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Bus Discussion => Bus Topics ( click here for quick start! ) => Topic started by: momentum on April 29, 2019, 12:04:23 PM

Title: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: momentum on April 29, 2019, 12:04:23 PM
Hi all,
I am pleased to have found this active community of busnuts. I recently picked up a 4106 and drove it about 8 miles before experiencing some clutch issues (understatement). I pulled the trans and found some demolished bearings on the input shaft, and lots of ugly debris in the pan. I topped up the transmission oil before driving, so I suspect I just had the privelage of grinding away at damage that began before i 'rescued' her.

I think the most sensible way forward would be to find a whole replacement unit to swing in, as I am afraid I'll find more problems with this one (not to mention the very visible fact that the input shaft and bevel gears are pretty beat up).

Any help out there? With all the alisons driving around in these buses, maybe there's a spicer collecting dust. I live on the western slope of colorado and unfortunately have a pretty limited cashflow for this project right now. My hope and dream is to find an inexpensive replacement within a day's drive. Here's to the power of positive thinking... any help?

Here's a video I uploaded of the mess: https://youtu.be/Vba-tzry0Mg

Thanks for reading!
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: daddysgirl on April 29, 2019, 12:43:07 PM
Hello and WELCOME...to the wonderful jungle  8)

I'm sorry I am of no help for your current dilemma...but methinks the previous owner (PO) should have had a automatic.

But you'll get many helpful suggestions, I just wanted to say hi.
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: luvrbus on April 29, 2019, 12:47:25 PM
Check on the Western GMC board Larry,Dan and Mikey will know of 1 Red Ryder (Mike) may have a old one you could take the 2 and build 1 good one
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: momentum on April 29, 2019, 01:18:00 PM
Y'all are pretty fast. Thanks for the comments. Luvrbus, can you give me a little more help finding the western GMC board? Haven't been able to find my way there, wherever it is.
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: luvrbus on April 29, 2019, 01:45:37 PM
I think it's Western GM Coach
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: chessie4905 on April 29, 2019, 03:54:41 PM
Would a transmission from a 4905 work?
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: momentum on April 29, 2019, 04:18:58 PM
Chessie, I don't know enough yet to be sure if it'll work, have you got one to spare? The trans in the 4106 is a 7145VE.
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: Dave5Cs on April 29, 2019, 04:39:06 PM
http://www.westerngmcoach.com/
:)
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: chessie4905 on April 29, 2019, 05:09:23 PM
My nephew has one in a H8H-649 (4905) he is dismantling. But Pa. is a long ways from you. 4905's have a wet clutch, btw. Some don't like wet clutches on GM's.
Also, now would be a good time to consider a V-730 while they are still available. The cost to change would be gotten back when you sell the coach in the future. Nobody likes manual transmissions much anymore.
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: Utahclaimjumper on April 29, 2019, 05:10:37 PM
 Westerngmcoach is no longer supported and dead.>>>D ( The trans that Mikey HAD,, is now junk and went to the killers.)>>>  Anyone that removes springs from the pressure plate is nuts, many "mousetraps" can still be found and work well if adjusted properly.>>>D
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: Utahclaimjumper on April 29, 2019, 05:18:00 PM

double post
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: momentum on April 30, 2019, 06:38:10 AM
Thanks for the stream of info. It sounds like there's one in Massachusetts, so there's a freight bill. Anyone know the weight of these v drive 7145 trannies? I'd guess 400# or so but thats a SWAG.

I recognize the wisdom of upgrading to the auto, but right now I have to do everything at bare minimum expense. Plus, I do appreciate fuel economy.

I do still have the mousetrap! I am looking forward to adjusting it carefully and feeling the clutch pedal as light as the one in my Jetta. Maybe, maybe not.

For now it seems logical to stick with the dry clutch and not build too much of a Frankenstein out of rare parts. What are the common complaints against the wet clutch?

How common are failures of this manual box? I can expect reliable service once she's back together and consistently full of oil, right?
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: Utahclaimjumper on April 30, 2019, 07:25:49 AM
 Don't be tempted to install a wet clutch or a "button" clutch,, the old standard heavy duty two plate will do nicely and easier on the driveline.  The crashbox is very reliable,, most folks don.t know how many miles have been run thru the trans so they just keep going until something breaks.  In todays world few owners are professional drivers, so transmissions and clutches get hammered with out mercy.. When I first drove a 4106 , 28 years ago,, I drove from southern Utah to northern Idaho and return over a period of one week.. The coach was bone stock,, and I had a blister the size of a gulf ball in the palm of my right hand,,and an education.>>>Dan
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: luvrbus on April 30, 2019, 07:57:44 AM
What was you doing with right hand Dan ?
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: lostagain on April 30, 2019, 08:01:37 AM
Manipulating his stick, evidently, lol.

JC
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: Utahclaimjumper on April 30, 2019, 04:22:10 PM
 Anyone who has driven a 4106, with a standard trans, underpowered 8V71, over the back roads of Idaho,,has the left hand on the wheel,, the left foot on the clutch,, the right foot on the accelerator,, and the right hand will be making blisters on that damn  shifter... You don.t have time for much else.>>>Dan :o ::)
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: momentum on May 01, 2019, 01:42:46 PM
Wait, underpowered?! I thought this thing was supposed to be a sports car!   ;D

Another question in the interim for those who have gone before me: how much wear on the clutch release finger "buttons" is too much? Mine are definitely smaller than factory. I have the book but I must have missed the wear spec.
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: richard5933 on May 01, 2019, 01:52:20 PM
Quote from: momentum on May 01, 2019, 01:42:46 PM
Wait, underpowered?! I thought this thing was supposed to be a sports car!   ;D

As compared to other buses, not to actual sports cars.
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: momentum on May 01, 2019, 01:56:18 PM
I'll show you! Time to bolt up that 8cyl EMD 645 in the back 40... (that's not real)
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: Utahclaimjumper on May 01, 2019, 02:28:59 PM
 An 8V71 is pretty good until it see's 6000 Ft. or higher,, then fades rapidly.>>>Dan ( Had one once at a ten percent grade at ten thousand Ft. and could walk faster that it would climb)
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: Geoff on May 01, 2019, 02:45:06 PM
Hey Dan, how about your propane booster?  Did it finally kill your engine?
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: luvrbus on May 01, 2019, 03:09:06 PM
Quote from: richard5933 on May 01, 2019, 01:52:20 PM
As compared to other buses, not to actual sports cars.


Maybe compared to a 4104  ;D
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: momentum on May 01, 2019, 03:42:32 PM
That's funny, I live at 6200 ft. My bus has a turbo on it, I hope this will help! Any experience with a turbo 8v71?
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: richard5933 on May 01, 2019, 03:45:22 PM
Quote from: luvrbus on May 01, 2019, 03:09:06 PM
Maybe compared to a 4104  ;D

Yeah - I think when people were calling it the 'sports car of buses' they were comparing it to all the (even more) under-powered buses that came before it.
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: luvrbus on May 01, 2019, 03:53:26 PM
LOL Matt has a 4-71 in his GM he makes up to Flagstaff every year from the low country takes him awhile but he gets there
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: Utahclaimjumper on May 01, 2019, 04:56:26 PM

Geoff,,,I sold that bus 10 years ago and the present owner is very happy with it.>>>Dan
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: Stormcloud on May 01, 2019, 07:34:37 PM
Western GM club is most certainly not dead, as previously erroneously reported in this thread. The club is alive and well, with President Paul replacing the 2018 sudden departure of previous president. Additional executive members also elected in January 2019, and even more new members joined at the annual Quartzsite gathering in January this year. If you can possible make it there next year, please join us.

Best of luck getting your coach mobile again. There can be a wealth of information and support on this forum.

Mark
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: luvrbus on May 01, 2019, 07:44:57 PM
Quote from: Stormcloud on May 01, 2019, 07:34:37 PM
Western GM club is most certainly not dead, as previously erroneously reported in this thread. The club is alive and well, with President Paul replacing the 2018 sudden departure of previous president. Additional executive members also elected in January 2019, and even more new members joined at the annual Quartzsite gathering in January this year. If you can possible make it there next year, please join us.

Best of luck getting your coach mobile again. There can be a wealth of information and support on this forum.

Mark

Good news Mark they are such a good group glad it is turning around for you guys
Title: Re: NEED A TRANS 4106 Spicer input shaft bearings munched!
Post by: Utahclaimjumper on May 02, 2019, 01:37:55 AM
 Slow down and read it again Mark,, it's the WEBSITE that's not operating. With no activity for over three years, it died from apathy.>>>Dan