Ok this is more of a gripe than anything else. Decided to install a nice pretty 12v light over the stove to replace the one that is missing a cover and doesn't work anyhow. When doing so I opened the storage area under the light to try and decipher the bundle of YELLOW wires. Yes all of the wires were yellow, mostly with splices and electrical tape. These are both the neg and positive. It took a few hour for my slightly round and large body to fit into a spot that was not designed for ME to fit in so that I can straighten some of that rats nest out.
For anyone that has decided to tackle a bus conversion please keep in mind that if your going to steal wire from work to use on your project STEAL DIFFERENT COLOR WIRES. Another thing powering three 12v lights can be done off of 1 positive and 1 negative and split off as needed rather than 3 sets of 10g wires. Especially if your going to run them all together into the cabinet that is too small for any normal size person to fit into then pit splices in the wires anyhow.
Finally I understand the stove is metal and makes a great ground, but if you already pulled a negative wire, set up a bus bar for your common wires to attach not the ONLY item in the house that is attached to the PROPANE. Lets leave that appliance out of the electrical circuit.
I have not even tackled the MAZE of plumbing. I think the builder got one hell of a deal on Yellow wire and PVC.
I am blaming the WIFE. She must have told him " OH baby, your doing such a great job and saving so much money doing everything your self, and stealing the supplies from work." when she should have said that doesn't look right you need to call Bob the Builder, or at least ask for help on the Bus Conversion Forum.
What bus you got, or should I say what coach?
When you do your own conversion you can do whatever you want. Someone down the line might curse you out, but is that your problem, or theirs?
A similar gripe of mine is wiring added with no documentation. We were lucky enough that our Custom Coach came to us from the PO with the original wiring diagrams done by Custom Coach as they did the conversion. As happens, changes were made over the years to a few systems, and of course no one bothered to make notes in the manual. Made it very confusing. At least they used red/black on mine for DC wiring - trouble was trying to figure out which red went to which fuse, etc. Not to mention trying to find the fuses, since who ever did the mods didn't think it wise to have the fuses all in one place.
As I've been going through correcting things I've done my best to document the wiring and then put new pages in the manual. Certainly this will help the next owner, but my head can't keep track of everything, so I'm sure that next year I'll have to look in the book myself to see what I did.
Thats a great point ya make
Any schematic even on scratch paper! Yep I agree
It would be a great addition to any coach build, remodel or any electrical R&R.
Heck many manual refferences only ever show a: description with wire number or letter. If lucky a location is real handy.
Good day
Floyd
I have an OCD with wiring and plumbing. Straight lines, not tangled, marked/ color coded/ or documented, can CUT to length. There is no need for 4 foot of wire to be ran back and forth because you cut it too long. Cut to length put on your connections.
Final appearance tells a lot about the work. If what is exposed looks bad, what does that tell you about what isn't exposed?
I understand that I have work to do to get it straightened out..I worry more that I will be the next one working on the couch rather than someone else and I don't want to have to sort through a rats next when I decide I want to add a light.
On a previous basement remodel, I added extra conduit and pull strings inside the walls, and above the ceiling, in the event that I would ever want to add something in the future.
consider this a must for these kinds of issues. 95% five star rating. good addition to your tool box along with their test lights- 12 and 24 volt, and continuity, and decent volt, amp, ohm meter. take time to read reviews on it.
https://www.harborfreight.com/catalogsearch/result/index/?dir=asc&order=EAScore%2Cf%2CEAFeatured+Weight%2Cf%2CSale+Rank%2Cf&q=wiring+tracer (https://www.harborfreight.com/catalogsearch/result/index/?dir=asc&order=EAScore%2Cf%2CEAFeatured+Weight%2Cf%2CSale+Rank%2Cf&q=wiring+tracer)
Always good to use different colored wire for DC. And unlike AC circuits, ground wire should be black. On AC circuits, common is white, ground is green. Good Luck, TomC
I like the system that "gumpy" uses with his wiring. He uses clear shrink wrap and inserts a label he prints on his computer before applying heat to the shrink wrap.The label is very self explainatory as to its function/origin/destination and REALLY takes the guess work away. Ive started to use that method myself but unfortunately should have started 30 years ago. :'(
Quote from: TomC on May 25, 2018, 07:37:38 AM
Always good to use different colored wire for DC. And unlike AC circuits, ground wire should be black. On AC circuits, common is white, ground is green. Good Luck, TomC
Marine custom is yellow for DC grounds. It makes a lot of sense. Black DC grounds running with Black AC hots leaves a lot of room for unpleasant surprises. Even if you just use 6 inches of yellow shrink on the ends of the grounds it can make things a lot more obvious a year from now when you have forgotten what you did today.
And then there the new LED lights that run on DC but use the AC color convention. Why?
At least on my bus, all of my 120v runs are in plastic conduit and only my 12v wires are running in the open-so the black wire difference isn't there.
The Military generators every wire is white what a treat to figure those out if the printed number is not readable,the NJT Eagles were all white wires too :-\
I too have felt with the all white military generator wires. It left me scratching my head and I didn't even want to touch it.
3m wire marker tapes...nest $$'s you'll ever spend in this realm.
(https://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/369001P/3mtm-scotchcodetm-wire-marker-tape-refill-rolls-09404.jpg)
I may have to look on Amazon for a couple of those wire markers..
Gripe acknowledged. While I did comply religiously with the norm for the 120v side of my electrical system, the 12v side is a different story. Free (not stolen) is good and if I had found enough yellow wire to do the entire 12v system I'd have been "golden". As it is, the following quote from my "operaters manual" says it all.
"It should be pointed out that no attempt was made to match wire colors in any 12 volt circuit and wire color will vary repeatedly in several circuits. The use of a volt meter and a continuity tester will make tracing circuits a fairly simple task."
I have my fire resistant suit on so go ahead and flame away! ;D Jack
Quote from: DominicM on May 25, 2018, 04:57:56 PM
I may have to look on Amazon for a couple of those wire markers..
Thomas and Betts and Panduit wire markers are decent ones too.
(https://files.bgbsupply.com/bgbsupply-files/panduit/HappPCMB-BK-o.jpg)
I prefer sets that are 0 thru 9. you can make #'s up in the hundreds...or thousands... :)
I really like that tip 👍, in some projects it would be a new thing using the numbers above 9.
Unfortunately I have used all my rolls of stickers. Luckily found some from my dads stash and used for recent projects. The tablets do last quite awhile, using both rolls and tablet I might lean to the tablet for better choice. They may have lettering included that my rolls didnt, its a toss up!
Good day
Floyd
Quote from: oltrunt on May 25, 2018, 06:39:13 PM
Gripe acknowledged. While I did comply religiously with the norm for the 120v side of my electrical system, the 12v side is a different story. Free (not stolen) is good and if I had found enough yellow wire to do the entire 12v system I'd have been "golden". As it is, the following quote from my "operaters manual" says it all.
"It should be pointed out that no attempt was made to match wire colors in any 12 volt circuit and wire color will vary repeatedly in several circuits. The use of a volt meter and a continuity tester will make tracing circuits a fairly simple task."
I have my fire resistant suit on so go ahead and flame away! ;D Jack
;D ;D
The tape markers are definitely a good idea, but the most durable wire markers I ever saw were metal ones that were crimped on the wires of a Diamond Reo truck I had. I think the earlier Autocars and Peterbuilts did as well. For a while, all three shared the same cab sheet metal.
those 3m ones on rolls look nice, but a little on the expensive side. i wonder if they will dry out after 5 to 10+ years on the roll like regular masking tape.
Quote from: chessie4905 on May 26, 2018, 06:53:29 PM
those 3m ones on rolls look nice, but a little on the expensive side. i wonder if they will dry out after 5 to 10+ years on the roll like regular masking tape.
nope.
mine are fine.
colors
numbers
3M
Panduit
and T&B
been frozen
in Death Valley
still intact,
on the rolls
on the pages
and on the wires.
none of what i have are less than 14 years old
many were old when i got them
some i bought
and some were "residue"
if it was in the "we've billed those out" pile...
they were mine
if i got to them first
snooze you lose :)
I function in my sleep.
good to know, thanks
Quote from: chessie4905 on May 27, 2018, 03:49:55 AM
good to know, thanks
but you're right, they are not cheap.
with the 3M's u learn quickly that 3-4 digits will cover the circumference of 12 ga. and 3 digits for smaller...and then where to start the adhesion so the number sits where you want it, (saves $$) if you are OCD in that regard.
rewiring chopped spaghetti is an OCD endeavor IMO, or don't :) (find someone who is :) )