We may be in the market for a bus upgrade. Currently driving an MCI 96a3. We love it but for the next 5 to 10 years we thought we might want to do it in a little more style.
We're looking at Prevost coaches ranging from 1995 to 2000. Is there much difference aside from the obvious appearance between the XL and the H-3 series?
Someone said that there is an independent front end suspension upgrade on newer coaches that is very desirable.
Also which of the Series 60s is better? I have heard that the ones with fewer EPA devices are superior. Your input would be appreciated as always!
Mike in GA
The IFS on Prevost came out in late 1996 if they have been upgrade it is ok if not you can spend 10K on one in a hurry,they made improvements in 2000 ,but really didn't get all the bugs out till 2003 now they are solid.Check the recalls and be sure they were done,anything below 2000 will have a pre EGR series 60 a +
Here's a little info... More searching should help also. I only looked at this one.
http://forum.prevostownersgroup.com/archive/index.php/t-4841.html (http://forum.prevostownersgroup.com/archive/index.php/t-4841.html)
Prevosts do have a complex air system they use a lot of Norgren valves everywhere
If your heart is set on a Prevost, great, it is a really good coach.
But here is my biased opinion:
I have been driving MCIs for 45 years. They always have been a really solid bus. Relatively simple to work on and maintain. Just a good bus, period.
I have driven Prevost Le Mirages, XLs, and H3s from the 90s to 2017s, and an 18 this summer.
Prevost has improved steadily over the years. The H3 is a great luxury coach. Especially with the IFS. Nice smooth ride. But, as Clifford points out, it can get expensive to maintain. Prevost buses are more complex in all their systems: French, lol. So it makes them harder to maintain.
Prevost have always been less solid than MCIs. Even the brand new 17s and 18s rattle in the roof, windshield and door area when the pavement is rough. MCIs not nearly as much.
Prevost buses are over-rated. I think it comes from the fact that Prevost really pushes their motor home and entertainer shells. They do a great marketing job at that. Something that MCI has given up years ago. The newer Prevost motor homes and entertainers undeniably look good and sharp and classy, but don't be swayed by looks only.
Given a Prevost or an MCI, I would take the MCI any day...
The 12.7 liter S60, pre EGR, with the 6 speed Allison B500, is a great power train. I also prefer Jakes rather than a transmission retarder that puts out a lot of heat.
JC
The German made Knorr/Bremse brake system on those models are a great brakes but WOW when parts are needed you have to sell the farm
Focus on '99-'01. They will have the DDEC IV engine, pre EGR and much better. Also in late '98 Prevost came out with two nice upgrades, the new instrument panel and the duel Bosch alternators. Both much preferred. Also have the Knorr Bremse disc brakes, the best out there. Get all the manuals and stay in contact with your regional service manager. Prevost has the best service in the industry. IFS has already been discussed. When the XLII shell coaches came out they had siding issues, if you go for one make sure the siding issues have been corrected (adhesives failed under the polished stainless). Differences between the H and XL is obvious. Plan on replacing all the Norgren valves and push on fittings right off the bat. I have owned and operated both as well as MCI. In today's market you should be able to find a low milage 99-01 for a low price. Suggest you peruse Prevost Community for a while before deciding. HTH
Style?
cough cough...
The superior coach manufacturer on the continent won't give the converters extended credit for their shells,
The inferior coach manufacturer gives 'em the coach and says pay me when you can...
And then there was Eagle...
Follow the money, it will set you free?
happy coaching!
buswarrior
I like Newells better. I think they are less expensive and it seems a lot of the Prevost don't have slides. You can get a 2-3 slide Newell around 99-00 for 100-120k.
Prevosts sure are pretty though. I'm a sucker for polished aluminum siding.
Hello, I assume you are wanting a completed conversion rather than a shell. A converted H3 is tall and I am frequently driving in the middle of the road to avoid tree damage. The tall bays are very nice when you need to work on systems (you can sit upright without hitting your head). If I am not mistaken the GVW on the H3 is significantly higher than other shells. I had a guy freaking out on my methods for doing a conversion. He said I would be way overweight. I am converting a H3-41 and the GVW on a 41 is the same GVW as a 45. I am actually a long way from the weight limit. I started converting a MCI 102C3 and switched to a early '98 H3. Haul that dinosaur home, put it in your driveway and it will start eating your money!
I would take a used Newell anyday. It is the only motorhome manufacturer making the complete motorhome from the ground up.
It'll never be considered in the class with the Prevost, even if they are real nice. Many love Bluebirds too. I guess it really depends on your tastes.
Quote from: chessie4905 on February 11, 2018, 12:05:35 PM
It'll never be considered in the class with the Prevost, even if they are real nice. Many love Bluebirds too. I guess it really depends on your tastes.
All depends on the dollar amount there are so many high end conversions on the market now it is almost like used car dealers
In the end, it is like Ford versus Chevy, they are all as good or as bad as the others, they all need maintenance and repairs, and people in old VW vans, schoolies, and Winnebagos have just as much fun as we have. It really is a matter of personal preference.
I still maintain that Prevosts are over-rated ;)
In the commercial charter business, a bus company has to have some Prevosts, because some tour companies demand them, because they are perceived as better, higher class. Although a MCI J4500 is as good, or better in some respects, like quieter with the Cummins ISX, and rides better with the new ZF independent front suspension. Bus drivers nowadays are about equally divided on their preference between the two brands.
Sorry, this is off topic since the OP was asking about years 1995 to 2000. I would look at MCI D3, or DL3 for those years. I think they generally have held up better than Prevost cars of the same vintage.
JC
He didn't state whether he was looking for a shell of already converted. If already converted, it won't matter which one holds up better as the mileage most likely won't be in the hundreds of thousands of miles. Is the MCI owner's group as big as the Prevost group? Just curious on this question.
MCI only sells seated buses now they have a tough time keeping up with commuter bus market,but converters like Marathon and Vantre did convert MCI's the web master here Phil Lyons has a nice MCI converted by Vantre.MCI left the market shorty after they closed Custom Coach which they owned
I LOVE my Newell, you really should include them in your search.
Each one is custom built per the buyer's specifications. You just need to find one whose original owner has the same taste as you. ;D
Wanderlodge is also a great coach.
Don't limit yourself too early in the search!
Thanks for the input so far. Just to clarify, I am interested in a professionally converted coach, not a shell.
I have looked at some Newells, and I admit they are very well built. Having had 20 years in a MCI with a conventional bus door, I am a little put off by Newell's center entrance.
And there's just something about a Prevost...
Bingo!
I have zero experience with anything other than a Prevost, but since 1990 I have owned 3 of them, all professional conversions. All I can say is they are complex and getting more complex but the reliability has been very good and nothing I own or have ever owned has factory support like I get with my coaches, starting with extensive on-line manuals, parts ordering, and system schematics plus support at service centers or phone access.
As good as service is however, it is expensive making me glad I do all my own work.
Quote from: Mike in GA on February 12, 2018, 07:11:03 AM
Thanks for the input so far. Just to clarify, I am interested in a professionally converted coach, not a shell.
I have looked at some Newells, and I admit they are very well built. Having had 20 years in a MCI with a conventional bus door, I am a little put off by Newell's center entrance.
And there's just something about a Prevost...
All Newells are not mid entry,I would love to have one with the 650 hp C-15 Cat engine I will say the Newell doesn't ride as good as a Prevost
How extensive is the used Prevost parts market, the places to go when not wanting to pay the full retail mfg. prices? How old does a Prevost need to be before searching secondary parts markets makes sense?
Quote from: windtrader on February 12, 2018, 06:45:15 PM
How extensive is the used Prevost parts market, the places to go when not wanting to pay the full retail mfg. prices? How old does a Prevost need to be before searching secondary parts markets makes sense?
Plenty of parts for Prevost MCI even sell Prevost parts,for years Prevost was the only bus manufacture that would have the Prevost parts number and the manufacture of that part their name and parts number that was neat you could shop around.lol you shop for parts when they are almost new like any other bus,you set down and take a deep breath when buying a fan clutch WOW almost 4 grand new and they go bad
Quote from: luvrbus on February 12, 2018, 07:16:36 PM
Plenty of parts for Prevost MCI even sell Prevost parts,for years Prevost was the only bus manufacture that would have the Prevost parts number and the manufacture of that part their name and parts number that was neat you could shop around.lol you shop for parts when they are almost new like any other bus,you set down and take a deep breath when buying a fan clutch WOW almost 4 grand new and they go bad
Two things I have found about Prevost parts.First you may be amazed by how cheap the part is second you maybe amazed by how expensive the part is (this is far more often the case)
They are cheap on windshields on the older models lol but don't buy the gasket, lol I helped a friend change his Prevost installed slide gasket that is a heart stopper for sure
I have a 91 seated Prevost coach that I raised and am close to finishing the conversion on. I have ordered parts directly from Prevost for several reasons, 1. when I call them and give them M 1839, they pull up that coach in their computer and they can look at exactly what was put on that coach in Jan 1991. There has been no guessing if the part is right or wrong. When there are circumstances of more than one replacement option available now, they email me pictures of the options and I can then tell them which one will work better for me. 2. Their parts prices have been very good with only one exception. There is a wiring harness in the front drivers ac/heat console that was cut by me when I sold the OTR ac. When I did it I didn't think a 1 foot harness of 10 wires would be very expensive to replace. Wrong!. That one harness was $863. I told the parts gal she was nuts! She agreed the part was way to high (not that she was nuts) and asked her pricing dept to re-check the price. They came back that it should be higher because of their cost. She called me back and told me the results. I told her to forget it. She agreed and in exchange, sent me an email with the proper wiring for the harness. I just had to make my own based on the diagram she emailed. It works well and was under $30. She didn't have to do that but did because she agreed the part was to high. She stated that of all the parts prices, the wiring harnesses seem to be the most crazy pricing. That is the one and only time the part was to high in my mind and I have ordered new glass (they replaced it 3 times for free since the shipping companies made it into spaghetti 3 times, they even shipped it overnight the last time because it had taken close to a month already and I hadn't gotten the part I wanted because of the shipping snafus). As to reliable, I cannot speak since I haven't had my bus out for a run yet but soon. As to reliable parts people, I know good customer service when I see it and I can say the parts people have been great. As to engineers, I contacted them in Canada to see about slide outs for my coach. They offered, for $1200, to design slide outs for my 91 coach that I could use to build my own slides. Maybe that's a service other bus manufacturers would offer, I don't know. BTW, I have owned 2 Newells and I live only 90 miles from the factory. I haven't gotten the kind of service from them that Prevost offers but I like them both and have nothing bad to say about either one.
HTH
Rob
91 Prevost XL40
Missouri
Prevost parts and phone tech are great but if you don't have a fleet account their service centers really suck price wise and service wise they can screw up anything.
I have a good friend that takes his 2010 Prevost to Volvo Truck centers now because of the poor service and cost at the Prevost Service centers.lol he has a series 60 engine and Prevost won't touch it,a bunch of poor sports I guess.
Gary has had a ton of problems with his Prevost and he purchased it new but it seems to be doing ok for now except the fuel tank recall Volvo caught his before the recall how in the hell a 200gal + fuel tank can fall off a bus is beyond me,his was one of the 3000+ Prevost recalled for a friggn fuel tank falling off going down the highway
Quote from: Skykingrob on February 13, 2018, 10:18:44 AM
I have a 91 seated Prevost coach that I raised and am close to finishing the conversion on. I have ordered parts directly from Prevost for several reasons, 1. when I call them and give them M 1839, they pull up that coach in their computer and they can look at exactly what was put on that coach in Jan 1991. There has been no guessing if the part is right or wrong. When there are circumstances of more than one replacement option available now, they email me pictures of the options and I can then tell them which one will work better for me. 2. Their parts prices have been very good with only one exception. There is a wiring harness in the front drivers ac/heat console that was cut by me when I sold the OTR ac. When I did it I didn't think a 1 foot harness of 10 wires would be very expensive to replace. Wrong!. That one harness was $863. I told the parts gal she was nuts! She agreed the part was way to high (not that she was nuts) and asked her pricing dept to re-check the price. They came back that it should be higher because of their cost. She called me back and told me the results. I told her to forget it. She agreed and in exchange, sent me an email with the proper wiring for the harness. I just had to make my own based on the diagram she emailed. It works well and was under $30. She didn't have to do that but did because she agreed the part was to high. She stated that of all the parts prices, the wiring harnesses seem to be the most crazy pricing. That is the one and only time the part was to high in my mind and I have ordered new glass (they replaced it 3 times for free since the shipping companies made it into spaghetti 3 times, they even shipped it overnight the last time because it had taken close to a month already and I hadn't gotten the part I wanted because of the shipping snafus). As to reliable, I cannot speak since I haven't had my bus out for a run yet but soon. As to reliable parts people, I know good customer service when I see it and I can say the parts people have been great. As to engineers, I contacted them in Canada to see about slide outs for my coach. They offered, for $1200, to design slide outs for my 91 coach that I could use to build my own slides. Maybe that's a service other bus manufacturers would offer, I don't know. BTW, I have owned 2 Newells and I live only 90 miles from the factory. I haven't gotten the kind of service from them that Prevost offers but I like them both and have nothing bad to say about either one.
HTH
Rob
91 Prevost XL40
Missouri
I was going to replace the safety catches on the bin doors on my 93/94 .This is a "j"hook about three or four inches long .I figured five bucks ea would have been highway robbery.Would you believe thirty eight dollars each??
Fixing to have my 1991 XL in a Prevost Service Center here in Texas for a AC r&r and already know it's gonna cost a bundle. You try to fix what you can but some things are a killer at the service shops. These ain't no chevy or ford cars by a long shot.
Cars are for end users.
Buses are for revenue generation.
Parts are priced accordingly. They are going to get their cut, on those items which they can.
Capitalism. Do we want it any other way?
Happy coaching!
Buswarrior
The only draw backs that I have found with the Prevost are those rounded sides and windows .This really does limit your cabinet space .I have to keep safety bars on my medicine cabinet to keep it from unloading every time I open it .Then again all that glass makes these things a bear to cool and heat ,especially with the raised roof's.I have had a lot more problems with Country Coaches so called engineering than I have had with the Prevost systems.
You need to buy a newer one then, maybe 2010 to 2013 with squared top corners. Lol
Quote from: chessie4905 on February 14, 2018, 06:57:05 AM
You need to buy a newer one then, maybe 2010 to 2013 with squared top corners. Lol
If only I could be waiting at the dock when my ship comes in instead of being at the airport ,lol.
My ship came in, but it was a matchbox ship. We had to secure items in our 4104 to keep them from coming out when opening cupboard doors. Pretty much sop for motorhoming.