My 64 bus is down. Was misfiring and running rough at higher loads. Got progressively worse until it no longer idled. Runs rough. I wonder if there's any fuel left. Or if the pump is non op. No friggin gauges. Broke down on the way to get fuel. Any help appreciated! :-[
I seriously doubt it's out of fuel: the generator runs which draws from the same tank
First order of business is: check the fuel filters,<<<Dan
Roger that. Checking. I need to get out of traffic first
The fuel filter was changed in October and I haven't done many miles since-maybe 1000. Still at the side of road so don't want to start taking things a part here. I knocked the filter a few times. Police came- were pretty helpful. Put some flares up. Illinois police have usually been dead helpful to me. Coach net said they would dispatch a tow. Had my fist visitor- a local guy. Seemed mellow. Asked what happened. Told him. He seemed drunk. At the end he asked if I smoked weed lmao. I said not recently. Weird night
Hi Dreadnaught, on my 5A 8V71 I still had the original canister oil filters, one with the original sock style. I had just changed all the filters. When filled up with 20% biodiesel in Barstow, CA. Engine ran rough and got progressively worse. When I drove to Cliffords place he discovered I had only 6psi fuel pressure, on the new, now clogged filters. lvmci...
Lvmci that's useful. I'm thinking that's a likely culprit. The casing looks old with what looks like a wing nut-esque fastener. It's probably the same as yours-an old sock style. I left a load of my tools in my escalade. May have to buy some!
Ok I'm getting more and more of a feeling it's the fuel filter. After being sat here a while- it just started up and idled. As if the crap in the filter had settled or something
Are you still out of commission? I'm in Zion if I can help.
Ed
Inspect fuel tank for debris?
A simple computer camera on a USB leash and a light will let you peer all around inside, if you don't have a dedicated device.
Your descriptions don't suggest a lurking overheat and engine seizure...?
Temp gauge/Hot engine circuit functioning?
happy coaching!
buswarrior
Most likely fuel filters. You can have them plug up quickly with old or little driving for a while, or unclean tank. I would recommend you change your filters out to spin ons when you can. Then when you have it happen the next time, you can unscrew filter and see if it is not full, indicating air or restriction. Always carry about 1 or 2 gallons of fresh fuel to refill before starting. Also, a priming pump is nice to eliminate pre-filling and spilling.
Carry spare filters the 20% bio fuel sold today causes lot of filter plugging on the old 2 filter systems ? did you last fill at Love's.Now days the Fuel/Pro is the way to go with the crappy fuel sold JMO
I once had a diesel tractor brought to its knees by a colony of tiny spiders. They had set up home in the upper portion of the fuel tank above the level of the fuel. As they died off, they formed a floating mat of dead spiders, sort of like a giant sponge. When the fuel level dropped, every time I went up or down a hill they got suctioned to the fuel intake screen and stayed there as long as the engine was able to run. First it would sputter, eventually it would die. Once the engine died, it took about 15 minutes for the mass to release from the screen and float away. I was then able to restart and carry on.
This mess took two years and countless dollars trying to find. It wasn't until the shop disassembled the tractor to replace the fuel intake inside the tank that they discovered this. I'm told that the mechanics took a few minutes to actually figure out what this floating glob was, as they'd never seen it before.
So, long story short, sometimes these things can have surprising causes. I'm not suggesting you've got spiders in the tank, but the fact that it started again might indicate it's time to also check out what's floating around inside your tank. Would be hard to conceive of a piece of debris getting in there over the years.
Once you get out of this situation, change your filter setup to a Detroit Diesel single fuel processor. Then you will have a visual fuel bowl where you can see the status of your filter, and you can easily drain and refill it after changing the filter. All it takes is one bad load of fuel from a low-volume fuel point to jam things up, and bio-diesel content does not help.
Quote from: eddieboy on July 04, 2017, 05:37:51 AM
Are you still out of commission? I'm in Zion if I can help.
Ed
I expired in Zion last night. After a little time. The bus ran. By the time the tow truck got here the bus ran fine. I made it to the truck stop- filled up with more diesel and added some cleaner. I've been sleeping in the cabin but will check again today. I was going to see if JX peterbilt could help.
Quote from: buswarrior on July 04, 2017, 05:48:23 AM
Inspect fuel tank for debris?
A simple computer camera on a USB leash and a light will let you peer all around inside, if you don't have a dedicated device.
Your descriptions don't suggest a lurking overheat and engine seizure...?
Temp gauge/Hot engine circuit functioning?
happy coaching!
buswarrior
I will check for debris.
The bus has been running at a good low temp- around 160-185 deg. When it wouldn't fire it would turn over- splutter- almost fire and/or idle very rough before stalling again. I haven't tried to start it again this morning but will do once I've had some breakfast.
Quote from: luvrbus on July 04, 2017, 06:09:57 AM
Carry spare filters the 20% bio fuel sold today causes lot of filter plugging on the old 2 filter systems ? did you last fill at Love's.Now days the Fuel/Pro is the way to go with the crappy fuel sold JMO
What is fuel pro?
How easy is it to change the filter system?
http://www.davco.com/FP382.htm (http://www.davco.com/FP382.htm)
Dreadnought, my coach came with a fp380. It's a breeze to change. Put a 90 degree ball valve on the inlet. Install it where you can have clearance for a gallon size catch pan and clear access to the top to refill from a 1 gal diesel can and you should be able to change the filter in about 5 mins. WIX replacement filters can be found in stock at local auto parts stores.
After you get this snafu sorted out and you are safely home, you could install a fuel filter restriction gauge (Racor makes one) on the output side of the primary filter, and a fuel pressure gauge on the inlet side of the secondary filter. This way you'll know if the primary filter is getting blocked, or if the pump is worn or not working right. An electric fuel priming pump plumbed in parallel to the main fuel line will also help you prime filters and push any air through the engine.
John
Quote from: J_E on July 04, 2017, 01:20:22 PM
Dreadnought, my coach came with a fp380. It's a breeze to change. Put a 90 degree ball valve on the inlet. Install it where you can have clearance for a gallon size catch pan and clear access to the top to refill from a 1 gal diesel can and you should be able to change the filter in about 5 mins. WIX replacement filters can be found in stock at local auto parts stores.
Thanks- am looking into this. Have you ever had any issues with air getting introduced into the system with the fp380 at all?
Quote from: Iceni John on July 04, 2017, 01:35:42 PM
After you get this snafu sorted out and you are safely home, you could install a fuel filter restriction gauge (Racor makes one) on the output side of the primary filter, and a fuel pressure gauge on the inlet side of the secondary filter. This way you'll know if the primary filter is getting blocked, or if the pump is worn or not working right. An electric fuel priming pump plumbed in parallel to the main fuel line will also help you prime filters and push any air through the engine.
John
That's a great idea! I'll probably need advice help- setting the electric fuel priming pump set up.
I've made it to Gary Indiana so far, no problems. I'm taking a little breather. The problem will rear its head again I reckon but not if I make it home first and take the above precautions. Thanks everyone!
Quote from: Dreadnought on July 04, 2017, 04:43:05 PM
Thanks- am looking into this. Have you ever had any issues with air getting introduced into the system with the fp380 at all?
I'll preface this by saying that I've only changed the filter on it once, but did get a little air into the system that could have been avoided.
The bottom of the housing has a drain valve that is also capped. When I tried to remove the cap, I ended up pulling the entire valve since the cap was on tighter then the valve and I only had one crescent wrench (all 16ths) and didn't want to take a pair of vice grips after the cap. I ended up getting about a half gallon of fuel out of it before I got the valve re-threaded, which was about a quart more than I needed to drain. I replaced the filter and the two or three O-rings that came with the filter. Once I got the lock ring for the glass bowl about an 1/8th to a 1/4 turn past hand tight, I refilled the glass bowl using a funnel and a 1 gallon fuel can I filled specifically for this purpose. She fired up normally, but about 5 secs later she sputtered a bit as the air worked through. I started the engine from the driver's seat, and before I could get out of the bus and back to the engine bay, the sputtering had begun and cleared. In the 900 or so miles since then, I have not had any fuel issues.
We swapped places :) drove yesterday from port huron Michigan to our resting place tonight in Princeton ILL. Headed to Hartford IA today :) happy trails.
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Quote from: Scott & Heather on July 06, 2017, 04:14:16 AM
We swapped places :) drove yesterday from port huron Michigan to our resting place tonight in Princeton ILL. Headed to Hartford IA today :) happy trails.
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Thanks- I'm back at home camp now in Indiana. Am looking into filter solutions and aux electric priming pumps etc. I had no more problems getting here.
On another note- got new lenses for my clearance lights, new pedal rubber and rear lenses too and got the whole rig washed!
Here the pump and there is also a 24 volt version . Just hook it inline and hookup the positive and the negative to frame. Put a switch on/off and your done. When off no interference it just flows thru it. HTH helps. OReilly's also carry both on line and in store. ;D
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-12V-Universal-Low-Pressure-Electric-Fuel-Pump-With-Installation-Kit-E8016S-/141682055890 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-12V-Universal-Low-Pressure-Electric-Fuel-Pump-With-Installation-Kit-E8016S-/141682055890)
Quote from: Dave5Cs on July 06, 2017, 10:57:25 AMHere the pump and there is also a 24 volt version ...
It says "Gas - Diesel" in the heading but if you click on a diesel engine in the "Compatible" chart, it says "NOT Compatible - Diesel Engine". I wonder??
Buce if you click to next page this is at the bottom. I got one for 12 v and one for 24 v. No problems. Now they are only to prime not to run on although someone on here said they lost their fuel pump and it had enough to get them down the road to get it fixed..... ;D
This pump is designed to replace the OE fuel pump on carburettor equipped cars and trucks
Comes complete with 2 pieces of 8mm barb hose straight fittings and inlet filter unit
Compatible with Petrol, Diesel, Fuel Additives, Bio Diesel, Blended Alcohol Fuels and Racing Fuel Octane Booster Additives
Fits most carburettor equipped cars, vans, light trucks & other applications
FEATURE:
Operation Pressure: 2.5-4.5 psi
Operation Flow: 30 Gallons Per Hour
Hose Size: 5/16"
Quote from: Dave5Cs on July 06, 2017, 04:08:40 PMBuce if you click to next page this is at the bottom. I got one for 12 v and one for 24 v. No problems. ...
Yeah, I thought that they'd probably work OK, but the description was real clunky. Gotta love the fuel pumps for those carburettor-equipped diesels!
I've used a pump like that to prime my 6v92 twice now. I have a whole setup with fuel lines and nozzle just in case I run out of diesel or am changing the fuel filters. It takes all the panic out of losing prime for me.
I met a bus nut who told me that he ran out of fuel one time and had to run a long line up above the roof and funnel it in to get his system primed. Crazy! Get the pump and be ready!
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You might have a fuel pump going bad. They can act up and suddenly start working fine.
--Geoff
P.S. Davco units costs too much. I'm thinking about putting my Racor on that I have had sitting around for the last 12 years.
Thanks for your help guys!
I just bought this
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00PDUFSCM/ref=od_aui_detailpages00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
"Marine Universal Electric Fuel Pump Solenoid ,12 & 24 Volits E8251 ,E8267 ,E8337,marine Low Pressure & Marine Carbureted Complete with Filter"
lets see how it goes when it arrives.