Some may remember me,some not. We had a couple life changing events that redirected our lives. Life has a way of kicking you in the nads without any regrets. It has been a four year long bout but we are through it. The sun does shine on the other side.
So without a big story, we decided to sell old blue. I have a buyer that is interested. I pulled it out of the barn to spit shine it. The generator runs fine, it is just not switching and delivering power. I know the gen is making power as I got hit doing something stupid.
It is a Kubota diesel engine with a Wrico generator.
Check the transfer switch
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Yep, sounds like a transfer relay to me, but without knowing anything about how your electric is set up, that's about as far as I (or anyone else) will be able to diagnose it.
Is the shore power working ? On our Trek the switching is done by the inverter if the friggn house batteries are dead it will not switch over ::) make sure you have a automatic transfer too and not a manual switch
I have narrowed a problem to an area. I sent a pic to the buyer as I had already told him the gen worked fine. It did the last time I used it. So in discussions with him I sent him this picture. I sticuck the camera in there and in reviewing the picture I saw the black discolored area. The wires from the PCB leading to the switch for gen power in, got real hot. In the next post I will put up pics. Oh if I open the switches manually the bus gets power.. So the problem is not the breaker box and not the gen. Its isolated to the switches or PCB.
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I bet a nickel to a pickle I know what happened. During the morning of the flood the contractors came to the house. One of them wired a 50 amp receptacle in my pump house where we moved the bus too as the water was coming up. The gen was running. I would bet the farm he plugged it in with the gen running.
Luvrbus I am glad your chiming in. It does work off of shore power. April before last we got 4 foot of water in the house. We lived in the bus for a week before moving to Bellville with my sister and bro in law. I vomited to work for 6 months waiting for the house to be rebuilt. I stayed in the bus twice a week. It was plugged in the whole time and worked great.
In the first pic there are 3 switches. The left is gen coming in, the middle is shore coming in. The right is power from the switches to the breaker box. The PCB is to the right of the right side switch. I am,fishing this is the culprit as the wires from it got very hot.
Just a long shot, I suppose, but does the generator have a reset switch?
That looks like a homemade switch assembly. I also made my own after the store bought one started humming. But when I made mine, I hooked it up so if the generator was running, plugging into the shore power wouldn't connect saving my generator.
--Geoff
Quote from: Lin on June 04, 2017, 09:55:00 AM
Just a long shot, I suppose, but does the generator have a reset switch?
I'll go look
No reset. When I open the switches and let power from the gen to the bus, I can hear the genset lag as it delivers power. I can hold the switches open but within a minute it stops delivering power. Just to be clear, it's stops providing power while I am manually keeping the switches open.
Are you starting it with anything running(Loads)? If so turn everything( all Loads) off and then start it and after it stays running then start adding loads to it and see if maybe it will stay running. If it stays going then add some heavy loads and run it for at least 2 hours. It likes to stretch its legs each month.
that is a Todd Transfer Switch.
the thing that is burnt is a delay timer that wont allow the transfer until it tastes/sees the proper voltage.
you can by pass it but you need to turn off all of your breakers that are sensitive to low voltage.
i had the same problem...but i have a spare timer.
wish i had another :(
let me search around, i think there might be a source for new timers...
or you might could send it off to that dinosaur boards place and get new made...todd has been out of bizness for a long time
imo...they are/were one of the best transfer switches made :)
used to be able to get them here...
http://www.ecovantageenergy.com/catalog/items/item1422.htm
(http://www.ecovantageenergy.com/catalog/items/item1422.htm)
I bought all my parts from Grainger.
--Geoff
If you are not sure I suggest you call Dick Wright first thing Monday morning and ask him before anything else gets damaged. It is his generator so he will certainly know. http://www.wricointernational.com/ (http://www.wricointernational.com/) ( 5 4 1 ) 7 4 4 - 4 3 3 3 If you email him pix ahead of time this may help. Dick Wright (dick@Riousa.com)
I received a manual with my Isuzu/Leech Neville genset. I had a problem a while back and was able to test the generator head using the test guide in the small manual. It passed all the tests and I figured out it was the engine. I'm sure you could download a manual. Isn't your generator head a Marathon?
--Geoff
You could just pull the cover off the generator and look for a burned part.
Quote from: eagle19952 on June 04, 2017, 03:56:54 PM
that is a Todd Transfer Switch.
the thing that is burnt is a delay timer that wont allow the transfer until it tastes/sees the proper voltage.
you can by pass it but you need to turn off all of your breakers that are sensitive to low voltage.
i had the same problem...but i have a spare timer.
wish i had another :(
let me search around, i think there might be a source for new timers...
or you might could send it off to that dinosaur boards place and get new made...todd has been out of bizness for a long time
imo...they are/were one of the best transfer switches made :)
If Todd made such great transfer switches how come he didn't make them so they would not switch to shore power when the generator was running? I made my own transfer switch and the shore power defeat switch was a simple wire. Oh, and I didn't use plumber's tape.
--Geoff
All good information. I left a Vmail at wrico. I called todd engeneering and they said send the PCB. I have a buyer flying down Friday to leave with the bus Saturday. Ahhhhhhh the pleasures of life.
What happens when the gen is running and somebody plugs in the cord to a 50 amp breaker? The reason I ask is during the flood I moved the bus to the pump house on high ground and had the genset running. The contractor wires in a 50 amp plug at the pump house. I guarantee his dumb @$$ plugged it in while the gen was running. Incidintally they eventually got run off for tryi,g to steal $40,000. That's the kind of people that come slithering after disasters.
I asked my generator manufacturer what happens if shore power is plugged in while the generator is running and he didn't get specific but said "all kind of nasty things can happen" and you have to follow the generator manual to test everything and see what the damage is. So if this is what happened you can pay someone to check it out or buy a good meter and check it yourself. I can tell you which meter you need, a simple multimeter isn't good enough. I have to go out to my service truck and see which meter you need.
--Geoff
Quote from: Geoff on June 04, 2017, 06:44:03 PM
If Todd made such great transfer switches how come he didn't make them so they would not switch to shore power when the generator was running? I made my own transfer switch and the shore power defeat switch was a simple wire. Oh, and I didn't use plumber's tape.
--Geoff
if yours are so much better...why aren't you selling them ? or better yet...giving busnuts a drawing and parts list ? :)
Geoff thank you very much. I have hired a generator mechanic that was recommended by Wrico. His name is Bilob Elder from the north side of Houston, Crosstimbers and Interstate 45.
I turned off all the breakers but the one that runs the blower fan on the remote mounted radiator. I fired the genset up and read 120 for both wires from the genset to the switches. Whole manually holding the switches open It ran fine and produced enough electricity to keep the blower running. I then switched all the breakers on and manually opened the switches again. The engine would lug, it would send electricity through and then the engine lug would stop and it stopped producing electricity. Repeated closeing of the switch produced the same results.
After 20 years my Todd went bad I have a Surge Guard now it takes care of everything even if you fire the generator up while on shore power.My old Todd had breakers built into the relays if you plugged in with the generator running it would just trip the breaker on the relay then shore power or generator power would not work.The board went bad on my Todd
Quote from: wal1809 on June 05, 2017, 11:06:46 AM
Geoff thank you very much. I have hired a generator mechanic that was recommended by Wrico. His name is Bilob Elder from the north side of Houston, Crosstimbers and Interstate 45.
I hope he dosen't charge by the mile if you are still living in the Katy/ Brookshire area that is a little trip
Luvsrbus he is charging a 185 service fee, parts and 100 am hour per labor. He is bringing out a whole new grander box at 250 for the box. This is going to hit a grand easy. It is what it is.
He is charging you for the Houston traffic ;D
Quote from: wal1809 on June 04, 2017, 08:44:06 AM
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This is the old PRDLLAYO PB relay easy to check .Take a insulated screw driver and press the contacts down .If this gets the bus electrified ,then check for power to the coil .If the transfer relay checks faulty head over to Grainger .This relay is about a 30 dollar unit .
Quote from: eagle19952 on June 05, 2017, 10:00:46 AM
if yours are so much better...why aren't you selling them ? or better yet...giving busnuts a drawing and parts list ? :)
I can give you the Grainger part numbers and I have a simple drawing on the inside of the cover plate but I figured out the wiring by just looking at everything. I can't take credit for the parts, it was actually posted on the old MAK board 20+ years ago. Anyone remember JimNH? He was involved.
--Geoff
Quote from: Geoff on June 05, 2017, 08:40:19 PM
I can give you the Grainger part numbers and I have a simple drawing on the inside of the cover plate but I figured out the wiring by just looking at everything. I can't take credit for the parts, it was actually posted on the old MAK board 20+ years ago. Anyone remember JimNH? He was involved.
--Geoff
i'd be interested :)
Sounds like you may have this figured out.
Mine quit last year and it was the controller inside the box on the generator.
It's a Kubota proprietary part, meaning not available from anyone else.
Seems it was over $400 plus shipping, which they were proud of too.
Hopefully, yours will be a cheaper fix.
Quote from: luvrbus on June 05, 2017, 03:10:00 PM
He is charging you for the Houston traffic ;D
I am a country boy. I can't stand going through the big city. I don't blame him,one bit and don't begrudge the man for charging the 185. Hopefully he is not on this forum because i would double that charge.
I train dogs on the side. People ask me to come to their house for private sessions. I tell them yes but my house calls are 1500 bucks. I do that just so I don't have to drive to them, they have to come to me.
I am glad the service guy talked me into just replacing the whole transfer switch box. I could have overnighted the printed circuit board to be fixed and they overnighted back for nearly the same money as a brand new box and switches. I think I'm skating by under $1,000. Not bad for having a problem off my plate knowing the buyer is going to have a good product to drive home.
Inquiring mind want's to know------- I can see where you would need 2 relays on this .These are 30 amp relays so you would need one for each side of your 240V line but where does the third relay come into play???
Quote from: wal1809 on June 06, 2017, 08:13:15 AM
I am glad the service guy talked me into just replacing the whole transfer switch box. I could have overnighted the printed circuit board to be fixed and they overnighted back for nearly the same money as a brand new box and switches. I think I'm skating by under $1,000. Not bad for having a problem off my plate knowing the buyer is going to have a good product to drive home.
What new transfer switch did he install ?
I'm not sure what brand transfer it was about half the size that I had in there. I will look and see if there is a brand name on the box when I get to the house. I let it run for about 2 hours with all of the appliances air conditioners Etc turned on. That never missed a lick for those two hours.
You can by these xfer switches at camper world or online. They are in sale online right now for 148 plus shipping. I paid $225 through him. I couldn't drive to camper world or have it shipped here and save much money. I am dern glad to have found this mechanic. His number is going into the file. The whole ordeal was a telephone call and $750. I didn't want to spend it but sometimes you do what you don't want to do.
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I have pictures of the transfer switch I made and has worked flawlessly for over 20 years of constant use. Unfortunately I used my smartphone to take several pictures and I can't seem to separate the pictures so I can post them. I have a new topic called "Make your own transfer switch" with my email address if anyone can help me out.
--Geoff
looks like a workable solution: anyone can convert to a parts list and drawing/diagram/schematic ?
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