. Had a real good time.
Glad I got the 4 stroke. People will always want to tell you what to do. Why is that? Don't they have enough to do with their own business? I sure do.
Jim
Clifford it's time to get over it, I don't care. :)
What sticker? The retrofit one?
Quote from: Dave5Cs on May 28, 2019, 08:17:17 AM
It is always so funny how not many of you are from California who complain all the time, but seem to know all the negatives (in your views) about it and how it is so evil. So most don't care because of the weather the beaches, the diversity etc.
Come visit and see what you are missing. If nothing else maybe your blood pressures will go down, LOL :)
I like LA. Not quite N.Y.C. but it will do. Always plenty of opportunity to take touristy roadside pictures with out getting out of the bus. :D
Quote from: Geoff on May 28, 2019, 05:21:55 PM
What sticker? The retrofit one?
No the data plate on the valve cover that states what year the DD meet the federal or CA emission's, I figure they are looking to see if it meets CA standards for that year but who knows, they also want to see the safety standard plate for the chassis why they need that is anyones guess this went into affect Jan 1 2019
Quote from: Dave5Cs on May 28, 2019, 04:57:34 PM
Clifford it's time to get over it, I don't care. :)
I'll give you a break for a while Dave,Sonja is in Valley View so I am kind of bored anyways , before I go it may be just rumor but Steve at NAPA in Needles told me you need a prescription now to buy ammo in CA
Hope she is OK we will continue positive thoughts for her.
On another note I found out I am running at only 40% and have been told to slow down a little. Momma has me on all kinds of heart stuff. I hate getting old. :)
Getting old beats the alternative. Hope you are better soon.
Quote from: Dave5Cs on May 29, 2019, 07:37:55 AMHope she is OK we will continue positive thoughts for her.
On another note I found out I am running at only 40% and have been told to slow down a little. Momma has me on all kinds of heart stuff. I hate getting old. :)
Good thoughts and best wishes for Sonja from me, too, Clifford. And I've been riding the cardiac ferris wheel myself lately, Dave, so I'm wishing you the best, too. (PS Ain't my favorite ride at the fairground.)
Quote from: luvrbus on May 28, 2019, 10:08:39 PM
Steve at NAPA in Needles told me you need a prescription now to buy ammo in CA
I do not know if things have changed again since last year, but when I bought ammo then you could still just order it online. However, it could not be sent to you directly; it had to go to a licensed firearms dealer for you to pick up. A local place charges $10. to receive it for you. It's kind of ridiculous but could be, and probably will be, worse.
It would also be illegal for us to buy ammo in AZ or NV and bring it home.
When I used to hunt many years ago I made my own. What are they doing about that?
Clifford PM'd you also... :)
Bruce sorry to hear you too. It started with me slowing down when I retired. I still work at my buddies ranch where we live. He had to go in yesterday and get his 4th Stent. He was 95 % blocked. He had two 14 years ago and started plugging up again. This time they went in from his wrist to the heart in stead of the groin. They had him done in 45 minutes.
Mine was I started noticing I was gasping for breath a lot and just thought it was because I was overweight. They said yep that's part of it but the pain in your back is the tired Heart not being able to help the Kidney to function and it radiates pain in the back. No chest pain so I thought it was my back out again. Also found out I have a trapped Hiatel Hernia. Which means the stomach end is trapped like a ballon through my diaphram and will soon drop back down as I lose the weight. :)Dam and that is the pain in front left side just below the ribs.
So have fixed the breathing by walking each day 1 to 2 miles and it helped the heart also a lot.
Quote from: Dave5Cs on May 29, 2019, 07:37:55 AM
Hope she is OK we will continue positive thoughts for her.
On another note I found out I am running at only 40% and have been told to slow down a little. Momma has me on all kinds of heart stuff. I hate getting old. :)
Nothing wrong with her heart Dave the blood pressure 240/105 scares the hell out of me I know it is just a matter of time it does affect her heart keep on praying for her she is such a good person
Best wishes to Sonja and Clifford to you also. Dave you can do it, just eat half of whatever you normally do, like just the bottom half of the bun on your hamburger, works for me.
I personally don't think our hobby is dwindling in population. It might here and there, but on social media, there's many sites with inter city Conversions, schoolies and truck Conversions, even have seen other types, some that I have never seen before. The DDs may be dwindling from the amount coming into our price range, like after the CA restrictions of 2 strokes, of the recent past, but these buses in service aren't all going to the shredder. And the young converters I see in the different medias, are going to want to upgrade, just as many of us did. So I don't see the end of our hobby, as some do...
"CA restrictions of 2 strokes" is only for commercial units. which most have been changed, destroyed or sold in other states.
Quote from: Dave5Cs on May 29, 2019, 01:09:19 PMBruce sorry to hear you too. It started with me slowing down when I retired. ...
Yeah, that's what got me too, I think. But the quack says that he's got good news for me -- I'll die of something else if I'm at least a little smart about my heart. I have the esophageal stuff, too - runs in the family but they have that calmed down with good meds.
Quote from: Dave5Cs on May 29, 2019, 01:09:19 PMSo have fixed the breathing by walking each day 1 to 2 miles and it helped the heart also a lot.
My 96-year-old aunt recently left us. Two weeks before she developed pneumonia, she was living alone and taking care of herself - even managing diabetes for 15 years. She got her driver's license renewed on her 94th birthday - then handed it back to the examiner and said "I wanted to see if I could do it, but traffic is just too crazy and frustrating so I'm going to stop driving", then she walked three blocks home. She would always tell me "you have to keep going, if you stop, you won't be able to get up and go any more". Best wishes for you keepin' goin', too, Dave.
Matter of fact, I wish everyone here to have the best health and best life you can for here on out.