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Bus Discussion => Bus Topics ( click here for quick start! ) => Topic started by: blue_goose on October 12, 2018, 02:49:22 PM

Title: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: blue_goose on October 12, 2018, 02:49:22 PM
Has anyone made this change and if so what did it take to make the upgrade?
Jack
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: chessie4905 on October 12, 2018, 03:15:06 PM
First thing you have to do is see if there is sufficient clearance between of end of dd3 and bulkhead. The shortest maxi brake chamber is approx 1 1/2 to 2 inches longer. You also need room to install the caging bolt to release them for towing. On GMC's, except for 4104, there isn't enough room. Body or mounting bracket surgery would be required.
In any case there will be valve, line, and other components removal, and rerouting of air lines at back.
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: ol713 on October 12, 2018, 04:34:22 PM

   Hi;
      Question;    Why would you consider this change?  If you rebuild your
      DD-3's,  they will be good for years and years.  That would mean no
      re-engineering the coach and less money required.
                                      Good luck,    Merle
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: luvrbus on October 12, 2018, 05:17:30 PM
Jack,never done a C but the spring brakes are 9 inches long,the C was a transition model if the C is like the D with out the air beam it is a easy change.Plumbing is nothing you use what you have just switching ports on the relay.If the C has a air beam like the older MCI there is not enough room without moving the brackets and longer S cams.You could check into the MGM that have a rotatable piggy back to get enough room maybe         
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: blue_goose on October 13, 2018, 05:52:08 AM
I have never spent any time working on changing anything on air brakes.  Did put new DD3's on my Eagle and replaced the brake pads. Didn't take any knowledge of how they worked to do that. 
We started to leave last week and when I got on the road the compressor wasn't keeping up with the air demand.  When I found a place to get off the road I found air coming out of the lower chamber of the brake air valve.  I thought the air valve was bad so on with a new one, what a job that was.  New E-10 valve and same problem.  Now I did more testing and found when the parking brake valve is off the air doesn't come out of the brake valve.  If it is only a parking brake problem with the DD3's the compressor should have been keeping my air up on the road. 
Well today I am going to get it on the ramps and see what I find in the rear.  If any of you have any idea's please post them here.
Jack
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: luvrbus on October 13, 2018, 06:08:32 AM
Jack,if you have room there is nothing to it,all it in-tales is reversing the air flow direction,spring brakes need a air supply to release and the DD-3 need air to set 
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: eagle19952 on October 13, 2018, 08:05:08 AM
Quote from: luvrbus on October 13, 2018, 06:08:32 AM
Jack,if you have room there is nothing to it,all it in-tales is reversing the air flow direction,spring brakes need a air supply to release and the DD-3 need air to set

Properly operating DD3's are better.
don't understand why anyone would want to convert.
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: luvrbus on October 13, 2018, 08:55:37 AM
Quote from: eagle19952 on October 13, 2018, 08:05:08 AM
Properly operating DD3's are better.
don't understand why anyone would want to convert.

Availability and price plus the DD-3 are only found on a bus so the price greatly reflects that ,Eagle have had spring brakes since the 80's fwiw
 
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: Geoff on October 13, 2018, 11:25:42 AM
Spring brakes are good with a manual transmission if you have to start going on a hill.
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: richard5933 on October 13, 2018, 11:32:15 AM
Quote from: Geoff on October 13, 2018, 11:25:42 AM
Spring brakes are good with a manual transmission if you have to start going on a hill.
Never having had spring brakes, could you explain?
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: Lee Bradley on October 13, 2018, 11:55:48 AM
You set the spring brakes. Select the gear you want, bring the clutch to the engage point and hit the brake release button, engage the clutch and roll away.
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: eagle19952 on October 13, 2018, 12:47:57 PM
Quote from: Geoff on October 13, 2018, 11:25:42 AM
Spring brakes are good with a manual transmission if you have to start going on a hill.

I guess. Hill holder brakes...
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: eagle19952 on October 13, 2018, 12:49:24 PM
Quote from: eagle19952 on October 13, 2018, 08:05:08 AM
Properly operating DD3's are better.
don't understand why anyone would want to convert.

IIRC Euclid used them too, way back when.
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: Sebulba on October 13, 2018, 12:51:53 PM
That is just what I was thinking --hill holders

Seb


Quote from: eagle19952 on October 13, 2018, 12:47:57 PM
I guess. Hill holder brakes...
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: richard5933 on October 13, 2018, 02:45:09 PM
O. IC. Did not know that. Guess it's not necessary to apply the service brakes to disengage the parking brake with spring brakes. That would be helpful.
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: luvrbus on October 13, 2018, 03:13:25 PM
Spring brakes uses a 1/3 of the parts found in a DD-3 chambers
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: windtrader on October 13, 2018, 06:43:11 PM
Quote from: luvrbus on October 13, 2018, 08:55:37 AM


Availability and price plus the DD-3 are only found on a bus so the price greatly reflects that ,Eagle have had spring brakes since the 80's fwiw

I've heard about this conversion. What is the general costs and labor to do the conversion?
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: blue_goose on October 14, 2018, 04:43:26 AM
After some checking I don't think there is enough room to use the spring brakes.  The end of the brake chamber is only about 2 in. from the air bag.  So now where can I find rebuild kits for the DD3's.
Jack
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: richard5933 on October 14, 2018, 05:21:14 AM
Call Luke at US Coach.
Title: Re: Converting 102c3 brakes from DD3 to spring brakes
Post by: luvrbus on October 14, 2018, 07:14:18 AM
MCI did have all the parts for the DD-3 ,if you have a WW Williams in your area you can order from MCI and pick the parts up at WW Williams for MCI's